RMweb Premium 2ManySpams Posted March 25, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2013 Chris, A question for you - how much would you expect the baseboards to cost for this layout ? I've bought some 5mm ply to build mine, at almost £200, and I'm not convinced it was value for money. I know Damian builds boards that would shore up Jerico, so I wondered if yours would be similar in construction and therefore price. Stu Not sure yet Stu but I'm thinking towards the lighter end of the build spectrum... I did have a source around these parts for good ply but that's now closed, not sure where to go next but certainly not the tree leave pulp sold at DIY sheds. One thing I will take from BCB is the use of lightweight filler instead of plaster. Saves mucho weight. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warspite Posted March 26, 2013 Share Posted March 26, 2013 For me though, the scene is just as important as the trackplan and some of my favourite scenes from the real Bodmin / Wenford area have mentally found places on the layout. Chris A belated 7mm welcome from me as well. I was always very impressed with what you did on 'Diesels in the Duchy' - one of my favourite exhibition layouts (I remember getting some nice photos of it at the DEMU show in 2010) - including your stunning buildings. Can't wait to see what you will achieve in 7mm, particularly some Cornish wharf side industrial buildings. Totally agree with the statement from your post yesterday. One thing I've learnt from years of making modelling mistakes is the importance of the layout being part of a scene and not the other way round. Both Martyn Welch and Gordon Gravett have achieved this with great success in 7mm scale. With this in mind, your track plan looks good - lots of operational interest without being too crowded. I'll be following this one with lots of interest. Stephen 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted March 26, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 26, 2013 If you made the boards a shade under 2ft8in wide you could get the tops for 3 boards out of one 8x4 sheet I use 6mm exterior ply from a decent builders merchant (it is worth having a look) and then some wood about 32x18mm again it tends to be better from the builders merchant. I fix diagonal braces to stop twist. This is the underside of one. Fairly lightweight but quite strong enough. The only problem is the frames are not deep enough to mount tortoise motors directly underneath. But that could easily be resolved with a thin ply skirt along the front and rear. I cannot remember the costs but not too pricey. Don Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Siddall Posted March 26, 2013 Share Posted March 26, 2013 I used the 'sandwich' frame method as explained by Barry Norman in his book Landscape Modelling. I can recommend it, even though Kelly Bray is not designed to be exhibited. It has withstood the rigours of 10 years in an unheated outbuilding with no sign of warping. As Don points out, make sure the frame is deep enough for Tortoise motors, if you are going to use them. I did not and had to spend time making horizontal mounts for mine. Agree on all counts with one proviso... the potential for ultra light-weight boards to behave like a guitar's sound box and amplify track noise! Having diligently and time-consumingly created mine using this technique for the first time I now rather wish I'd stuck to 'low-tech'. If you do go for the 'sandwich frame' method I'd suggest you'll need to factor in some form of underlay and avoid any form of accoustic connection twixt track and boards (...and definitely avoid PVA for securing ballast!). Either that or fill every box van you build with foam and install DCC sound in all your locos ;-) David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mark Forrest Posted March 26, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 26, 2013 The (embryonic) baseboards for WLL are in the Barry Norman "sandwich" style in 4mm ply - although I'm contemplating extruded polystyrene tops in place of ply. I wonder if that would help with the noise concerns which David mentions above? Personally I think the idea of hearing the stock crossing rail joints might not be such a bad thing - guess it just depends how much motor noise there is on your chosen locos. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mark Forrest Posted March 26, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 26, 2013 A train of 12 odd, clattering over the track joints (at scale 45' and 30' lengths for a very rural backwater) are the main source of noise on Kelly Bray. Plus the roaring of the wheels on the rails. not unlike standing beside the real thing then? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 2ManySpams Posted March 26, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 26, 2013 The (embryonic) baseboards for WLL are in the Barry Norman "sandwich" style in 4mm ply - although I'm contemplating extruded polystyrene tops in place of ply. I wonder if that would help with the noise concerns which David mentions above? Personally I think the idea of hearing the stock crossing rail joints might not be such a bad thing - guess it just depends how much motor noise there is on your chosen locos. I'm thinking the same thing Mark, ply sandwich sides, ply trackbed (but only where absolutely necessary) and the rest in-filled with foamboard and the poly stuff used on BCB. The layout won't be flat and therefore I'm thinking there's probably little need to start off with a completely flat-world board. I'll also be using the minimum of poly but enough to hopefully kill any drumming. I'm sure time will tell! It's not the locos that make the most noise, it's the 4 wheel wagons! A train of 12 odd, clattering over the track joints (at scale 45' and 30' lengths for a very rural backwater) are the main source of noise on Kelly Bray. Plus the roaring of the wheels on the rails. Sounds great! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 2ManySpams Posted March 26, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 26, 2013 Welcome aboard. Your right it is like starting all over again and finding your feet. One thing I wasn't prepared for is there is some rubbish stuff available and I thought O gauge was all about the extra detail, but once you've started I don't think there's any going back. Hi Steve Had a look at your layout thread today - wow, what a load of stock! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 2ManySpams Posted March 26, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 26, 2013 I did not rigidly (ouch dreadful pun ) stick to Barry Norman's design, in that I used 9mm ply for the top, then covered it in 4mm cork tiling. Weight was not too important factor as the layout stays permanently at home. It is modular, however, for that move to the 'retirement bungalow'. That said, it is not the quietest when it comes to train moves, but it is not excessive that I adversely notice it every time I operate. The fact that it has not warped is the major benefit The biggest problem is that it is 12m from the house and it is not an inviting journey in the cold and wet, especially as I do not keep the stock there for security. 12m is a long way with the weather the way it is! Thankfully I'm very lucky and have a room in the house over what was the garage. Still difficult to get in there during the week getting home late and tired from work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Stubby47 Posted March 26, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 26, 2013 I wish you'd stop going on about how good 7mm is.... I'm starting to think about the slight possibilty of maybe trying it myself. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Stubby47 Posted March 26, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 26, 2013 Let me build in 4mm first... then who knows ??? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piskey Posted March 26, 2013 Share Posted March 26, 2013 The room it will go in is about 17' long and for once I'd like to build a layout that can be put up in its entirety at home and operated! Hi Chris, So you've gone up to 7mm have you? Just as I've gone back to 4mm after almost 50 years, and with much the same motivation - Kernow and their blasted Beatties, though my motivation for Boscarne Junction was long before the 7mm model was announced as otherwise I might have been swayed back to that scale, one I abandoned a couple of years ago! You are dead right about the need for having a layout that can be fully erected and operated at home. I'm using two fiddle yards, one end (the only bit with track so far) is a traverser and the other will be cassettes with one arranged to swivel so it can also be used 'behind the scenes' for shunting from the Southern line to and from the Southern siding. This 4mm modelling is doing my eyes in, though, so for recuperation I do sometimes go back to the 16mm stuff for a change, though the weather rules out any steaming at present. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren01 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 (edited) HI 2ManySpam I made a bit of a cock up on the panels, 60 foot works out at 24 sleepers ,if you are adding curves then the panels should have 25-26 sleepers. Sorry about that. Darren Edited March 27, 2013 by darren01 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted March 27, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 27, 2013 One thing I find helps is buying decent Motor/Gearboxes (my preference is ABC) mine have been very quiet so most of the noise is due to stock rolling along. These are not cheap but well worth it in my opinion. Don 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack P Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 (edited) Yes, spotted that in your thread and had a good read. I would humbly suggest that adding weight in the frames as you build is a good idea, especially if you want to detail the interior I had to add a weight in there, they certainly weren't nicknamed 'pillboxes' because they were large! Jack Edited March 27, 2013 by Jack P 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 2ManySpams Posted March 28, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 28, 2013 HI 2ManySpam I made a bit of a cock up on the panels, 60 foot works out at 24 sleepers ,if you are adding curves then the panels should have 25-26 sleepers. Sorry about that. Darren Thanks Darren - I thought it sounded a few too many! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 2ManySpams Posted March 28, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 28, 2013 As many are discovering, 7mm can be catching! I am very biased, but I personally recommend the scale!! It does bring its own set of unique challenges, that of space and cost. I have managed to shoe horn Kelly Bray into 16" 6" by 1" 9" for the scenic section. The cost factor meant I had to save up to buy the kits and components, but it did mean in the early years I had few unmade projects in the cupboard; which is not a bad thing. When I started back in 1988, you either had to build it all yourself or have a very large cheque book to pay for a professional The advent of RTR has changed the face of the scale out of all recognition over the last 25 years. I have a couple of models on advance order, because one never has enough time to build everything you would like. New processes have come along as well; multi-media kits with resin castings for example. Also laser cutting technology; look at Kev Lewis' topic on his plywood signalbox. It may be pricey, but it is a gorgeous model. Kev is making an excellent job of it as well. If you are forced to scratch build as I am for my buildings, they are large and chunky. The bits are easy to hold and if you really want to add the small detail, you can do that as well if you wish. The collie dog on my platform is the nearest I could find to my own collie / spaniel cross "Jasper". I resorted to a sharpened cocktail stick to paint the spots on his front legs to get the model as close to the prototype as possible! Rivet counters eat your hearts out!!! Mad but achievable! P3195473.JPG Nice painting Paul! You're right about the size, chunkiness and detail. I bought the first wagon kit about a year ago, starting building it and then got side-tracked with the Black Country Blues project. The cost is initially very off-putting but I think most folk buy less and are more choosy about what they buy than the cheaper 4mm or 2mm stuff. I really enjoy making buildings from scratch and am really looking forward to some real rustic modelling in this larger scale. We're away over Easter so I think I'll be taking the laptop (with Templot installed) and the wagon kits with me as the weather looks a bit on the cold side. Thanks all for the continued encouragement. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 2ManySpams Posted March 28, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 28, 2013 So how big is a Pasty in 7mm? I shall be working on my engine shed and a mad little diorama involving some 7mm scale Cornish Pasties.... Photos of the later will appear after the RMWeb SWAG show next month. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 2ManySpams Posted March 28, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 28, 2013 Oh, and what are you using for a prototype?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cromptonnut Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 (edited) Will you be doing top crimp or side crimp pasties though? The purists disagree... I order a box by post from Anns Pasties on a regular basis as we don't get much in the way of decent pasties up here in London - have converted most of our office now to enjoying real pasties rather than those things from Ginsters. Edited March 28, 2013 by cromptonnut Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Stubby47 Posted March 28, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 28, 2013 As one of the BCB boards will be at Taunton, will you be wanting it re-gauged /re-scaled to 7mm ? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 2ManySpams Posted March 28, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 28, 2013 Pete (trisonic) look away now.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 2ManySpams Posted March 28, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 28, 2013 He's an Englishman in New York and misses his pies, pasties and pork pies... Accordingly we have been known to accidentally post photos of these wonderful products Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 2ManySpams Posted March 28, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 28, 2013 Oh, had the excitement last night of rolling my nearly completed SR van down my first length of track on the workbench (old door)! Regarding the weighting of 7mm wagons - what's the accepted norm? I generally put 5no 2p pieces in 4mm wagons!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Pete (trisonic) look away now.... I see no pie pron? Chris, have you seen the "Black Notley - BR Eastern" thread by Paul, (pwr)? Small but not micro 7mm.... Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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