Taigatrommel Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Hi, The line I'm modelling has a well regarded Microsoft Train Simulator version of it available, and I recently downloaded it, had a morning of updating my vintage copy of MSTS and had a look. As I was exploring the route it occurred to me that I could use the shape files from the game to help me make the buildings I require, in as much as they are largely accurate and could perhaps be printed onto card as placeholders Well, so far I've managed to work out how to get the shell into Sketchup by using Shapeconverter to turn the .s file into a .3ds. However, it's mirrored and lacks the textures from in game. Here's how the station building looks in game (view from shapeviewer): In Sketchup after attempting to scale (and failing). I'd really appreciate guidance about how to import the MSTS model into a program that might allow me to break it down into flat parts retaining the textures. I'm a total CAD novice. Thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 The textures are copyrighted works. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taigatrommel Posted February 28, 2013 Author Share Posted February 28, 2013 Well, I'm not trying to sell the models or create something for anybody else, I'm trying to use them as an aid to modeling. What you're saying is akin to suggesting that anyone who has trademarks visible on their layout (eg adverts) is acting against copyright, or even that we're breaking copyright by using anybody else's research for helping our modelling. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Well, I'm not trying to sell the models or create something for anybody else, I'm trying to use them as an aid to modeling. What you're saying is akin to suggesting that anyone who has trademarks visible on their layout (eg adverts) is acting against copyright, or even that we're breaking copyright by using anybody else's research for helping our modelling. Trademark is not copyright. Trademark is only a problem when you sell things or otherwise imply that you are the "authentic" article. Now a trademarked logo (graphical one) could also be copyright as well - eg the virgin logo. You are correct that you need a licence in the UK to copy an advert (except a very old one) and put a model version of it on your layout. Not only that but if you plan to exhibit the layout you may need a licence suitable for a public performance of the work. UK copyright law does not in general consider personal use or non-commercial use as magic "get out of jail free" cards. Some organisations (London Blunderground for example) actively solicit their employees to report misuse of their logos in any situation at all and the MOD take a very hard line on reproduction of regimental crests as a few military decal producers have found to their cost. Yes this is bonkers.. in much of the rest of the world 'fair use' rules would permit both your private use of the textures and of the advert, but the UK has extremely facist copyright regulations and our "fair dealing" rules are basically so narrow only a lawyer can thread them and only in very specific situations. Using someone else's research is also different. Facts themselves are not copyrightable and also much research material is provided so that people can make models, so you would have a rather good argument of estoppel. I doubt Heniz care if you stick a 57 varieties advert on your layout, but Microsoft are renowned for their strict copyright enforcement against any kind of "piracy" of their products, and asking on here could also get RMWeb and its operators into trouble. I agree - it's stupid, but thats Britain and copyright (and for once we can't blame the EU, in fact we are busy trying to make EU copyright law like ours) Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dagworth Posted February 28, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 28, 2013 Aren't these routes developed by users for MSTS rather than by Microsoft themselves and thus the files and copyright are nothing to do with MS? Claiming MS have copyrigth would be like saying MS have copyright of a posting here because I wrote it using Internet Explorer. The OP wanting to extract the images is no different to me wanting to use RS Carters drawings to produce a model, they are just DRAWINGS for reference. Andi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Textures are considered a creative work so copyright. Using them to draw your own mockups is different to copying them, just as using a drawing to make a model is not the same as photocopying the drawing, and copying a photograph is not (usually) the same as using it as a reference for making a painting or another photograph of the same place. (Usually because the crackpot decision in the Temple Island v New English Teas case makes even that unclear in our bonkers copyright system). You have a good point that they may be owned by the route designer not Microsoft, in which case asking the route designers permission is probably a good first move (unless the route itself is under a license permitted such re-use anyway). Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gt.Shefford Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 As an alternative you could try downloading the free trial version of Rhino http://www.rhino3d.com/download. Its a surface modeller just like sketchup, and has the .3ds file format listed on the import file type. With Rhino you can develope the surfaces (ie, flatten the model to create a net) and create your own texture maps from a photo via the object properties menu. Jonathan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taigatrommel Posted March 1, 2013 Author Share Posted March 1, 2013 Well, the good news is I've just got home to an email from Jakob Skov (one of the MSTS Rübelandbahn creators) saying my intended use is fine, so the copyright question is academic. So, can anyone help me progress this to translating the MSTS (.ace, .s) files into a format that I can work with to create a physical mock up? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taigatrommel Posted March 1, 2013 Author Share Posted March 1, 2013 Never mind, I've got it! Sometimes it's just a case of keeping rephrasing one's search terms until a match comes up. I used Shapeviewer's texture tool to convert the .ace files to .bmp, and although the 3ds I converted from the .s seems to be mirrored that doesn't matter for my purposes as I can still take proportional measurements off it, which is all I need really. The textures will help me with positioning windows etc, in conjunction with my own photos from last year. To the recycling bin!, for I must cut up some cardboard! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Well, the good news is I've just got home to an email from Jakob Skov (one of the MSTS Rübelandbahn creators) saying my intended use is fine, so the copyright question is academic. Yay, good to know that MSTS modellers apply sense. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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