Where are the Hornby models?

[JaymzHatstand]

Unless they change tack slightly and announce what NEW models are due for DEVELOPMENT in 2014, so that the R&D bods will still be busy, and the production/distribution side can be focussed on trying to get the backlog cleared.

 

At least if they can announce those sort of plans, it will be able to keep them in the game as it were. I should imagine they have a list of items they'd like to model (a more realistic giraffe car for example?!) And at least getting into the R&D will stand them in good stead and hopefully keep some competition out of their plans.

 

Bachmann have already had a pop at this with the announced Atlantic, saying it won't be here until at least 2015 and we've accepted that, so I don't think it unreasonable if Hornby said something along the same lines.

 

Cheers

 

J

[mow]

Any sightings of this year's Christmas train sets, train packs or new models of Castles, Sandringhams, O1s for example.

 

If Hornby don't deliver this Christmas they are doing almost everything a textbook would recommend to destroy the business model other than hire Mayo and Simpson.

[The Stationmaster]

Unless the current situation improves drastically in the next three months, which I somehow doubt, I can't see how Hornby can make any announcement with any credibility on new releases in 2014. It really must be along the lines of when their existing range or announced models will be available perhaps with one or two new models , like the 2Bil this year as a sweetener.

 

A redesigned catalogue would be good, the existing glossy professional publication is looking a bit tired and if there really only is one or two new models , why would there be a need to buy it. Half the size, a bit of excitement to appeal to the retro market would be nice

The problem they face is that we now seem to live in an age of novelty where something new is expected as some sort of right and if nothing is offered there will then be a thread about Hornby dropping out of the market, are they retrenching, has Margate given up and all that sort of thing.  And of course generally the new stuff flies off the shelves - provided they've picked the right prototypes of course and, so it often seems, provided it's offered at a price cheap enough for tight fisted price conscious British modellers.

 

So notwithstanding their problems I think we will still be more likely to get new models announced than not get them and when you think about it there doesn't seem to be too much in the way of design & tooling delays with plentiful appearances of EPs and development pics.  So nothing to stop that going on apart from a squeeze on investment or cash flow difficulties.  But as Jaymz Hatstand as already said what they would be well advised not to do is go telling us quarter specific, or even year specific, release dates.  I suggested some time back in another thread that they might consider moving to an 18 month model 'year' in the same way as Bachmann (try to achieve);  in fact they're almost there anyway so perhaps not such a radical idea after all?

[robmcg]

I agree with Stationmaster, there are plenty of good models in the pipeline and quite a few good 'uns still in the shops.

 

What would Christmas be without surprises?

[Ozexpatriate]

Unless the current situation improves drastically in the next three months, which I somehow doubt, I can't see how Hornby can make any announcement with any credibility on new releases in 2014. It really must be along the lines of when their existing range or announced models will be available perhaps with one or two new models

Unless they change tack slightly and announce what NEW models are due for DEVELOPMENT in 2014, so that the R&D bods will still be busy, and the production/distribution side can be focussed on trying to get the backlog cleared.

So notwithstanding their problems I think we will still be more likely to get new models announced than not get them and when you think about it there doesn't seem to be too much in the way of design & tooling delays with plentiful appearances of EPs and development pics.

Once upon a time the catalogue meant products you could go and find that year in the shops. This is no longer the case for any manufacturer. Hornby need to make their New Year announcements regarding future models to demonstrate that they continue to be a 'going concern' with a future. I see no harm in them publishing these in an advertising book that illustrates future offerings. Clearly most of what will be produced in 2014 has already been announced.

 

It is the notion of what constitutes a 'catalogue' that should change, as it has already done for others. (My 2012-13 Dapol catalogue has a GWR AEC railcar in it. My 2011-12? Bachmann Branch-Line catalogue has a Dukedog in it.)

[robmcg]

The 2013 catalogue makes interesting reading, but 2013 isn't over yet. 

 

Yours,

 

Eternally Optomistic

[JaymzHatstand]

New models announced for this year (or even last year) that are yet to materialise in the shops will still be new models when they eventually arrive, so if for example, Hornby say there are no new 2014 models while they work on producing the backlog, we'll still get new items, just ones that were announced a year or so ago.

 

If the P2 isn't out until next year, it will still be new despite being a 2013 catalogue item.

 

It really is a difficult boat that all the big model companies are in, many people have less disposable income at the moment, so are more discerning about their spending and if the product isn't there the sale may well be lost when it does eventually arrive, although with many items that sale will go elsewhere so the manufacturer still gets their pennies, but the potential customers become dissatisfied and may move on.

 

At the end of the day, everything from a loco to a bufferstop is a luxury item, ie they are not NEEDED for us to survive, they may be good for our sanity and relaxation (or not!) But the lack of availability is not the be all and end all. The last thing I want to see of course is Hornby, or any manufacturer descend into problems and disappear as that would be bad for our wonderful hobby as a whole.

 

Cheers

 

J

[Ian Hargrave]

A rake of 1925 Collett stock in the 1950's is most unlikely. Three or four amongst a mixed rake of 1930/40's builds of various diagrams were commonplace.

