Les1952 Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 Nobody is asking you to commit money to pre-orders. In the example of the O-gauge Class 23 Dave has said that the O-gauge models will be scheduled behind the three N-gauge models, which will get the green light once the OO-gauge J94 has generated the capital to pay for them. However, Dave has also said with the J94 that the initial run will only be enough to fulfil pre-orders, presumably as funds are too tight to afford to have cash tied up in unsold models. When it comes to the turn of the O-gauge class 23, the same could happen. No pre-order by the time the production go-ahead is given would then mean no model, unless you have a tame dealer with pockets deep enough to buy models on spec. My choice has been to pre-order three J94s in OO (one standard plus the RMWeb special and one Hattons), two N-gauge J94s, a class 17 in N, a Hudswell in N, and two Q6s in N- all of which will have places on my layouts, the N-gauge are all for Hawthorn Dene and the OO for No Place, though Seldomseen may be under construction before the last of them arrive. To those I'm likely to add a Hudswell and a Q6 in OO before ordering closes. Nobody has asked for a penny up front, and the spread of delivery dates means I'm not likely to be overstretched when they arrive. My dealer of choice (mostly Sherwood Models) also knows he has some business from me over the next two to three years. I will add that I had held one of the prototype J94s in my hand before placing my pre-orders and I am the satisfied owner of a DJM/Kernow Beattie. I also realise that a pre-order does not interfere with my right as a consumer to send a lemon back...... All the very best Les Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 I would not be a model railway manufacturer for worlds. Supply information to the market place? Damned if you do, damned if you don't. One of the first things that I quickly learned as a returnee to the hobby was that life has moved on from those childhood days when items seemed to linger in the catalogues and on the shelves year in, year out, so it could be "not this Christmas, Darling, but maybe on your birthday ...". Nowadays, if there is something that you want, pre-order it, or you'll miss out. With limited editions and limited production runs, if you miss it, it most likely won't come round again. No good lamenting this; it's just how it is. On the other hand, the quality and breadth of choice is unprecedented. Punishing on the wallet, mind you, because you must try to buy everything as soon as it comes out. So, as a result of this "order now, see later" policy, I have obtained mixed results: Hornby 7200. A good model, but with some disappointing corners cut. During the 18 months waiting for this to hit the shops, I found a really well-built white-metal version for less, which is better than the Hornby. Hornby Star, which so nearly was a "star" model. Apart from the lack-lustre green that often afflicts Hornby's Great Western output and the fact that Margate lost count of the spokes at one point, it is marred by the awful moulded cabside handrail. Hornby 700 Class. A lovely model, only falling short of the ideal due to the horizontal handrail knob issue (that also afflicts the J15), but which I failed to notice! Bachmann Locomotion GNR Atlantic, perfect apart from the livery mistake with the splasher tops. Bachmann umber E4 - which I cannot fault My point? Well, these are all good-to-excellent models, and I am glad that models of these prototypes were made. Their issues can, I find, be corrected or simply overlooked, and I would not have wanted to miss out on a single one of them. And I would have risked missing out had I not pre-ordered. So, je ne regrette rien. Seeing before you buy is a fast disappearing luxury. But, here's the thing, of all the manufacturers I would trust to get it as right as right can reasonably be, it's DJM, and I say that without ever having possessed or seen in the flesh, a model associated with this designer. The expectation is that standards will be higher than the market norm - this is a stated aim - and that DJM's models are less likely to disappoint than those from the Big Boys. I believe all this because of the excellent work DJM puts in making images available and factoring in feedback and criticism. So, by all means keep the announcements, updates and progress reports coming. In short, I suspect it is the faithful who will receive the rewards. Interesting Post. If one doesnt not see before buying there is a legal implication there with regards to the contract of sale and 'offer. consideration and acceptance', one would hope that perhaps, in terms of mail order, direct selling legistlation applies? Seeing before you buy should be - although a grey area - a legal/divine right. ATVB CME Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest G567281 Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 We are all selfish to our wants, wish lists, etc. I am coming up to sixty five years old, and like others, I would love to have some of Dave's RTR Q6's and an O gauge J94 before I go to the scrap yard with no hope of restoration. I wish I had the frame of mind and skills to build a Bradwell Q6 and J27 but I do not. 2016 could be the year in locomotive preservation thanks to NELPG and David Jones. Thanks to all involved. Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gilloverland Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 So what happened to the big announcements for Sunday 11th? Edit - just seen the change on your website and am eagerly awaiting the 18th! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty.J Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 So what happened to the big announcements for Sunday 11th? Edit - just seen the change on your website and am eagerly awaiting the 18th! As everything else....it's been delayed :p to 18th. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 Habits take a long time to kick. He is ex Dapol you know. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJM Dave Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 Actually, it's a bit more simplistic than you might think. I made a boob on the dates, thinking that the show I was attending was this last weekend, when in fact it's next. I always intended, and announced it as such, that I'd be announcing at the show, but made an error. Apologies if this has inconvenienced anyone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 ...of all the manufacturers I would trust to get it as right as right can reasonably be, it's DJM, and I say that without ever having possessed or seen in the flesh, a model associated with this designer... Oh, but you can still buy a model associated with DJM. It's called the Dapol Western, and it is rather good.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
