RMweb Gold 57xx Posted November 12, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 12, 2017 That's an excellent pic, Tony. I also spy 4 SR wagons there. I can remember it being said somewhere not to bother with any SR wagons as there were so few of them about compared with other companies that you'd never see them. I ignored that sage advice and the pic validates that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted November 12, 2017 Author Share Posted November 12, 2017 Courtesy of Penlan, here's a census of wagons at Bristol, 1920: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagonman Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 I suspect 'C' stands for 'cripple'... Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rail-Online Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 (edited) Brilliant! By 1920 many wagons would be pooled, it is interesting to look at this (and how long for): April 1916 GER,LYR, LNWR, MR, NER Opens 3 planks and above (all coys from Jan 1917) June 1916 Scottish opens April 1918 All other opens (ie Scottish end door opens previously exempt) June 1919 All covered vans Now what we really need to do is super impose the above census onto Don Rowlands work from the mid 1970s published in Model Railways on the proportions of each type of wagon and see if there were regional differences. I suspect so as I would not have expected there to be Barry, Neath & Brecon, B&M ,R&SB 'welsh' wagons in such relatively high numbers present. Tony Edited November 13, 2017 by Rail-Online Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted February 2, 2018 Author Share Posted February 2, 2018 (edited) A busy scene at St Ives, c 1928, with a small prairie having arrived in the middle of a goods train shunting procedure. (There will be another loco out of sight of the picture.) The rear two low-roof coaches are I think brake composites - a primeval B-set, probably diagram E40. The roofs of the brake van, parked in the foreground, and the two vans in the goods shed road are clean-ish, and the van in the picture's background is a medium shade. The roofs of all the ancient coaches are grubby. (The sheeted or concreted water-cess at the end of the platform road is an oddity, and was relaid later with conventional timbering.) Edited February 20, 2020 by Miss Prism more accurate date has come to light 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagonman Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 st-ives.jpg A busy scene at St Ives, probably mid- to late-1920s, with a small prairie having arrived in the middle of a goods train shunting procedure. (There will be another loco out of sight of the picture.) The rear two low-roof coaches are I think brake composites - a primeval B-set. The roofs of the brake van, parked in the foreground, and the two vans in the goods shed road are clean-ish, and the van in the picture's background is a medium shade. The roofs of all the ancient coaches are grubby. (The sheeted or concreted water-cess at the end of the platform road is an oddity, and was relaid later with conventional timbering.) Nice photo. I always associated concrete cesses with cattle pens – were livestock unloaded directly onto the platform at St Ives? There were no pens as such there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted February 3, 2018 Author Share Posted February 3, 2018 I'm not aware of any significant livestock traffic at St Ives. If there were cattle around, it would have probably been quicker to walk to St Erth... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bécasse Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 Nice photo. I always associated concrete cesses with cattle pens – were livestock unloaded directly onto the platform at St Ives? There were no pens as such there. So have I. In the absence of livestock traffic (and pens - but temporary hurdles could have been used), I wondered if vans might have been loaded with some sort of fresh fish or seafood traffic at this end of the platform, with the smelly run-off from that needing hosing down. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
K14 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 (edited) So have I. In the absence of livestock traffic (and pens - but temporary hurdles could have been used), I wondered if vans might have been loaded with some sort of fresh fish or seafood traffic at this end of the platform, with the smelly run-off from that needing hosing down. Two early (1900?) Photochrom views of St Ives add evidence for this notion: Higher res (150k) here: http://cdn.loc.gov/service/pnp/ppmsc/08200/08255v.jpg Insane res (24mb) here: http://cdn.loc.gov/master/pnp/ppmsc/08200/08255u.tif Note the two fish wagons in the parked-up rake, and the quantity of fishing boats pulled up onto the beach a couple of hundred yards away. View from the other direction: More bigly: http://cdn.loc.gov/service/pnp/ppmsc/08200/08245v.jpg Biglyest (28mb): http://cdn.loc.gov/master/pnp/ppmsc/08200/08245u.tif P. Edited February 4, 2018 by K14 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium dmurrell Posted February 4, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 4, 2018 Some very interesting photographs and even more interesting discussion! There was a suggestion earlier in the thread that the type of photographic emulsion might contribute to van roofs appearing lighter because of greater contrast. Many emulsions at this time were still orthochromatic - that is, they rendered blues and greens as being lighter, so giving an apparent increase in contrast, however this shouldn't have much effect on white or grey such as might be found on a van or carriage roof. True, it might contribute to a green field appearing lighter. Panchromatic emulsions were introduced in 1906, however were still quite expensive (up to three times the cost) until the 1930s. Panchromatic film would be more likely used for commercial work and I think it would probably be used for a specialised application such as aerial photography where tonal rendering is more important. David Murrell Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted February 4, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 4, 2018 Excellent shots of early St Ives. One thing those claiming the white roofs might be due to the photographic emulsions have failed to explain is why one or two wagons in a line are showing white compared to the others. The angle of the light would not vary much so one can only assume that some roofs were much lighter even if the emulsion has exaggerated the effect. Don Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
billbedford Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 Actually. I think the photo was taken just after a rain shower and the three vans have wet roofs that reflect light from the sky. The passenger train had recently arrived and missed the shower so the carriage roofs are dry and have no reflections. Can anyone explain the pattern of dark and light on the goods shed roof? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 A rain 'shower' in Cornwall? IMHO it's unlikely the coaches would have missed any rain. St. Erth isn't very far away. One of the vans has a grey roof as well. All the rolling stock has twenties livery (16" lettering and chocolate and cream which would suggest late twenties I think.) No idea re shed roof - interesting! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold unravelled Posted February 4, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 4, 2018 Could the goods shed roof have slates from two different sources. The diagonal effect could fit with a change of colour after the first section had been laid. Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darwinian Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 Alternatively was the shed extended at some time. The colour change does look to be about the right angle for a change in the slates used. The house in the background has a very light roof too. Over on ANTB there is a photo of Brent which looks to be similar period and of 3 coaches in view there are 3 shades of white - grey. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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