Why have moving trains on layouts?

[Robin2]

I've just been thinking about what makes a "good" model railway and it struck me that almost all of the modeling skills could be perfectly displayed on a static layout - research, design and construction of landscape, buildings and rolling stock. And I have no doubt that good model railways are as much works of art as paintings or sculpture.

 

So, to put it crudely, what does it add to the model to have trains that can move and mimic the movement of real trains? 

 

Even at the large stations such as Birmingham New Street the predominant "dynamic" is the absence of train movements.

 

Yet very many modelers seem to attach more value to the dynamic rather than the static aspects of their models.

 

I'm interested to read people's opinions.

 

...R

 

(Ps I have seen the Topic "Railway modelers – ‘Atmosphere modelers?’ ", but it's focus is different, I think)

 

[edcayton]

For me, that is where the FUN lies. I think there is a magic in turning a knob and a train moving. What makes model railways special is that you can mimic most of the prototype movements in a way that, say, slot cars never could.

 

Ed

[chaz]

Brings to mind a cartoon I saw in a mag' a long time ago. Two modellers are standing in front of a model with only trees and fields visible. One was saying to the other "I've modelled the branch terminus ten years before it was built".

[47137]

1. Movement adds spectacle, which is good for exhibitions.

2. Movement provides a common link between modellers with different interests e.g. at club level.

3. Movement shows me I have achieved an acceptable level of performance.

 

But for me, I get quickly bored with operation. I am happier planning and making things.

 

Richard.

[Trains&armour]

For me, the static aspects of modelling are more important. But then, I'm predominantly a modeller of objects, be it plains,armour ships, buildings or trains. That said, I do feel that in a landscape context (which a layout is all about, be it urban or rural) movement is an important factor. When you're in the real world even in the most remote locations there is is movement around you everywhere. And the movement of model trains in a layout adds,however crudely,  some of that sense of being in a real location.

My two cents

[Welly]

Layout with no moving trains? Let's see layouts based on closed stations before the demolition train arrives!

[colin penfold]

Maybe another way to look at this is "why do ONLY the trains move?" We worry about the minutest detail in some aspects, yet we suspend disbelief in relation to the trains arriving at the platform and nobody moves. Doors remain shut, nobody gets on or off. Same people on the platform after it leaves. Same (with some notable exceptions) applies to road vehicles and the rest of human and animal kind. On the other hand the quality of operation on some exhibition layouts suggests they were primarily built to be photgraphed.

[Flood]

By modelling a Coaching Stock Depot Glenn and I can not only exhibit the skills of making a realistic depot scene but as single rake of stock tends to stay on the layout for about an hour (albeit with some shunt movements during that time) the viewer also has an opportunity to peruse the stock as they wish.

 

By having the trains move we are then able to not only bring other stock into the scene for more interest but also replicate the operating sequences and complications of a full size depot. In addition we can show the effort we have gone to to ensure that our trains run smoothly.

 

In the end though I think that most visitors to model railway exhibitions are there to see moving trains not, what may well be, a beautifully modelled static scene.

[Ravenser]

A key question - from whose perspective are we viewing this? 

 

- That of the owner or operator of the layout?

 

edcayton:

For me, that is where the FUN lies. I think there is a magic in turning a knob and a train moving.

 

43137

But for me, I get quickly bored with operation. I am happier planning and making things.

 

 

- That of a  spectator at a show?

 

Flood

 

....the viewer also has an opportunity to peruse the stock as they wish....

 

 

In the end though I think that most visitors to model railway exhibitions are there to see moving trains not, what may well be, a beautifully modelled static scene

 

 

 

The obvious answer would be that railways are a dynamic system existing in time- you know that the railway's open and "alive" because trains run on it, and the train service is a key part of its identity

 

And secondly and very importantly because it gives you something to play with - you can run a railway yourself. Operational interest

[hornbyandbf3fan]

Isn't having moving trains the whole point?  

[Guest Celticwardog]

As my preference is for the scenics I think a layout CAN look good with little movement Cliffhanger doesn't have a huge amount going on but its great. You could have no movement as in a diorama or tablaeu but only if it was small. If you had a large layout with nothing happening that would look a bit odd. You may as well build a 1/76 model village and not include the tracks. It may still look great but it wouldn't then be a "layout" would it.

[black and decker boy]

Moving trains means you can hide the imperfections in your modelling a bit. A static train would encourage closer scrutiny and fault finding. It would also get very boring very quickly. A few static trains dotted around can add interest and we all have more trains than running lines but to have them all static would not be too much fun to me.