 

I agree the 1930's GWR modeller is not well represent by either Hornby or Bachmann unless you are up for a repaint, with post war condition engines and stock clearly taking preference.The forthcoming Star is a welcome exception.

 

Mike Wiltshire

An option would be the existing Bachmann Colletts enhanced by flush-glazing and a set of corridor connectors.Otherwise you are looking at kit-built stock....always provided you have the necessary skills and are prepared to make a substantial financial investment.Some kit-built coaches are on the heavy side and can be a challenge too far for r-t-r. locos,in any case.I think we're looking at a gap in the market here which clearly needs addressing.

[Ian Hargrave]

The 2013 catalogue makes interesting reading, but 2013 isn't over yet. 

 

Yours,

 

Eternally Optomistic

Listening out for the fat lady,Rob ? My favourite diva goes by ths stage name of Petunia Porkie.....

[phil gollin]

.

 

................. What would Christmas be without surprises?

..

 

 

Very unprofitable.

 

.

[The Stationmaster]

Once upon a time the catalogue meant products you could go and find that year in the shops. This is no longer the case for any manufacturer. Hornby need to make their New Year announcements regarding future models to demonstrate that they continue to be a 'going concern' with a future. I see no harm in them publishing these in an advertising book that illustrates future offerings. Clearly most of what will be produced in 2014 has already been announced.

 

 

That seems to be true, as far as manufacturers stocks are concerned, with the most popular models but not so true for the less popular items and not necessarily true for those retailers who try to keep a stock of items (if they can afford to).  In fact the latter is one reason why I like to support my 'most local' model shop as he does try to keep a stock but at the same time he needs the turnover of new, must have, items to sustain his cash flow.  But not all shops work like him especially some of the box-shifters who 'compete' by selling stuff at very small margins above cost relying purely on bulk to secure their eventually meagre net profits - in my view that distorts the market and in the end is doing nobody any good (but that's wandering of the subject so I'll say no more).

 

And the less popular items eventually get turfed out of the warehouses - as at the moment - with special deals and reduced prices, which again doesn't necessarily help those retailers who have tried to keep stocks of - say - Hawksworth coaches.

[leavesontheline]

That seems to be true, as far as manufacturers stocks are concerned, with the most popular models but not so true for the less popular items and not necessarily true for those retailers who try to keep a stock of items (if they can afford to).  In fact the latter is one reason why I like to support my 'most local' model shop as he does try to keep a stock but at the same time he needs the turnover of new, must have, items to sustain his cash flow.  But not all shops work like him especially some of the box-shifters who 'compete' by selling stuff at very small margins above cost relying purely on bulk to secure their eventually meagre net profits - in my view that distorts the market and in the end is doing nobody any good (but that's wandering of the subject so I'll say no more).

 

And the less popular items eventually get turfed out of the warehouses - as at the moment - with special deals and reduced prices, which again doesn't necessarily help those retailers who have tried to keep stocks of - say - Hawksworth coaches.

I'd agree with that. My local shop also gets all the latest 'must have' models through the doors whilst still keeping a healthy stock of items from the past few years. At present I'd say he has significantly more red boxes than blue on the shelves (which are fit to bursting with stock) and apart from re-pricing due to VAT changes the marked prices are generally as they were when the model was released. With the lull in new items this year I have been making the most of his stocks and at prices (with his normal 15-20% discount) that now look like bargains compared to current recommended and real world pricing. I've seen a number of new items on his shelves at significantly higher prices on ebay as second hand items!

 

Maybe in this age of online shopping it is too easy to forget that there are still shops out there that don't have a website, that don't come up on a Google search, and might just have that elusive model you are searching for! Reminds me of those Yellow Pages adverts from a few years ago.

 

I think I'll run out of cash before my local shop runs out of stock!

[Ian Hargrave]

So then,where is this fabled treasure trove?

[DonnyRailMan]

The 2013 catalogue makes interesting reading, but 2013 isn't over yet. 

 

Yours,

 

Eternally Optomistic

 

Over the past two year the Hornby Catalogue as been as costly comic to buy .

[Dunsignalling]

Over the past two year the Hornby Catalogue as been as costly comic to buy .

The way things have been going lately, maybe catalogues (and not just the Hornby ones) might regain a bit of credibility if they were only published every other year.

[brushman47544]

The way things have been going lately, maybe catalogues (and not just the Hornby ones) might regain a bit of credibility if they were only published every other year.

 

Won't happen. If nothing else, they're a way for the manufacturers to put down a marker for certain models thereby putting off their competitors from duplicating them. How long they take to appear is irrelevant in that context.

[andyman7]

We can't have the manufacturers do away with their catalogue - it is the only product that turns up on time year after year! 

[leavesontheline]

So then,where is this fabled treasure trove?

