Bachmann announce Mk2f's

[BigAndy]

Some things are worth waiting for y'know!

 

I take the point of having to wait 5 years, but they're almost here, so why cancel now? I put in a pre-order for two DBSO's but I'm not about to cancel now as they're pretty much around the corner.

From what I've seen of these 2f's and the Dbso, at least they're going to be an excellent model and the livery will be spiot on, compared to the Oxford Rail debacle.........

 

cheers

 

Andy

[James90012]

I have seen photos of Aircon MK2s in Scotrail livery on the push-pull workings. Were MK2s used for a short period then replaced with MK3s?

 

If MK2fs were suitable and it was accurate (albeit less common) it's somewhat of a surprise that Bachmann don't also release their air-con MK2s in Scotrail livery to offer a matching set, even without Oxford Rail's apparent blunder with the livery. I've also seen photos with IC MK2s, but again have no idea how common / uncommon this was.

 

Edit, this thread on another forum provides plenty of detail - but in answer to my question it appears these were MK2Ds.

 

https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/47-7-push-pulls.129282/

Edited July 5, 2018 by James90012

[Flood]

I have seen photos of Aircon MK2s in Scotrail livery on the push-pull workings. Were MK2s used for a short period then replaced with MK3s? No. The mk3a stock was used on the Glasgow to Edinburgh services (and two trips to Aberdeen) from 1979, the Mk2 air con stock was used from 1984 on the Aberdeen services (but not as push-pull) and then from 1985 with the DBSOs.

 

If MK2fs were suitable and it was accurate (albeit less common) it's somewhat of a surprise that Bachmann don't also release their air-con MK2s in Scotrail livery to offer a matching set, even without Oxford Rail's apparent blunder with the livery. I've also seen photos with IC MK2s, but again have no idea how common / uncommon this was. Mk2F stock, apart from the DBSOs, was never painted in ScotRail livery (with one exception, see below). The toilet window positions of Mk2D TSO stock are different to Mk2F TSO stock. Bachmann decided to make Mk2F stock as it was different to the Airfix/Mainline/Hornby Mk2D stock then available.

 

Edit, this thread on another forum provides plenty of detail - but in answer to my question it appears these were MK2Ds. The TSO stock were Mk2D, the FO stock was Mk2E apart from one Mk2F FO (3284) which was actually a Mk3a substitute.

 

https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/47-7-push-pulls.129282/

Edited July 5, 2018 by Flood

[GordonC]

3284 was fitted with disc brakes apparently. If you were not too bothered about accuracy, you could have 2 Mk2f TSO in ScotRail (masquerading as Mk2e).

 

5756 & 5813 (Mk2e) were both briefly in ScotRail livery from 1984-86 although they were allocated to Polmadie and spent most of the time on cross country services.

 

I think it is more likely Bachmann will do a Mk2z twin pack in ScotRail.

 

IC Mk2f were common enough in the last year of push-pull working as were IC Mk3s.

 

Those 2 Mk2e's, how did they end up in Scotrail livery? was it while they were at Polmadie they gained it? I'm surprised if they were allocated to cross-country services that they didn't get a red stripe instead of a blue. I had seen scotrail liveried air-conditioned Mk2s in pictures of Cross-Country trains before but just assumed they had become spare from Scotrail services and transferred over

 

Bachmann Mk2z's would be fantastic, I'd definitely have a rake!

[Flood]

I'd forgotten about 5813. It was painted in 1985 when the ScotRail livery came out, in error, and was a regular in the Poole/Penzance/Plymouth/Parkeston Quay - Glasgow/Edinburgh/ Aberdeen Cross Country services.

 

It was still listed as being in ScotRail in 1988 so seemed to have kept the livery until the Mk2E stock had facelifts from September 1988 onwards. It is listed as being in InterCity (Swallow) and based at Manchester in the Summer of 1989.

 

It is the eighth vehicle in this photo: https://daverowland.smugmug.com/Platform5-Railway-Books/Platform5-Combined-Volumes/i-Wc7SbR4

Edited July 6, 2018 by Flood

[ThaneofFife]

I have also seen footage of Mk2 aircon stock at Lancaster branded up "Inter-City ScotRail" on blue/grey stock - presume they were 2f's.

[Flood]

I have also seen footage of Mk2 aircon stock at Lancaster branded up "Inter-City ScotRail" on blue/grey stock - presume they were 2f's.

