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Yet another signalling help request. 'Bracketed' shunting signal?


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Hi all, I'm hopping someone could give me some advice on signals....

 

Below is a diagram of where I believe the signals should go. Is this correct?

 

Figure 2 shows the start signal for the main line, but with the shunting signal on a bracket to control the bay platform. Is the prototypically correct?

 

post-18559-0-52037000-1366580533.jpg

 

Thanks in advance for any advice....

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If the bay platform is used for passengers it would have a full-sized semaphore not a disc.  If there is enough space available the signal for the bay would most likely be on the left side of the track, but if it had to be on the right then a bracket signal is possible. 

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The Bay signal could be on the same structure as the main platform, as on platforms 1 & 2 at Yarmouth Vauxhall in this thread http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/69531-looks-wrong-but-isnt/page-2&do=findComment&comment=1018059. As stated earlier if the bay is passenger it needs a full size arm.

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Usual preference would be to mount the signal as close to the drivers eye level as possible to ensure good sighting from the loco cab. However this would in turn depend not only on physical features such as buildings bridges, line curvature, etc and the maximum line speed allowed at that point but also whether the company preferred right or left hand drive locos. The GWR for example used right hand drive so many of its signals ended up being located on  / bracketed out to the right of the line to which they applied. Other companies that favoured left hand drive usually favoured signals to the left although obviously the key overriding factor was viability of the signal rather than cab layout. As regards shunt signals specifically, due to the nature of their use (i.e. low speed moves) shunt signals had more flexibility in where they might be located (especially ground mounted ones)

 

Another factor to consider is that while in the early years many companies used standard height signal posts with modified arms as shunt signals, replacements (i.e. where the post required replacement) in the grouping era generally seam to be of the ground mounted style.

 

Cost can also play apart - a straightforward post will be cheaper than a bracket, however because sighting is the most important thing it might be the case that a bracket is unavoidable

 

As has been noted if the bay is a passenger line then a proper stop signal will be required.

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The Bay signal could be on the same structure as the main platform, as on platforms 1 & 2 at Yarmouth Vauxhall in this thread http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/69531-looks-wrong-but-isnt/page-2&do=findComment&comment=1018059. As stated earlier if the bay is passenger it needs a full size arm.

That's defiantly a possibility! Thanks

 

 

Usual preference would be to mount the signal as close to the drivers eye level as possible to ensure good sighting from the loco cab. However this would in turn depend not only on physical features such as buildings bridges, line curvature, etc and the maximum line speed allowed at that point but also whether the company preferred right or left hand drive locos. The GWR for example used right hand drive so many of its signals ended up being located on  / bracketed out to the right of the line to which they applied. Other companies that favoured left hand drive usually favoured signals to the left although obviously the key overriding factor was viability of the signal rather than cab layout. As regards shunt signals specifically, due to the nature of their use (i.e. low speed moves) shunt signals had more flexibility in where they might be located (especially ground mounted ones)

Thanks for the info. This in particular is very interesting.

 

Just to clarify, the pay is goods only.

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If the bay is goods-only, then I would suggest that (a) a shunt disc would be sufficient and (b) it should be situated by the trap points at the exit from the bay, which - I assume - are 'off scene' to the right.

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( B) it should be situated by the trap points at the exit from the bay, which - I assume - are 'off scene' to the right.

 

Ha! you read my mind.... is this the easy way out? .... I may include a the trap point before the bridge if I can find a suitable way of recreating one

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  • 1 month later...

Hi all, I'm hopping someone could give me some advice on signals....

 

Below is a diagram of where I believe the signals should go. Is this correct?

 

Figure 2 shows the start signal for the main line, but with the shunting signal on a bracket to control the bay platform. Is the prototypically correct?

 

post-18559-0-52037000-1366580533.jpg

 

Thanks in advance for any advice....

Liskeard Up platform has similar (Your fig2)

The disc is for going around the connection for the Looe branch.

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Liskeard Up platform has similar (Your fig2)

The disc is for going around the connection for the Looe branch.

Yes but at Liskeard the co-located disc is for a movement from the same line as that to which the running signal arm applies - not at all the same situation as that shown in the OP's inquiry.

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Yes but at Liskeard the co-located disc is for a movement from the same line as that to which the running signal arm applies - not at all the same situation as that shown in the OP's inquiry.

Aha I hadn't noticed that the disc was for a separate line.
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Ha! you read my mind.... is this the easy way out? .... I may include a the trap point before the bridge if I can find a suitable way of recreating one

 

Peco produce one for OO gauge. It would be positioned on the approach to the trailing point, so unless you plan to model the track to the right of the overbridge, you won't need one.

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I see no problem with the diagram in OP as regards the platform end.  As others have said the disc would only be used if the bay were a loco spur or goods dock and not a passenger platform.  In the latter case a full signal is required.  Siting depends on the actual location - there is nothing wrong with both lines having their signals on one bracket though each with its own post to the left of the running line is ideal.  

 

My question is why are two discs shown alongside the platform?  One is required to control moves over the crossover (and one is correctly shown on the other through track for the same purpose) but I can't see a reason for the second.

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