Berrington and Eye GWR/LNWR Joint Line 1912 - Layout

[Mikkel]

I don't envy you the task. Will the locos shunting the yard be tender locos (i.e. Dean Goods)?

 

I hope it will work out eventually, it's certainly a layout worth pursuing. And we want to see your 517s in action

Edited March 4, 2018 by Mikkel

[Brassey]

I don't envy you the task. Will the locos shunting the yard be tender locos (i.e. Dean Goods)?

 

I hope it will work out eventually, it's certainly a layout worth pursuing. And we want to see your 517s in action

 

Hi Mikkel,

 

Yes.  The intention is for the up local goods loco to be Dean Goods number 2439 which, for some reason according to RCTS, got an S4 round top boiler as late as July 1912 and was allocated to Hereford! So I have an excuse to do it in almost fresh from the works finish.  I am saving a Martin Finney kit for this one.  I have a few options for the down local goods which might be another Dean or a tank in the short term but needs to be a Shrewsbury based loco.  So it might be an Armstrong or a Beyer Goods!  And yes, one 517 is currently in the paint shop and it's train is under construction.  More on this in due course.  Here she is is action: 

 

 

So far all the testing work on the layout has been done by my trusty Wills 1854 Pannier Tank which I built in the 80's.  It has had a new Alan Gibson chassis and Mashima but still has it's Ultrascale wheels that at the time were sold by the EMGS:

 

 

Since this shot, as a reward for all it's hard work, it now has buffers, brakes and handrails!  One day I will finish it (I already have cab side plates). So tank engines do work over the point work into the yard but getting a tender to reverse with it's train is another matter.

 

The Scalefour Society forum has a new thread on updated point work building and I can now tell from this how and where I need to fine-tune my track work.  All I need to do this is the time to dismantle the layout which is currently set up in a bedroom in order to be able to work on it from both sides.   In the meantime I want to complete some of the trains to thoroughly test the track work before I start ballasting.  Watch this space!

 

Edit to add video

Edited March 4, 2018 by Brassey

[Mikkel]

Thanks for posting the video, good to see some 517 action. Interesting stock  in the first and last frames, too.

 

The Armstrong vs Beyer Goods sounds like one of those difficult decisions where you have to choose between something typical and something rarely modelled. My vote is for the latter in this case, I think - but that's easy for me to say.

[Coal Tank]

Did I spot a coal tank chassis lurking

John

[GWR8700]

Fantastic, looking forward to seeing this develop

[Brassey]

Did I spot a coal tank chassis lurking

John

 

Yes Coal Tanks in progress.  More detail on my blog:

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/1104/entry-20581-lnwr-coal-tank-chassis-take-2/

[Brassey]

At ScalefourNorth I made the leap into DCC tempted by the lure of steam sounds.

 

Both the 517 no. 835 and Webb Coal Tank 549 (in progress) have had decoders fitted but no sound as of yet:

 

Both can be seen here.  All seems to be working:

 

Edited May 15, 2018 by Brassey

[Coal Tank]

Nice vidio I've been looking at Berkswell as a possible project

John

[Brassey]

Progress has continued at a glacial pace.  Platforms and loading dock added in preparation for ballasting having finally glued down all the chairs.

 

Might get to dig the foundations for the station building now sometime soon.

 

View from the bridge (well it would be once I've built it):

 

[drduncan]

Nice work! Looking forward to the next bit of progress.

Duncan

[Brassey]

A weigh bridge and office have been installed in the yard and the builders have also been to dig the foundations for the station building:

 

 

[Brassey]

I’ve managed to get the sleepers the same height as the ground in the goods yard which makes this shot possible with just the rail above ground level.  Need to finish the weigh bridge office roof though.

 

Until recently, the raised black facia board was masking this area but I’ve cut it down to ground level now with a jig saw.  That meant working out all the levels.  You can just see that the ground rises up to the base of the card mock-up station building which is prototypical and that’s why it has to have deep foundations.

