Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Just in case you all think I'm just an armchair modeller and habitual forum lounger, here's what I've been up to today. and a closer view of what I'm trying to achieve... properly railroady looking turnouts - #8s, code 83, with manganese insert frogs. I hate filing rail though, so the point blades are a faff. Pretty ain't they? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 They surely are... You've reminded me I need to order one of those self-guarding frogs, they're now on the website... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNER4479 Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Good to see you out of the armchair Look forward to seeing some trains running over 'em! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted February 15, 2013 Author Share Posted February 15, 2013 I was tidying away and found an intriguing little baggy with what looked like point blades inside... had a quick look and, d'oh! Found a set of properly machined 16' 6'' point blades... how did I forget about them? To quote from the Proto87 Stores website 'ALL THE STORES MODEL POINTS ARE PROPERLY THREE-WAY PLANED, WITH AN UNDERCUT, TO CLEAR THE STOCK RAIL BASE, EVEN ON THE SMALLEST RAIL SIZES. IT IS NOT NECESSARY TO FILE AWAY THE STOCK RAIL BASE AT ALL TO FIT AND USE THESE POINTS' Well, at least I hadn't soldered anything. Will be dismantling the bar steward turnouts and starting again. One step forwards, two steps backwards. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
highpeak Posted February 23, 2013 Share Posted February 23, 2013 I assume you used that little bottle of CA to attach the rail? I ask because I am contemplating using the CV products as opposed to the old-fashioned wood and overscale spikes, but I am not very keen on the glues recommended. They are pretty messy and I seem pretty sensitive to the fumes (how on earth anybody gets a kick out of smelling glue is beyond me). Pliobond didn't produce a very strong bond, it was quite easy to remove the rail. Barge/MEK seemed stronger but I find the MEK fumes pretty bad. CA gel produces a good bond, but I have read concerns about its inability to cope with expansion/contraction of the rail, which presumably is where the glues like pliobond and barge have an advantage. There is an interesting thread on using CV tie bases in a hybrid manner at http://siskiyou-railfan.net/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?5125.0 I noticed the author decided against relying on adhesives. This thread http://www.the-gauge.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=2965 also explores various options for track construction, mostly using CV bases. The detail molded in the CV ties is pretty good, and your turnout is a lot more convincing than most of the RTR variety. My concerns are with the long-term reliability of a glued assembly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted February 26, 2013 Share Posted February 26, 2013 I've just ordered a CVT kit of a #8 turnout (which is the minimum specified around here even on shortlines). I'll let you know how I get on. I don't have any jigs, filing aids etc., and have no intention of buying any! Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted February 27, 2013 Author Share Posted February 27, 2013 The only thing I would say about the CVT kit is that it's a bit short of lead if you're using 16'6" switch blades (which you should be for anything more than a #8 I have a cunning plan to deal with that, pictures may appear over the weekend if the girls go up to town for the day, and I get the modelling bench out. The beauty of the CVT kit is that no jigs are necessary. Also, using Details West cast frogs means you don't need to file them up from rail (which doesn't look very realistic, no matter what the hand-laid nazis say) and using P87 Stores 3-way machined blades means you don't need to file the blades or the stock rails - again, you shouldn't anyway as the real RRs don't. For me, the only area that no-one has a decent solution for as yet is tiebars and throw bars, and I suspect that's only a matter of time. Regarding the CA - one of my modelling chums is also intolerant of the fumes, although I seem unfazed by them. I'd not considered rail expansion - would it really be much of a problem? The temperature range in my house isn't that great, and I can't imagine a 10 inch piece of N/S rail expands that much. I use the medium thickness glue - the thin one is completely uncontrollable. I get an old match, whittle it into a point and apply the CA to the pointy end from the bottle, and then apply it to the thing to be glued with the pointy match end. I use a magnifier on one of those hands free stands to help see what I'm doing. I tried MEK once, and it failed to glue anything at all. No idea why, as it comes highly recommended. Not tried barge, don't know where to get hold of it. I use CA because I've used it a lot on a wide range of things, including model planes, scratchbuilt styrene rolling stock, and so on. It works for me, although I do spend the next day or two peeling the stuff off my finger tips. Anyway, here's a picture showing a real 3-way machined switch blade, showing why for me at least, filing the blades (or the stupid Peco half-rail) just doesn't look right. There's a lot of engineering on display here, and I'd like my model track to reflect this. The P87 ones match this pretty closely, pictures later. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Good Dr. G-F! I already found the Details West frogs - but where on the P87 Stores are the "3 way machined blades" listed by themselves? I'm looking for Code 70 for the #8........ Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNER4479 Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Just been sent the attached. Kinda down the opposite end of the track evolutionary scale! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 I've seen similar on the old Reading line. If you're ever in New Hope PA you can see a steel version at the join where the rail changes weight (which it does in the above photo). Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