 

Hmmmmm - now there's a dilemma - reveal my secret 'stash' of future models or 'go public' on RMWeb and risk clearing the shelves of said stash!......... Well, as I said before I have pretty much maxed out my expendable income so far this year so what the hell - it would be nice if he got some additional sales out of this! (usual disclaimer applies - I have no link to the shop other than being a satisfied customer). It is Richards Railways in Yatton, just south of Bristol. Proper traditional model shop - tiny, stacked floor to ceiling, and every time I have removed a Hornby (or Bachmann for that matter) loco from the shelf it has been replaced with another from his stocks. I don't think even he knows exactly what he has got in stock at any one time! A genuine treasure trove, but don't all rush at once, there are still a couple more items on his shelves I have my eye on!!

[Ian Hargrave]

Hmmmmm - now there's a dilemma - reveal my secret 'stash' of future models or 'go public' on RMWeb and risk clearing the shelves of said stash!......... Well, as I said before I have pretty much maxed out my expendable income so far this year so what the hell - it would be nice if he got some additional sales out of this! (usual disclaimer applies - I have no link to the shop other than being a satisfied customer). It is Richards Railways in Yatton, just south of Bristol. Proper traditional model shop - tiny, stacked floor to ceiling, and every time I have removed a Hornby (or Bachmann for that matter) loco from the shelf it has been replaced with another from his stocks. I don't think even he knows exactly what he has got in stock at any one time! A genuine treasure trove, but don't all rush at once, there are still a couple more items on his shelves I have my eye on!!

Thank you for that.Long may they prosper...but way out of my area !

[The Stationmaster]

Thank you for that.Long may they prosper...but way out of my area !

There was quite a nice little treasure trove at the Farnham Show today - a couple of us reckoned the chap might well have stocked himself up with Hornby stuff that had been lurking within Modelzone and has presumably been disposed off at favourable prices as he was offering considerable discounts on things like Thompson non-gangwayed coaches, Gresley coaches , a Maunsell push-pull set and a 2-BIL among various other things.

[7013]

At Great Electric Train Show today Simon Kohler was cheerfully optimistic and engaging which was good to see given Hornby's problems being discussed on this thread. However at the outset of this thread I asked 'Where are the Hornby models?' Well at the show the Hornby Stand which was given over almost exclusively to the DCC control systems they market; however tucked in the front were examples of the Star, Hall and P2, The latter looked very nice and the first version is apparently going to be available next month. The Hall looked very good but it was difficult to get a good look, I may be wrong but it looked like the smoke box darts on one example were of the moulded kind, that said it looks very promising. The Star looks excellent and on first ( brief ) look it looked right up there with the Castle in quality.

Hornby may be in the doldrums at the moment but these three models reassure me at least that we should get behind Hornby and hope they get back up there with the best.

[The Stationmaster]

I suspect some aspects of the 'Star' regrettably fall a little short of the 'Castle' as some of the handrails are moulded - however samples seen to date might not reflect production reality of course, we'll have to wait and see.

[brushman47544]

My son's Collector magazine arrived today and lists a plethora of models to be released up to the early 4th quarter 2013, including:

All 6 great Gathering A4s,

Both standard and Railroad Duke of Gloucester models R3191, R3192 and R3168,

Stars R3166 Knight of the Grand Cross and R3167 Glastonbury Abbey,

Three Sentinels, and

R4353, R4354, R4355 mark 1 coaches (maroon?)

 

Let's hope they, and the others, do indeed arrive.

[coachmann]

According to one outlet all the Hornby futures and Bachmanns have been sold through the trade, whatever that is supposed to mean. The outlet is encouraging pre-orders. At least the GCR J11, GWR Dukedog and L&YR 2-4-2T are on thier way.

[The Stationmaster]

According to one outlet all the Hornby futures and Bachmanns have been sold through the trade, whatever that is supposed to mean. The outlet is encouraging pre-orders. At least the GCR J11, GWR Dukedog and L&YR 2-4-2T are on thier way.

What it means is that the 'manufacturer has sold out their entire stock to the retail trade (plus, I presume in the case of Hornby it also means their own direct sale operation and concessions are included in the 'sold out' category although the stuff actually isn't).  Sometimes retailers will say it in public to encourage buyers to pre-order with them as a sort of 'if you don't order it from me you won't get it anywhere else' type of linespin.

 

It is sometimes interesting to examine in retrospect what actually happens - for example  just under a year back the entire Hornby run of GW  8 coupled tank engines was 'sold out to the trade' - however once they actually started to arrive at Margate some of them were again appearing as 'available' on the Hornby trade website.  The reason for this happening is that either a previous order has been cancelled or equally it has been cancelled by Hornby because the retailer is out of credit or hasn't paid his invoices.  There is then - with Hornby - the complexities of exactly who they sell to as part of their stock is sold via a wholesaler and unlike Hornby themselves he will sell to traders who don't have retail premises - thus locos etc appear at shows with various traders when everyone is telling tales about them not being available (2 BILs area good example of that and it is now happening with some of the GW tank engines (which are definitely not ex Modelzone stock). 

 

Best advice in my view is to go to a retailer you know and hope he doesn't get rationed - a trick Hornby seem to be increasingly good at.