 

 

At the other down (South) end of the layout, ballasting has commenced and I have started to build a bridge as a scenic break.

[Brassey]

Over a year on and not too much has changed visually on the layout.  Ballasting is complete and I took my customary week off work in August during which I managed to complete some scenic work i.e. the embankment.  Here is a shot of the work in progress showing my belt-and-braces hybrid technique of expanded poly, cereal packets and plaster bandage.

 

 

At some point I'll find the time to paint it and, as I now have acquired a static grass tool, there might be more scenic activity some day soon.

 

 

Astute followers of this thread will spot in the background that the wall colour has changed from Orange Chrome to Loco Green.  This is because the layout has moved again to another room.

[Mikkel]

On 18/10/2019 at 20:50, Brassey said:

Ballasting is complete

 

Well I would call that important progress. Embankment too.

 

I'm somewhat concerned at your interpretation of loco green though  

[drduncan]

It does look a bit, well, (gulps) malachite...

[drduncan]

I hope you weren’t Bulleid into moving the layout.

[Brassey]

Thanks Guys!

 

The embankment was quite vulnerable due to the holes in the open frame through which any derailed stock could have fallen into the floor below. 

 

As I gradually build up stock, I thought fixing this was a priority. It’s a lot easier to work on the far side of the layout when it’s dismantled for a move.

 

Might be a while before another update but I still need to paint the  far up platform which was a job I ran out of time to do. 

[Brassey]

In planning the layout I have spent considerable time working on the operational side.  This has required analysing the public timetables, working/service timetables and carriage working diagrams/programmes, rule books etc.  This being a joint line, it required accessing original info from both the LNWR and GWR and also the Joint Line Committee which published it's own schedules too.  Luckily quite a lot of the information I required was at the L&NWR Society Study Centre. 

 

The data was input into a database programme (Access) and the movements and their balancing movements analysed which produced a timetable of trains through Berrington and Eye and the make-up of the trains for the Summer of 1912.  This gave 90 trains through the station the majority of which were goods as per summary:

 

43 Goods

16 Express Passenger

22 Joint Local Passenger

5 Coal

1 L&NW Mail

1 Cattle

1 Mineral

1 Meat

 

Through the various carriage diagrams I have managed to glean the formation of all the passenger trains.  This is a fascinating subject in itself though few carriage working documents have survived.  This is a page from the May 1915 Diagram of Carriage Working for the Joint Line:

 

 

Train No. 87 for example, (which was 117 Down in the Working Timetable), started the morning in Chester arriving at Shrewsbury at 9:38 leaving just under an hour later for Hereford at 10:30.  It arrived at Hereford (50 miles) over 1 1/2 hours later at 11:58 and at 1 pm worked a train to Cheltenham, back on GWR metals.  It made its way back from Cheltenham at 15:20 and 15 minutes later formed the 15:35 to Shrewsbury and formed the 17:52 from Shrewsbury to Chester where I assume it ended its day's work and spent overnight to do the whole Chester - Cheltenham circuit the next day again.

 

The down train stopped at Berrington and Eye at 11:33 and the up at 16:06.  The train was made up of 8 wheel composite and third and a 6 wheel compo with a van at each end possibly also 6 wheelers.

 

Other GW trains are listed as 8 wheel stock running between Chester - Cardiff or Newport.  The previous working for the LNWR stock was from Crewe.  By following the timetables you can see that the trains weren't necessarily through trains but the carriages were used to form the next scheduled service on their working.  I do not think they went off to a marshalling depot to be arranged but merely stayed at the station until required (in carriage sidings possibly).

 

The upshot of this is that the database has given me a list of the amount and type of stock I need to build to make a reasonable attempt at reflecting the passenger timetable.  This also has to be balanced with a pragmatic view as to what pre-grouping carriage stock is available from the trade.  Nevertheless I have quite a large schedule of works and limited time.  Work on the layout continues to take a back seat therefore.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 24, 2019 by Brassey

[Mikkel]

Very interesting post Brassey. Some attractive formations in there too.  

