The Nth Degree Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 I've found a great thread here that identifies 08 variations and differences, along with loco numbers, but I'm looking for dates that the switch from vacuum was made – and also where those dual/air braked shunters went, if possible. Thanks in advance! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 96701 Posted October 31, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 31, 2013 I think you need to be a little more precise in your question. You need to explain your aim because with lots of 08s having been built over 60 years ago you've asked a very open ended question that is very difficult to answer. A bit of pinning down on decade and geography might help. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nth Degree Posted October 31, 2013 Author Share Posted October 31, 2013 Thanks Phil, I don't really know how to pin it down further so I'll ask the same question in a different way: The 08 was originally built with vacuum braking. At what point - or date – in its build history/conversion did dual or air braking first appear? The earliest date I can make out was around 1969ish, possibly into the early 70s, depending on which source you're reading. The purpose of me asking is that I've just bought an 08 kit with dual/air brakes and I'd like to model the earliest possible example, hopefully in green. Thanks again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 96701 Posted November 1, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 1, 2013 Is this any good to you? http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/76154-class-08s-in-green-with-air-brakes/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Pannier Tank Posted November 1, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 1, 2013 1968 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nth Degree Posted November 1, 2013 Author Share Posted November 1, 2013 1968 Thanks, do you have a reference for this somewhere so I can get loco numbers and options, especially for all those boxes and cabinets on the running plate. Cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Pannier Tank Posted November 1, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 1, 2013 Thanks, do you have a reference for this somewhere so I can get loco numbers and options, especially for all those boxes and cabinets on the running plate. Cheers My list you referred to above will help you with the Cabinets / doors etc. I do not have a compiled list of Dual / Air Brake conversion dates at the moment, if you have any particular Loco and / or depots that you are interested in I will try and help you further. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nth Degree Posted November 1, 2013 Author Share Posted November 1, 2013 Thanks. I've found this list on BR Database which is pretty handy. It will be a BR(E) shunter, so probably Colchester or March would suit me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rivercider Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 If it is any use I am looking at my first Ian Allan spotting book (the one with the Warship on the cover), details are said to be correct for December 1969. It lists the locos with air brake equipment, presumably all 08s in this list will be dual brake vac/air, air brake only 08s were much later. 3913, 3915, 3916, 3918, 3920, 3926, 3936 4003, 4004, 4040, 4041, 4042, 4045, 4048, 4099-4111, 4114, 4125-4128, 4130, 4162, 4166, 4169-4174. cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpion Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 4044 was another green dual braked one, it and 3913 were station pilots at Doncaster from 1971 to deal with the air braked Mk2s Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
br2975 Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 If it is any use I am looking at my first Ian Allan spotting book (the one with the Warship on the cover), details are said to be correct for December 1969. It lists the locos with air brake equipment, presumably all 08s in this list will be dual brake vac/air, air brake only 08s were much later. 3913, 3915, 3916, 3918, 3920, 3926, 3936 4003, 4004, 4040, 4041, 4042, 4045, 4048, 4099-4111, 4114, 4125-4128, 4130, 4162, 4166, 4169-4174. I've added the depot allocations to "Rivercider's" original list. . 3913 - 51L, 3915 - 52A, 3916 - 55H, 3918 - 30E, 3920 - 30A, 3926 - 52A, 3936 - 81A 4003 - 81A, 4004 - 84A, 4040 - 34G, 4041 - 34G, 4042 - 55H, 4045 - 41E, 4048 - 41E, 4099 - 73F, 4100 - 70D, 4101 - 73F, 4102 - 70B, 4103 - 70B, 4104 - 70B, 4105 - 70B, 4106 - 73F, 4107 - 73F, 4108 - 5A, 4109 - 75C, 4110 - 5A, 4111 - 5A, 4114 - 75C, 4125 - 82A, 4126 - 87E, 4127 - 86A, 4128 - 86A, 4130 - 83A, 4162 - 86B, 4166 - 82A, 4169 - 82A, 4170 - 86A, 4171 - 81F, 4172 - 87E, 4173 - 86B, 4174 - 87E. The allocations were correct to the dates shown below - the depot codes are explained for the benefit of younger members of RMweb. LMR - 01/11/1969 5A - Crewe ER - 25/10/1969 30A - Startford 30E - Colchester 34G - Finsbury Park 41E - Barrow Hill 51L - Thornaby 52A - Gateshead 55H - Leeds, Neville Hill SR - 26/08/1969 70B - Feltham 70D - Eastleigh 73F - Ashford, Chart Leacon 75C - Selhurst WR - 27/09/1969 81A - Old Oak Common 81F - Oxford 82A - Bristol, Bath Rd. 83A - Newton Abbot 84A - Plymouth, Laira 86A - Cardiff, Canton 86B - Newport, Ebbw Jct. 87E - Swansea, Landore Source - my Ian Allan Locoshed Book 1970. (i) I didn't realise Feltham depot was still open at that time, and (ii) suspect the two locos at Barrow Hill were for shunting MGR stock ? All