Bending01 Posted July 15, 2013 Share Posted July 15, 2013 FYI - EPs of the new 25 on the Bachmann website. http://www.Bachmann.co.uk/details.php?id=127&vis=2 Got here a bit quicker than I expected - probably only a few years away now! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andymozza Posted July 15, 2013 Share Posted July 15, 2013 Hi, posted this when it was first announced "Great news, but I do hope they correct the major errors from their 4mm model,e.g small side grilles flush with the bodyside (not like the 24) and correct the cab side window angle, too shallow,", now do my eyes deceive me and this is a straight "shot down" of the 4mm body? The side grilles do not appear to flush with bodysides and that front window angle...... Andy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy stroud Posted July 15, 2013 Share Posted July 15, 2013 (edited) To me there dosent seem to be enough depth to the underframe area. The long thin space between the bodysides and the top of the bogies should be more recessed and the area between the two bogies seems to me to be far too two dimensional. The various boxes and tanks underneath the loco should stand apart from each other and have various gaps and openings in between. Also, class 25's have what I can only very crudely describe as several 'thick girders' (!!) running crossways under the loco from which some of the underframe equipment seems to hang. To me, these 'girders' are quite a feature on the real locos and are not prominent enough on the sample. I hope they improve this whole underframe area as it looks a bit like a jelly mould with all the various parts blending in together too much. It is a shame as it seems un-improved upon since the 4mm models well over a decade ago, although I do realise this is only a first sample. Perhaps some people will disagree with me and I am know there will be others with much more knowledge but those are my personal observations of the sample. andy Edited July 15, 2013 by andy stroud Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahame Posted July 16, 2013 Share Posted July 16, 2013 To me there dosent seem to be enough depth to the underframe area. The long thin space between the bodysides and the top of the bogies should be more recessed and the area between the two bogies seems to me to be far too two dimensional. Yep, I do agree. The 'sole-bar' is insufficiently 'cut under' and too prominent. And the belly tanks are too blobby also with insufficient relief and look to be an extension of the sole-bar. http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8428/7754544540_7a8bfcfbca_z.jpg G. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lyneux Posted July 16, 2013 Share Posted July 16, 2013 (edited) I've just spent the last week or so chopping up a 4mm 25/1 so my eye is feeling very tuned-in to rats right now. I would concur that it looks like a 4mm version shrunk down with many of the same "features". Similarities with the 4mm version: Cab roof profile: at first glance this appears to be uncorrected. Cab rake / side window angle: ditto Small side grilles not flush with body side. They are also missing their prominent hinges (2 per grille). Un-prototypical sole bar present Moulded tanks don't have enough depth - certain components mounted flush where they should be recessed. Differences from the 4mm version: This version has gained the "late-style" exhaust port on the roof which I don't think has been offered on the 4mm version of the 25/1. Strange that other details are still indicative of an early condition 24/1 (non-filled nose doors, bodyside steps, boiler port grilles unplated). Looks like the 3rd party resin casters and etchers will still have plenty to do in creating bits to detail these. Jim SW's DEMU Update article describing how to correct some of these problems can be found on his website: 25 article.pdf - P4NewStreet Edited July 16, 2013 by lyneux 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted July 16, 2013 Share Posted July 16, 2013 They are also missing their prominent hinges (2 per grille). Doesn't that rather depend upon the prototype you pick. If I remember correctly some (eg 25067/D5217) don't have the hinges. Must admit I'm not expecting them to be fixed - Bachmann didn't bother fixing the class 24 CAD for glaring errors like the roof mess up, they just replicated the OO model. I guess for the volume sold in N, and the lack of competition its too expensive to bother to fix the CAD ? Not sure there is much for the third party folks to do beyond the obvious grille improvements. The cab shape isn't the kind of thing you can easily fix while the solebars really involve a file not a casting set. Fuel tank maybe but thats tricky because if its like the other models its constrained by the motor block base and integrated into the solebar/buffer beam moulding. Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Robert Shrives Posted July 16, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 16, 2013 It is at least a better starting point and with the trusty file make for 24/1 and possibly a number of 24/1 with changed cabs at one end - 24133 springs to mind . I am sure if the solebar/underframe not reworked we will a be out chopping up to suit. - Who first for shoving a Dapol chassis under it to allow better tanks ! I have been pouring over Diesels in depth 24/25 book and strathwood look back at Sulzers and other recent books -plenty of info out there to aid design work and certainly to fuel the fires of modification! Robert Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted July 16, 2013 Share Posted July 16, 2013 I'm not sure I'd start with it for the 24/1 - the cabs are all wrong, the roof is wrong, the valence/solebar is wrong and the fuel tanks are wrong (on the model at least). The 24/0 at least has the right cabs and the roof is closer (despite the mess Bachmann made of the panels). The panel edges are at least not hard to move and there isn't too much other stuff to adjust for a 24/1 from a 24/0. A 25/0 is kind of half and half but I think even that would be easier off the 24 to be honest. Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahame Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 It's rather frustrating if they post an EP model pic and then don't bother to correct it from feedback before final production. It's not exactly being customer friendly and interactive, and is a bit 'take it or leave it' instead. But fingers crossed eh? G. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Steven B Posted July 17, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 17, 2013 It's disapointing that the errors have been carried over but I'll take it over the original Farish model which I'd quite happily leave on the shelf! Happy modelling. Steven B. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 As it's a different body type it doesn't really take over from the existing Farish model, rather it adds variety. It will still be way ahead in terms of detail though, even if not as good as it could be. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Robert Shrives Posted July 17, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 17, 2013 It looks like the No2 end boiler grill like the 4mm is a plug which should be good for moulding blanks! Chassis shallow detail a function of motor block for certain and I think the EP is too far down the line for much in way of change but as Bernard says it adds to the mix and will give us invetrate changers hours of fun/sweat/tears as we cut it about. Alan my thoughts re 24/1 was re filling off wings on headcode panels and putting body on chopped 24/0 chassis to get front valance- I wonder if a cut and shunt might be possible with the new offering and then make own beams for the 25/1 or 25/2 . Looks ideal for a 3D print project - perhpas Dr Simon blue with his exsisting drawings might oblige. - equally with corrected front end as he has done for 25/3 and variations. looking in the books on sulzers the big clips on side vent = dual braked conversion would be fun microstrip addition. hours of fun sorting far north fleet- all the players bar 40 and cross country dmu to hand! - or of course a BSO(T) cheers Robert Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted July 18, 2013 Share Posted July 18, 2013 But you've also got to change the bottom of the cab, adjust the doors and so on. It's easier to stick a headcode box on a 24/0. In fact its a pretty easy conversion. Mine (when part done) http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?app=core&module=attach§ion=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=35057 25/1 was the big cab change - recessed doors, cab/body line "bump" along the bottom etc. Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MR PJ Posted July 18, 2013 Share Posted July 18, 2013 But you've also got to change the bottom of the cab, adjust the doors and so on. It's easier to stick a headcode box on a 24/0. In fact its a pretty easy conversion. Mine (when part done) http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?app=core&module=attach§ion=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=35057 25/1 was the big cab change - recessed doors, cab/body line "bump" along the bottom etc. Alan Its a real shame that the much anticipated 25/1 has so many defects. Actually the cab fronts looks somewhat more like a 25 to me than the OO version, but its totally let down by the sole bar, as pointed out be others, which looks totally odd, and sort of reminds me of the cowling the 24s had. Also I agree the fuel tanks are far from correct - there needs to be a lot more "space" under the body. I only hope Farish listen to people's comments and correct these glaring errors, as although not a loco for my current layout, I may have designs on a few rats in future... Alan - that 24/1 is coming on very well - looks excellent so far. For my Kyle line based model I really need one of these! I have a standard Farish disc headcode model - I have seen photos of disc headcode fitted 24/1s (some of the early 24/1s had discs, not just the 24/0s) on the Kyle line - but they seemed rare. Did you make the parts yourself, or are some of these addtions available commercially? Cheers, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted July 18, 2013 Share Posted July 18, 2013 That one I finished a while ago (as 5116) - scariest part was actually drilling holes in the body side and fitting the token catcher. The bits are - 2mmSA wheels for 2fs running - token catchers (Bernard TPM) - class 24 detailing/conversion kit (mine, but is available commercially) and although its not all on that photo the roof was corrected using a knife and fine plasticard to move the bits Bachmann messed up. There are some shots on the Mercig web site gallery of a much better conversion than the one I did but using some of the same bits. Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pre-Tops Blue Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 One of the converted Class 24/1s that Alan is referring to on the Mercig website is mine. A closer photo of it can be found here: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/gallery/image/29020-close-up-of-d5146/ Mark 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andymozza Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Hi, just had a look at a much better photo of the new bodyshell taken at the Bachmann open day, side grilles are flush!! http://www.mremag.com/news/article/picture-from-the-Bachmann-open-day/16056 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike at C&M Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Just received an e-mail from our Bachmann rep. to say that all 4 versions have now arrived at Barwell, so they should be in your local model shop within the coming week. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomJ Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Irrespective of what they actually look like can someone post that they are horrific, inaccurate and poorly detailed. Oh and that my class 24 to 25/1 conversion (thanks Etched Pixels) is clearly better! That's what I need to hear, I need a good reason NOT to buy this model (although I'm sure my lad can managed without new shoes this year!). Perhaps I'll start omn hacking a perfectly good 27 into a rubbish looking 33 to encourage a proper rtr one to come out... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy L S Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Can't help there!! Phoned my preferred supplier Osborns. They are due to be delivered later today, so mine (Green weathered) is duly ordered (together with chip) and should be with me tomorrow. Looking forward to this one. Roy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MR PJ Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Arguably the sole bar area is inaccurate (could be perhaps modified a little if people are that bothered), but otherwise from photos I've seen so far they look quite a nice little model. Already ordered one from my local model shop,may have to find some cheap shoe repairs myself if I want to get the mandatory pair of rats.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les1952 Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 (edited) As someone who needs a disgustingly filthy Class 25/0 (the only variety in the area I model during the timeframe I'm modelling) would I be better a] ham-fistedly trying to use the Etched Pixels headbox kit on a 24, renumbered and weathered to total grot or b] renumbering and weathering a 25/1? Both are going to be incorrect by some degree. All the very best Les edited to remove that annoying smiley that appears when you follow the letter b with a close-bracket...... Edited September 3, 2014 by Les1952 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy L S Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 My weathered BR Green one arrived today, great service by Osborns as usual. As I type this it is running in on my DC test-track. I think it looks delightfully "grotty" and although the weathering is a matter of personal taste I am very happy. Running as expected, very good and on a par with the 24. I am very tempted buy the weathered BR blue one now - happy reminiscences of pairs of them bringing coal trains into Aylesbury in the early 80s to serve the now long gone "International Alloys" complex. Apparently they are selling fast! Roy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Adam1701D Posted September 3, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 3, 2014 Looks lovely - only the coupling gives it away as N Gauge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Crepello Posted September 3, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 3, 2014 Hasn't the factory weathering improved? I've always gone for pristine versions before but may be tempted by dirty ones in future! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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