modelpara Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 Been there done that Dave, happens to all of us at some stage! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium boxbrownie Posted October 12, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 12, 2015 I pre-ordered the 7mm Dapol 08 (two actually) from Hattons when they were first announced, I also pre-ordered/showed interest to DJM when the 7mm 23 was announced..............when recently Hattons was recently contacted about my pre-order (I wanted to confirm it was still "on the books") they seemed to not understand what I meant, or accept that I did in fact pre-order by clicking the order box on their website. With Daves "pre-ordering" I got no reply at the time or anything since. It begs the question when advance announcements are 2,3, 4 or even 5 years before release is there really any point if a proper pre-ordering process is not in place, or worse still if there is one it fades away during the waiting period? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 Actually, it's a bit more simplistic than you might think. I made a boob on the dates, thinking that the show I was attending was this last weekend, when in fact it's next... I do this all the time. Once turned up for a meeting in the wrong year... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJM Dave Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 I pre-ordered the 7mm Dapol 08 (two actually) from Hattons when they were first announced, I also pre-ordered/showed interest to DJM when the 7mm 23 was announced..............when recently Hattons was recently contacted about my pre-order (I wanted to confirm it was still "on the books") they seemed to not understand what I meant, or accept that I did in fact pre-order by clicking the order box on their website. With Daves "pre-ordering" I got no reply at the time or anything since. It begs the question when advance announcements are 2,3, 4 or even 5 years before release is there really any point if a proper pre-ordering process is not in place, or worse still if there is one it fades away during the waiting period? Hi mate, When expressing an interest on my site, you will receive a confirmation e-mail stating you have done so. If you havent it may have popped into you spam box or something went wrong with your application. It's not an ordering section a i dont take any details from you apart from contact details. Its primarily used as a gauge for me to garner interest so that i can judge order levels. When the product becomes available you will then be mailed asking if you wish to proceed and purchase, and only then will payment details be taken form you. However rest assured your not the first not to have a confirmation mail as it has happened about half a dozen times in the 1000 or so expressions i currently have. Can i ask you try again, if you want to that is, and PM me here to let me know you have done so, so i know to look out for it? Cheers Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium boxbrownie Posted October 12, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 12, 2015 I know this is more "your" thread Dave, my post was more just a general rant about the seemingly disorganised pre-ordering systems around, and yes, I accept of course yours is not a pre-order" so not aimed at you, really more the bigger retailers who seemingly forget any pre-orders if they are to far into the future. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catweasel Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 I've had a J 94 pre-ordered with Hattons for a while now. Any idea when it will be released? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennyboy Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 Actually, it's a bit more simplistic than you might think. I made a boob on the dates, thinking that the show I was attending was this last weekend, when in fact it's next. In my head I now have this image of you stood in an empty hall surrounded by all your new models, wondering where everybody else is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted October 13, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 13, 2015 Yeah and with my luck I would still get stuck behind the only modeler that doesn't know what personal hygiene about in the queue! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Richard E Posted October 13, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 13, 2015 Aha, Peterborough on the Sunday - is there a time planned for this BIG announcement, I might just have to firm up my plans for the weekend. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black 5 Bear Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 A new Black Five would be nice, manufactured to the standard of the forthcoming DJ King. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Higgs Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 A new Black Five would be nice, manufactured to the standard of the forthcoming DJ King. Seriously, do you find the Hornby one that bad? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hilux5972 Posted October 13, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 13, 2015 I think the current Hornby Black 5 is fairly good for being a 12 year old model tooling. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black 5 Bear Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 Seriously, do you find the Hornby one that bad?It's not that the Hornby version is bad because it isn't,I have three in my collection, however it could do with a revamp.When you compare it with some products produced in the last couple of years it needs an update and as Hilux points out, it is a 12 year old moulding and time moves on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted October 13, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 13, 2015 There's other models which could be done frist. However if you want to spend money on a new one. I would be happy to buy some more unwanted one's of eBay at a knock down price for second hand ones. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black 5 Bear Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 There's other models which could be done frist. However if you want to spend money on a new one. I would be happy to buy some more unwanted one's of eBay at a knock down price for second hand ones. I won't be parting with mine at a knock down price, they are now valued at double what I paid for them. At the end of the day, a newer version would be on my wishlist whichever manufacturer grasps the nettle. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty.J Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 Definitely no need for a new Black 5..... If the age of the tooling worries you then I'm afraid I have no more words. Hornby's Black 5 is a stunning representation of the model. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussiebrfan Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 I won't be parting with mine at a knock down price, they are now valued at double what I paid for them. At the end of the day, a newer version would be on my wishlist whichever manufacturer grasps the nettle. As with everything they are only worth what someone is willing to pay. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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