Nope, sorry. Mk2E cross country stock, see the example below:

 

http://80srail.zenfolio.com/p46631637/e10cf13e0

 

Note that it was not only incorrectly branded but carried Scotrail (instead of ScotRail) which shows how early on it was done.

Edited July 8, 2018 by Flood

[Matt]

How big are the differences between an E & an F?  The D's had different window arrangement but I was always under impression the Es and Fs were more or less the same apart from a module on the underframe (air conditioning unit?).  If so then presumably the conversion to an E would be straightforward unless there are other differences I am not aware of?

 

I keenly await the 2F from Bach but am now wondering how much use they will be to me on my central Scotland layout...

 

M

[Flood]

How big are the differences between an E & an F?  The D's had different window arrangement but I was always under impression the Es and Fs were more or less the same apart from a module on the underframe (air conditioning unit?).  If so then presumably the conversion to an E would be straightforward unless there are other differences I am not aware of?

 

I keenly await the 2F from Bach but am now wondering how much use they will be to me on my central Scotland layout...

 

M

The early Mk2e stock had water fillers on the roof (5744 to 5804) and the deeper droplights in the doors (5744 to 5852). Apart from the that the Mk2e stock had Stones air-conditioning and pressure ventilation, the Mk2f stock had Temperature Ltd air-conditioning and a revised system with no need for pressure ventilation. Hence the difference in the number of fans (two small for Stones or one large for Temperature Ltd) and the lack of one underframe box on the other side on a Mk2f. Finally the Mk2e stock were built with friction dampers on the bogies, Mk2f stock were built with hydraulic dampers.

 

Mk2e non fan side

http://80srail.zenfolio.com/p46631637/ecf3015d

 

Mk2f non fan side

http://80srail.zenfolio.com/p46631637/e1fd12ed1

 

 

Mk2e fan side

http://80srail.zenfolio.com/p46631637/e10cf13e0

 

Mk2f fan side

http://80srail.zenfolio.com/p46631637/efe288f1

 

Conversion using Airfix/Mainline/Hornby Mk2d bits would be very easy (apart from the door droplights but even these can be opened out).

Edited July 8, 2018 by Flood

[robertcwp]

And, just to complicate things a bit more, around 40 Mark 2f open firsts had Stones equipment rather than Temperature, so had two small fans:

 

P1030523M by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

 

And 20 (or thereabouts) 2d open firsts had Temperature gear and hence one large fan.

[westie7]

There was roof vent variation too.

There was a doc flying about at some point with the differences

Ill have it somewhere

 

See post #8 http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/68714-mk2-air-conditioned-coaches-detail-differences/

Edited July 8, 2018 by westie7

[MJI]

And, just to complicate things a bit more, around 40 Mark 2f open firsts had Stones equipment rather than Temperature, so had two small fans:

 

P1030523M by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

 

And 20 (or thereabouts) 2d open firsts had Temperature gear and hence one large fan.

 

Do you know the numbers as I may have to deconvert one from single to double (2F FO from Airfix)

[Flood]

Do you know the numbers as I may have to deconvert one from single to double (2F FO from Airfix)

3276-3320 and 3357-3381 had the Stones equipment (2 fans), 3321-3356 and 3382-3439 were Temperature Ltd (one fan).

 

For completeness, the equipment box to the left of the fan unit and the equipment box to the furthest right on the other side were also different between the two air-conditioning manufacturers (please see the photos of each side above).

 

If you are using an Airfix FO for a Mk2F you will still need to remove the pressure ventilation box, change the roof vent positions and remove the door bump stops and roof water filler caps.

Edited July 12, 2018 by Flood

[MJI]

3276-3320 and 3357-3381 had the Stones equipment (2 fans), 3321-3356 and 3382-3439 were Temperature Ltd (one fan).

 

For completeness, the equipment box to the left of the fan unit and the equipment box to the furthest right on the other side were also different between the two air-conditioning manufacturers (please see the photos of each side above).

 

If you are using an Airfix FO for a Mk2F you will still need to remove the pressure ventilation box, change the roof vent positions and remove the door bump stops and roof water filler caps.

 

phew the WR ones were singlw fan

[Tiddles47]

Rails of Sheffield have announced that the 1st coaches will arrive next month. The B&G FO with and without lights being those cited. 

[ThaneofFife]

Rails of Sheffield have announced that the 1st coaches will arrive next month. The B&G FO with and without lights being those cited. 