 

Out of interest, how have you made your choices and selections as to what trains and stock you will use. I assume you aren't going for all 90 trains.

[Brassey]

Good question. Yes Mikkel "The Plan" is to do all 90 trains but whether that ever gets completed is another question.  Bearing in mind that each train went up and down it'd be 45 trains worth so not an enormous figure!

 

It works out from analysis of the database that I would require about 70 passenger vehicles allowing for a lot of re-marshalling of common coaches.  The choice of passenger stock is mainly based upon a pragmatic view of what is available from the trade in kit form.  By far the the most frequently featured vehicle on the North West route was the GWR 'break composite' but there is a dearth of these in the trade both corridor and non-corridor.  There are a few toplights but hardly any earlier clerestory stock.  I have sourced a few clerestory from Worsley works.  Mallard/Blacksmith had one in the catalogue though I've never seen an example except in 7mm.  So the break composites will be pressed into service a lot and rotated.  I have also had a couple of exclusive/rare vehicles etched by Worsley such as the an LNWR 45' break composite and the LNWR Hereford Post Office coach.  Local passenger stock was largely 6 wheel of which there are quite a few kits for LNWR from David Geen/LRM.  Some of the LNWR were listed as "circuit trains" and were chained together as sets so they shuttled back and forth all day.  For the GWR 6 wheelers I have a pile of IKB coaches awaiting construction .

 

Break vans featured on both ends of most trains and will be interchangeable and I have sourced both 6 wheel and bogie stock for both companies for these.  

 

I also have in the kit mountain fish vehicles including from the GCR, post and parcels stock, horse boxes and a Caledonian 12wheel break composite that ran between Glasgow and Weston-super-mare!

 

Quite a lot of the goods movements were express freight that ran over night which I have assumed used fitted vehicles; probably mainly vans and I think I have that covered with stock.

 

So quite a build list. I have stated elsewhere that I gave myself an easy start by beginning with the first passenger train of the day which was a branch train for which I am using a rake of 4 wheelers and a GWR 517 of which there will be a choice of 3 when all are finished.  Overall I think I can run the timetable with around 30 locos.  A challenge when all are kit built in P4.

 

 

This photo at Leominster shows I think one of the LNWR chained up sets given the closeness of the vehicles.  The GWR train is interesting as it is too long for the platform and is likely to have been left there whilst awaiting it's next job.  It looks like a V13 van, 4 compartment arc roof first class, 3 arc roof 5 compartment compo, U28 clerestory compo then possibly another compo with a centre luggage compartment that is hidden by the bridge post.

Edited November 30, 2019 by Brassey

[Mikkel]

Thanks for that,  what a historical document this will be. A big task, but if you can capture just some of the atmosphere in that Leominster shot it will all have been worth it, I think. 

 

I see what you mean about the break compos, hadn't thought about it, but not many kits that I can think of. I must admit I'm especially looking forward to the 6-wheelers though. I keep forgetting that the IKB etches are still on the market with the BGS. 

[drduncan]

There are also brake composites in the sadly defunct 247 etched coach sides range and the very old and equally defunct Trevor Charlton range - occasionally they do surface...

drduncan

Edited November 30, 2019 by drduncan

[Neal Ball]

This looks to be a fascinating project, I look forward to seeing it develop.

 

Good luck with it.

[Brassey]

 

We now have a working signal which is the Up Home 18.  Built to LNWR spec with MSE components.  Will post a video when the ladder has been added and the signal painted.

 

 

The ground now also has some covering.

[Mikkel]

Good to see progress on the B&E. It made me wonder how GWR drivers would learn LNWR/foreign signals. Was it part of the standard training or - more likely perhaps - specialised training sessions?

 

I see there's a door in the sky. The LNWR signalling dept were well connected