you need to do now, is find out what each of the TOPS numbers were for the locos above, then visit http://www.railblue.com/rail_blue_history_2.htm where you can find out which ones were renumbered whilst still in green livery. EDIT:- My own records suggest the locos above that are underlined later ran with TOPS numbers, in green livery, - I'm open to correction. . Brian R Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Downendian Posted November 24, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 24, 2015 Been carrying out research on two 08s and one 09 that I'm renumbering/detailing from the latest Hornby models. Mine will be in mid 1970s mode. On looking at my reference volumes the following 08s were dual braked in late 1973: (Sorry using new currency) 08 525-544, 600, 627, 640-646, 647-655, 688, 737-768, 830, 832, 835-838, 872-887, 892, 895-898, 900-927, 929, 932, 936, 939-951, 953-957. 09 001-026. By July 1978 Air braked only 08 243, 388, 411, 414, 418, 428, 441, 442, 445, 460, 480, 483-485, 489, 493, 506/7, 509/10, 512/4, 517/8, 521, 600, 621, 627, 661, 678, 688, 700, 703, 806, 810, 811, 814, 816, 823-825, 827-829. Dual braked 08 525-544, 640-655, 737-768, 830-859, 872-958, 09 001-026 Sources Ian Allan combined volume 1974, ICRS Shed78 (the latter being an excellent source of data on snow plough brackets, radio antennae fittings etc). The Combine does not specify air braked only, so the 1978 air braked only fitted may have been so in 1973. Now back to Bath road allocations and liveries before doing a blue 08. Big surprise that in the mid 70s the bulk of the 08 fleet were still Vac only. Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Clive Mortimore Posted November 24, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 24, 2015 Been carrying out research on two 08s and one 09 that I'm renumbering/detailing from the latest Hornby models. Mine will be in mid 1970s mode. On looking at my reference volumes the following 08s were dual braked in late 1973: (Sorry using new currency) 08 525-544, 600, 627, 640-646, 647-655, 688, 737-768, 830, 832, 835-838, 872-887, 892, 895-898, 900-927, 929, 932, 936, 939-951, 953-957. 09 001-026. By July 1978 Air braked only 08 243, 388, 411, 414, 418, 428, 441, 442, 445, 460, 480, 483-485, 489, 493, 506/7, 509/10, 512/4, 517/8, 521, 600, 621, 627, 661, 678, 688, 700, 703, 806, 810, 811, 814, 816, 823-825, 827-829. Dual braked 08 525-544, 640-655, 737-768, 830-859, 872-958, 09 001-026 Sources Ian Allan combined volume 1974, ICRS Shed78 (the latter being an excellent source of data on snow plough brackets, radio antennae fittings etc). The Combine does not specify air braked only, so the 1978 air braked only fitted may have been so in 1973. Now back to Bath road allocations and liveries before doing a blue 08. Big surprise that in the mid 70s the bulk of the 08 fleet were still Vac only. Neil Hi Neil Most stock, irrespective of what type of train brake it is fitted with, is shunted as if it has no brake but the handbrake. The brake release valve is opened to either destroy the vacuum or let the air out making the wagon, coach etc. an unfitted vehicle. The shunting loco might have vacuum brake exhauster fitted but not always used. Some stock is shunted as whole trains and then the shunting loco would be using the train brake system. Stock marked "Not to be lose shunted" always had to have a loco with a compatible braking system attached. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rivercider Posted November 24, 2015 Share Posted November 24, 2015 Been carrying out research on two 08s and one 09 that I'm renumbering/detailing from the latest Hornby models. Now back to Bath road allocations and liveries before doing a blue 08. Big surprise that in the mid 70s the bulk of the 08 fleet were still Vac only. Neil The 1979 edition of the Inter City Railway Society Shunter Duties book shows that even in 1979 only six Bath Road shunter duties, out of fifteen, required an air braked 08. The six air braked duties were:- Westbury Up Yard (shunting stone traffic in PGAs and PTAs) Bristol Temple Meads West End (passenger) Bristol Temple Meads East End (passenger) Malago Vale Carriage Sidings Marsh Junction DMU (and possibly Enparts trip) St Phillips Marsh HST, fitted with HST drawbar coupling (08643 was one) cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Stock marked "Not to be lose shunted" always had to have a loco with a compatible braking system attached. Officially! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
40044 Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Stock marked "Not to be lose shunted" always had to have a loco with a compatible braking system attached.Stock attached to a loco without a compatible brake would be classed as 'loose coupled'. Loose-shunted is shunting without a loco attached at all. There are countless photos out there of stock marked 'not to be loose shunted' being conveyed in unfitted trains. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vin Posted November 25, 2015 Share Posted November 25, 2015 Hi all, Is this video an example of wagons marked 'not to be loose or hump shunted'? https://youtu.be/mwJvFfZaQ7k Regards Vin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted November 25, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 25, 2015 Excellent video, can't believe that that was 25 years ago it just seems like last week. Even after the hump closed there was always loads of freight around Tinsley Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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