Gordon A Posted June 24, 2013 Author Share Posted June 24, 2013 Thanks Hesperus. All that is needed is for the weather to improve, and work not to get in the way! Gordon A bristol 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamsmith Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 05.07.13. Try Kidderminster Railway Museum for photos. I donated a few of the area to them when I aborted a plan to publish a railway history of the Clee Hill system. William.H.Smith. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted July 5, 2013 Author Share Posted July 5, 2013 thanks William, I e-mailed a request a few weeks requesting for details of any photographs of Butterley and Clee Hill, but have not yet received a reply. Shame to hear that you aborted your plan to publish a book on the Clee Hill system. There are a number of industrial railway followers around. Gordon A Bristol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Gordon, I've just sent a PM to one of our members who's a volunteer at the museum involved with image archiving to see if he can have a dig because he's a jolly decent sort. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
avonside1563 Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 In case you haven't seen this website it allows overlays of quite a range of older maps over the current google satellite view and you can then use the slider to make the overlay transparent to see how it all fits in with today's landmarks. Excellent for seeing what went where, have spent hours playing around with this http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted July 5, 2013 Author Share Posted July 5, 2013 Andy Y - many thanks for the added help. Avonside - That sounds like fun. I will give it a try. Many thanks chaps. Gordon A Bristol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Gringo Posted July 14, 2013 Share Posted July 14, 2013 Gordon, I've just sent a PM to one of our members who's a volunteer at the museum involved with image archiving to see if he can have a dig because he's a jolly decent sort. Hello Gordon, Following up on Andy's pm - (especially as he said nice things about me!) - I was down at Kidderminster on Thursday and had a look through the black & white archive for photos of the Clee Hill system and the Bitterley scissors crossover in particular. Clee Hill brought up 79 entries and narrowing it down to Bitterley gave 15 results. I had a quick skim through these and KRM 065180 is a photograph of a Pannier tank taken from the overbridge and clearly shows half of the scissors crossover and the headshunt, all engulfed in weeds. For some reason I forgot to note a date of the photo, but I would hazard a guess at late 1950s? Anyway, apologies if you've not had a reply yet from the Museum and I hope this information may help. The crossover photo rang a bell with me and I wonder if it's been published somewhere, maybe in one of the Bradford Barton Great Western albums? When I get chance, I'll have a look through the albums I have, to see if I can find a similar picture and if there's any others of Bitterley sidings. Good luck with the project. All the best, John. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mark Forrest Posted July 14, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 14, 2013 KRM 065180 is a photograph of a Pannier tank taken from the overbridge and clearly shows half of the scissors crossover and the headshunt, all engulfed in weeds. For some reason I forgot to note a date of the photo, but I would hazard a guess at late 1950s? Anyway, apologies if you've not had a reply yet from the Museum and I hope this information may help. The crossover photo rang a bell with me and I wonder if it's been published somewhere, maybe in one of the Bradford Barton Great Western albums? Sounds similar to the August 1956 photo of 4678 that appears in Branch Line Byways Vol 1 The West Midlands by Geoff Bannister Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted July 15, 2013 Share Posted July 15, 2013 I've found my article and drawing on the 'brake vans', it is in the June 1996 (that long ago!!!!) vol 3 no.10 Modelling Railways Illustrated. Somewhere I should have the original drawing (all lovingly hand crafted, not done by a computer). The photos in the Geoff Bannister book mentioned above are very good and I'm sure there are others in other books on the area. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted July 15, 2013 Author Share Posted July 15, 2013 Chaps, Many thanks for the replies. John - Thank you for your time. Is it worth me e-mailing another request or popping down one day. I seem to remember that thumbnail pictures are available to look at before ordering? Gordon A Bristol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Gringo Posted July 16, 2013 Share Posted July 16, 2013 Hi Gordon, I'm sure it would be worth another note to Kidderminster, now you know roughly what's available, and you are correct thumbnail pictures are available to look at by e-mail. As the photography and archive section is staffed by volunteers and it's the busiest period for the next couple of months, I'd recommend the e-mail route. However, if you want to pay a visit to search the photo-archive, it would be best to e-mail Mr. David Postle to arrange a visit, (and preferably on a weekday through the high summer). I had a closer look at the Branch Line book, Mark and 5050 mentioned, and I think it is the Bannister shot of 4678 that I quoted as KRM 065180. By the way, the Byways book has nine photographs of Clee Hill, three of which are printed a bit larger, as I suspected, in one of Bradford Barton's photo- albums - "Great Western Steam Off the Beaten Track", (ISBN 0-85153-161-X, published 1975) by Geoff Bannister! Included with the three, there's a second undated shot from the bridge of another Pannier, 8701, stalling on the 1 in 20 beside the scissors. Unfortunately, although it's a bigger picture, I can't see that it gives us any more information, except that it's a Beyer Peacock built Pannier, with a different cab profile. (Once a trainspotter - always a trainspotter!!). Hope this helps, All the best, John. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted July 16, 2013 Author Share Posted July 16, 2013 Thanks John, I will try to tie a visit in when I am on leave. Gordon A Bristol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted July 16, 2013 Share Posted July 16, 2013 Hi Gordon, I'm sure it would be worth another note to Kidderminster, now you know roughly what's available, and you are correct thumbnail pictures are available to look at by e-mail. As the photography and archive section is staffed by volunteers and it's the busiest period for the next couple of months, I'd recommend the e-mail route. However, if you want to pay a visit to search the photo-archive, it would be best to e-mail Mr. David Postle to arrange a visit, (and preferably on a weekday through the high summer). I had a closer look at the Branch Line book, Mark and 5050 mentioned, and I think it is the Bannister shot of 4678 that I quoted as KRM 065180. By the way, the Byways book has nine photographs of Clee Hill, three of which are printed a bit larger, as I suspected, in one of Bradford Barton's photo- albums - "Great Western Steam Off the Beaten Track", (ISBN 0-85153-161-X, published 1975) by Geoff Bannister! Included with the three, there's a second undated shot from the bridge of another Pannier, 8701, stalling on the 1 in 20 beside the scissors. Unfortunately, although it's a bigger picture, I can't see that it gives us any more information, except that it's a Beyer Peacock built Pannier, with a different cab profile. (Once a trainspotter - always a trainspotter!!). Hope this helps, All the best, John. The Bradford Barton book is one of the ones I was thinking of. I reckon I can definitely blame Geoff Bannister for my interest in Clee Hill! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgood Posted July 21, 2013 Share Posted July 21, 2013 (edited) Have you come across a DVD entitled Bygone Ways - the Land of Lost Content? Contains stills and archive film of Shropshire lines, including stills of Clee Hill. It may contain something of interest! http://www.videoscene.co.uk/bygone-ways-the-land-of-lost-content.html Edited July 21, 2013 by Osgood Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted June 8, 2014 Author Share Posted June 8, 2014 (edited) I am still digging around for information on the Clee Hill incline. Thank you for all the replies I have had so far. This is very much an now and then project as time allows. I have come across some photographs by E. J. Dew. Does anyone know where I could purchase good quality copies of his photographs? I have downloaded those that are available on the internet, but would like some sharper copies. Gordon A Bristol Edited June 8, 2014 by Gordon A Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonny777 Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 I have stumbled on this topic after searching for 'Clee hill', because I wondered if there was more info, and I seem to have found it. The reason for my search was watching a 1950s video clip of the incline in operation, which can be found on the DVD "Steam Byways Vol1" part of the Geoff Bannister video collection, and available from Railfilms. I received the four volume set as a Christmas present. The colour film clip shows wagons ascending the incline using the special adapter wagon, and the Clee Hill loco at the top of the hill (on this occasion ex-GWR No.1142). I was wondering how the loco moved up and down the 1in6 incline for occasional works visits? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norton961 Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 The runner wagon was built by the LNWR by re building D1 wagons(I think). If you get hold of an old Ratio kit you can do the conversion yourself. They converted a number of these and they lasted a long time. Not sure but I think the Cromford and High Peak had one also. Someone will correct me if I am wrong. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 The runner wagon was built by the LNWR by re building D1 wagons(I think). If you get hold of an old Ratio kit you can do the conversion yourself. They converted a number of these and they lasted a long time. Not sure but I think the Cromford and High Peak had one also. Someone will correct me if I am wrong. David Hmm, I'm not sure if this is strictly correct TBH. When I did the research for the MRI article I found some info in an old HMRS magazine about their 'provenance' and it wasn't to do with rebuilding standard wagons. I'll have to turn the article up and check but I thought they were rebuilds of an earlier brake van/wagon or similar, a drawing of which was in the HMRS publication. This is what provided the basic dimensions etc. I used for my drawing of the Clee Hill wagons. Don't remember the Cromford & High Peak having any such wagons, the ascending/descending wagons were attached directly to the haulage cable. Weren't they? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted December 29, 2014 Author Share Posted December 29, 2014 I have stumbled on this topic after searching for 'Clee hill', because I wondered if there was more info, and I seem to have found it. The reason for my search was watching a 1950s video clip of the incline in operation, which can be found on the DVD "Steam Byways Vol1" part of the Geoff Bannister video collection, and available from Railfilms. I received the four volume set as a Christmas present. The colour film clip shows wagons ascending the incline using the special adapter wagon, and the Clee Hill loco at the top of the hill (on this occasion ex-GWR No.1142). I was wondering how the loco moved up and down the 1in6 incline for occasional works visits? IIRC they were winched up and down the incline. Gordon A Bristol 05.07.13. Try Kidderminster Railway Museum for photos. I donated a few of the area to them when I aborted a plan to publish a railway history of the Clee Hill system. William.H.Smith. William, During your research can you remember how the winch man at the top of Clee Hill communicated with the foot of the incline? How did he know when to stop and to winch up? Gordon A Bristol PS I am hoping to be at the photo fair on Jan 3rd at Kidderminster. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted January 7, 2015 Author Share Posted January 7, 2015 Hi Chaps, I went to the photo fair at Kidderminster last week and ended up ordering 14 pictures. Now it is a case of patiently waiting. Gordon A Bristol 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted February 13, 2016 Author Share Posted February 13, 2016 I have been continuing my research into Clee Hill and Bitterley Yards. I purchased a disc from the Signalling Record Society showing Bitterley Signal Box track diagram, which answered a lot of my questions about the way Bitterley was operated, but it also threw a spanner in the works. On the diagram there is a point shown on the incline above the trap point at the foot of Clee Hill incline. On the diagram the point is annotated as 'B', not numbered, and is shown "set for the main" when the lever is in the normal position. "Points B worked by separate lever in SB (independent of locking frame)." I have also noted in the photos I have of the foot of Clee Hill incline a single point rod continuing up the incline past the bottom trap point. What I would like to know is what was point 'B' for? I have checked maps and photographs, and so far cannot find the existence of a point on the lower section of the incline. Help please. Gordon A Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesperus Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 Could it be an emergency siding incase of runaways? I've just bought a house right by the top of the incline so have been doing a bit of research myself and I'm sure there was at least one runaway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted February 14, 2016 Author Share Posted February 14, 2016 Hi Hesperus, The normal position for the point is closed, ie when the lever in the frame is forward, not open as the trap point at the foot of the incline (lever 1) is shown. This would mean that if there was a runaway the signalman at the foot of the incline would have to be notified and react in due time. There is a trap point near the foot of the incline (Point 1) who's normal position is open. Gordon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RThompson Posted February 14, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 14, 2016 is the site visit still going ahead? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted February 16, 2016 Author Share Posted February 16, 2016 (edited) Hi Rob, Hesparus madeb mention that he new the owner of the upper yard early on in this thread, about number 16. I will pm him to see if he can still arrange a site visit. Gordon A Edited February 16, 2016 by Gordon A Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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