 

Little jonny would not pay £5 to see 15 static train sets.

 

It's a bit like saying why do RC plane / car enthusiasts want them to move & fly when you cannot ride in them.

[melmerby]

Brings to mind a cartoon I saw in a mag' a long time ago. Two modellers are standing in front of a model with only trees and fields visible. One was saying to the other "I've modelled the branch terminus ten years before it was built".

Or ten years after it closed?

 

Keith

[Nelson Jackson]

What do you see when you go out train spotting?

Answer = trains moving? (Majority of trains moving)

So why not replicate this in model form, which is why I think loads of people represent trains moving on their layout.

[Robin2]

Thank you everyone for your very interesting and thought provoking comments. Please keep them coming.

 

 

 

 

 

I don't think the comparison with model planes and cars is appropriate. There is considerable skill in flying a plane and not crashing it and I think most people race the cars. Model boats might be a better analogy - though some of them are raced also.

 

...R

 

It's a bit like saying why do RC plane / car enthusiasts want them to move & fly when you cannot ride in them.

[APOLLO]

Model railway of the future - 50 years hence, A 3D hologram projected onto a board / into a room perhaps, or viewed wearing special glasses / headset. The technology already exists, but will vastly improve & become cheaper with time.

 

It will not be modelling though. No sense of creation, actually making something with your own hands etc.

 

It will not be for me either, rmweb is just about enough !!

 

A non moving model railway - I'd call that a Diorama.

 

Brit15

[James Makin]

Fantastic point!

 

Like some others, my fun in the hobby is purely the painting and bashing side, if I'm honest I don't greatly enjoy operating the fruits of my labours as much as building them! The fun's kind of been spent really, on to the next project.

 

Prototype inspiration can strike at any point - from fast moving HSTs or multiple commuter trains racing each other through the south London approaches, but I can similarly spend hours soaking up atmosphere viewing yards and sidings where nothing moves for ages.

 

One of my very best railway moments so far has been sheltering from a thunderstorm at Didcot on platform 5 with only a pair of stabled '66's for company, pipes clanking away and steaming as the cold rain hit their warm roof panels...amazing!

[Mrkirtley800]

I was talking with an artist friend one day some years ago, and we were discussing the merits of our individual interests. He enjoys sculpture. My point to him was that he models in three dimensions, but we railway modellers work in four dimensions, the fourth being realistic movement. If we built layouts which didn't move, we would be losing a principle dimension of our hobby. That is why I think that we should model movement. However, a model railway, no matter how nice to look at and how carefully built is nothing if it doesn't run properly, and I have seen plenty of those in my time.

Derek

[andyram]

Perhaps we could just point out the basic point. Model railways are models of railways and on railways things move!!!!!

[corax67]

Whilst I consider myself predominantly a builder and fettler, my layout provides me with a scene on which I can showcase my trains & rolling stock and relax by running trains after a busy day.

 

Probably the biggest bugbear of people who attend shows is a lack of moving rolling stock irrespective of the level of detail and attention which may have been lavished on the layout.

[asmay2002]

Perhaps we could just point out the basic point. Model railways are models of railways and on railways things move!!!!!

 Paintings are paintings of real things which move.  It doesn't follow that just because something moves the model of it has to.  In most military modelling things don't move.

[Baby Deltic]

1. Movement adds spectacle, which is good for exhibitions.

2. Movement provides a common link between modellers with different interests e.g. at club level.

3. Movement shows me I have achieved an acceptable level of performance.

 

But for me, I get quickly bored with operation. I am happier planning and making things.

 

Richard.

I think a movement is best before the exhibition.

[vulcanbomber]

I used spend most of my time on buildings the layout and doing very little running.

However having a granddaughter has changed all that, the first thing she asks when she arrives, is can we run the trains grandpa?

Hence the addition of lots of lighting etc.

[rodshaw]

For many people, the whole point of a model railway is operation. This can even be at the expense of the layout's appearance. In the US, in particular, large groups gather for operating sessions. Even on a small layout, operation means playability - catering to the inner child.

 

But if moving trains aren't important to you - just think of the advantages. You can build locos without motors and don't have to worry about the free running of any of your stock. You don't need to invest in controllers, point motors or wiring. You could even glue the trains to the track to ensure they really don't move!

[The Bigbee Line]

It's a bit like cinema ; Lights, Action, Roll'em

 

Seriously for me it's all about movement; at a realistic speed (as anyone who has shunted at 12" to 1', creeping about is no good, must be done with purpose) and in a sequence that bears some resemblance to reality.  I particularly like to see a long train snaking though some pointwork.