 

might pick one up when I collect my blue 87.

[ThaneofFife]

i dont feel so bad about paying £68 a pop now (£47 non DCC) on these having just looked at prices on ebay of old Lima Mk3 coaches that could be found in typical rakes of mixed coaches.

 

I know not a direct comparison but a BR inter city coach all the same yet despite not being to the latest standards with close coupling mechanisms dcc on board lighting flush tinted glazing crisp livery application and nice window frames etc I am seeing prices of between £40 and £54 plus postage ebay for these old Lima Mk3s which I find staggering.  Not necessarily in the rarer liveries either.

 

just very briefly why are prices for these old models so high - it doesn't seem that long ago you could easily pick up a good condition mk3 for a tenner.

 

if you opt for a Mk2f without lights the price is in some instances lower than some Lima Mk3s out there.  Maybe the sellers are just being really hopeful but I don't understand why you would pay so much for these old models.

[adb968008]

i dont feel so bad about paying £68 a pop now (£47 non DCC) on these having just looked at prices on ebay of old Lima Mk3 coaches that could be found in typical rakes of mixed coaches.

 

I know not a direct comparison but a BR inter city coach all the same yet despite not being to the latest standards with close coupling mechanisms dcc on board lighting flush tinted glazing crisp livery application and nice window frames etc I am seeing prices of between £40 and £54 plus postage ebay for these old Lima Mk3s which I find staggering.  Not necessarily in the rarer liveries either.

 

just very briefly why are prices for these old models so high - it doesn't seem that long ago you could easily pick up a good condition mk3 for a tenner.

 

if you opt for a Mk2f without lights the price is in some instances lower than some Lima Mk3s out there.  Maybe the sellers are just being really hopeful but I don't understand why you would pay so much for these old models.

Happy Christmas .. wow.

I’ve just sorted a whole bunch of my Lima’s to go, i’m Pondering on disposing of a rake of scr mk3’s as we speak..I actually like the Oxford ones, in my dark space the grey isn’t noticeable...

[Ouroborus]

I remember selling a Hornby mk3 buffet for £1.25 on eBay. With free postage!

[JSpencer]

i dont feel so bad about paying £68 a pop now (£47 non DCC) on these having just looked at prices on ebay of old Lima Mk3 coaches that could be found in typical rakes of mixed coaches.

 .

They were dirt cheap a few years back. Maybe the release of the new Oxford ones put the price up!

[delticfan]

Just been notified by my local model shop item ending in 650 is in stock.

[ThaneofFife]

DBSO reviewed in the latest Rail Express.   The model bodes well for the coaches.  Just I had a grand to blow on a couple of rakes.

[adb968008]

Time to FO...

 

 

Really nice lighting inside, look at the partition rendition inside.

 

Gosh there’s a lot of parts... and a lamp bracket fitting tool..

 

I’ve fitted my 1970’s style headlamp, switch is under the coach..

 

 

So 1 down, 5 to go, my 87 is waiting... i’m going All 70’s and cant wait !

 

 

thanks to Derails for overnighting it with my Beachy Head, Intime to see it before I go WCML on the Waterloo - Blackpool north tonight.. 92 throughout... hopefully like this... lights ON..

 

Lights off..

 

Pros:

Excellant paint job, lots of printed details, especially the bogies

Really like the tail lamp

Lights match to windows

Window printing

Separate roof detailing

Spare buffer !!

Price.. yes it’s not cheap, but the lighting is very good, and an equivalent kit will set you back £20 anyway, this one is DCC (but I’m a D.C. man).

 

Cons..

I can see the screws in the floor

Bathroom light looks a bit like a disco.

 

When I get back i’ll Pair it to my Mk2D/E but I know the winner already.

 

Just to finish off, look at the end detail !

Edited September 21, 2018 by adb968008

[Market65]

Oh goodness. That is superb. I’m so tempted to make up a rake of them. Thank you for posting those photo’s.

 

Best regards,

 

Rob.

[ThaneofFife]

id lke to see that coach in dark or semi dark conditions looking for light bleed either through any join gaps if there are any or through the body if its transluscent or patchy.

 

on the face of it though in daylight conditions the lighting looks well up to the level I expected it would be (the disco toilet lights can probably be access and a dab of paint put over that particular LED to tone its brightness down)   its possible that the whole coach can be dimmed via the dcc decoder.

 

what does the Bachmann instruction leaflet say on light control and cv programming ?