highpeak Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 I would imagine the expansion issue would depend a lot on where the layout was kept. In my case it would be in a room where the temperature doesn't really vary that much (no direct sunlight, air conditioning keeps it cool in summer, heat isn't very effective in winter) so I don't anticipate it being much of an issue. Barge is hard to find. I eventually found some at the local cobbler's shop (a rare survivor in the US), and it seemed to work reasonably well when mixed with MEK. But the smell was unbearable, I will have to work out how to ventilate the work area and find a face mask. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted February 27, 2013 Author Share Posted February 27, 2013 Good Dr. G-F! I already found the Details West frogs - but where on the P87 Stores are the "3 way machined blades" listed by themselves? I'm looking for Code 70 for the #8........ Best, Pete. Pete, have a look here scroll down the page past the pictures of the turnout components and its the second down white table headed 'Ultimate 3-way CNC Planed Points'. Note that you have three options to select (scale, rail code, point length angle) as well as the quantity. You'll want 6 FT 6 in for your #8s. His tiebar detailing kits look the business too... but I've not attempted them yet Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grovenor Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Anyway, here's a picture showing a real 3-way machined switch blade, I don't know if those are meant to be a pair for the same switch but the two switches are distinctly different. Over here we seem to manage with much less in the way of bolt on strengthening strips but the latest designs use the special UIC profile for switch blades which has a completelt different profile from the normal rail. I see a large self checking frog in the background of your pic as well. Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Grant 4472 Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 I really enjoy making CV turnouts. I accidentally got some code 70 ones, but found that Peco code 75 rail is a perfect match. Cue hours of fun swapping over code 75 and code 83 rail in lengths of flexi-track...the code 83 with British-style sleepers is perfect for fiddle yards as it is more durable than the code 83 as bought Jon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 I tend to draw the line at "tiebar detailing" - my stubby , callous covered, guitar playing, finger tips leave me no option on the fiddly-bits............ Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 It's not all cast crossings or frogs in the US. Here is one on the former Reading Railroad in PA: Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jukebox Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Dr.G-F; Could you possibly post a photo of the bottle/tube of Barge Cement you found, so I've an idea what to look for - I have a couple of CVT kits, but have not had a go at them until I find myself some of the aforementioned adhesive. Thanks! Scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted February 28, 2013 Author Share Posted February 28, 2013 Scott, I haven't found Barge in the UK and google only gives US suppliers... I'm using medium CA, sorry! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jukebox Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Ah, yes... and clot-head here did see that just now, in the photo in your 1st post! Sorry. But thanks anyway! That'll each me to read the words "barge cement" and go running to the reply button... (I'm off to the US shortly, and in reading up about Barge Cement, I am led to believe that "new" formulations arent anywhere near as durable as "the old stuff" now all the really-good-to-make-stick-but-possibly-bad-for-your-health things have been removed from the formula, and was hoping for a lead on which is which...) Cheers Scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
highpeak Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 The new Barge comes in blue tubes, I think the old stuff was in yellow (anyway, in not blue). Here in CT none of the big box hardware stores carry it, neither does either of the local smaller outfits (one an Ace franchise, the other I think True Value). In the end I got some from the shoe repair shop. Tandy Leather centres also appear to carry it. The new formula seems to work OK, the bond I got on a test piece seemed pretty good as did the bond with gel type CA. Other contact adhesives such as goop or pliobond were not very strong. The next issue is getting hold of bulk supplies of MEK. The local hardware store had never heard of the stuff, and the big box stores now carry MEK Substitute, with no indication as to exactly what it is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Isn't MEK used by US Plumbers to cement PVC pipe together? It's that pink stuff you see on pipes, I think. If not then that "glue" would be suitable..... Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted February 28, 2013 Author Share Posted February 28, 2013 The MEK I have is a colourless watery liquid - it dissolves styrene so it's supposed to weld stuff together. I found it to be completely useless, and the bottle sits unused in my pile of other expensive useless bits of crap workshop. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Grant 4472 Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 MEK works great with Slater's Plasticard and Airfix kits, but is rubbish with the greasy plastic of Evergreen and Plastruct Jon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodmayes Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 AFAIK, CV bases and Plasticard are both Styrene. It sounds as though Evergreen and Plastruct are something quite different, like ABS. Barge, Pliobond and Liquid Nails (in cans) over here are what I think are called impact adhesives or contact cement in the UK. I've been seeing quite a lot of CV track on some of the Free-mo modules that frequently go on show at various meets over here. They seem to be reliable enough, especially with all the setting up and trucking back and forth those modules must get. Ted Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted March 2, 2013 Author Share Posted March 2, 2013 Les Filles took the early train to London for shopping and theatre, and I really really meant to get on with some modelling. Then I just ended up playing trains. A few minutes twiddling about, and that's a mock-up of just under half of Lubbock Zone 4 sat there on the kitchen table. I really really will get on with some proper modelling later.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.