Simond Posted October 27, 2019 Author Share Posted October 27, 2019 The dilemma... The individual axlebox subassemblies (on the left) are not really, comfortably, thick enough to drill spring pockets into. If I were to assemble the axlebox completely, I could easily drill the pockets, but then I’d need to cut away the keepers so I could assemble the boxes onto the W irons. This would also make access easier for drilling the pocket in the spring. But, then, of course, I’d need to remake them. Remaking the keeps is not a big issue, microstrip will do. I can use wire for the tiebars. Will refer to the other thread before doing anything permanent... atb Simon 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted October 27, 2019 Author Share Posted October 27, 2019 No more tonight, axleboxes glued, and will harden overnight. Keepers removed, managed to keep the tie rods. Will adjust and drill everything tomorrow evening. So much for a quick build! atb Simon 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hal Nail Posted October 27, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 27, 2019 (edited) Do you think the axle box needs to be a fairly precise fit ie to slide up and down with minimal play, or fairly sloppy? I've had trouble with it all binding up before and even if I get a good slide, painting invariably messes with it anyway! Edit: just spotted your photo on Ramchester of the signalman contemplating exactly this issue! Edited October 28, 2019 by Hal Nail Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giles Posted October 28, 2019 Share Posted October 28, 2019 Re binding up, I would suggest that (after painting) if you have working clearance but it is still reluctant to slide due to general 'stickiness', that you brush in talcum powder, and work it around (and then get rid of the excess). Talcum powder makes a very good polish for this sort of thing, and gives you a silky smooth surface. 2 1 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Happy Hippo Posted October 28, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 28, 2019 1 hour ago, Giles said: Re binding up, I would suggest that (after painting) if you have working clearance but it is still reluctant to slide due to general 'stickiness', that you brush in talcum powder, and work it around (and then get rid of the excess). Talcum powder makes a very good polish for this sort of thing, and gives you a silky smooth surface. I never thought of using talc. Instead I use ground up pencil leads as a dry lubricant, although it's a bit more mucky 4 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted October 28, 2019 Author Share Posted October 28, 2019 (edited) A little progress on the van; I have now drilled the axleboxes and the springs for guide wires, but not yet fitted the springs. It was necessary to add a small piece of PK to the axleboxes to get the top to an even height, as you can see in the second picture. I’m waiting for it all to harden off before opening out the spring pockets. I’ve added buffers, and substituted a set of Premier components’ screw couplings for the 3-links provided. The latest couplings from Premier are steel in place of brass, and I have blackened them with gun blue, and loosened them ever so slightly, so they do not bind on the shackle hinges. I have a pet hate of brass coupling hooks on otherwise entirely believable models, hopefully with steel ones available now, that’ll be less evident in photos! I’ll get the suspension working before attacking the brakes, steps, handrails & fiddly details. I don’t want to put the roof on until I’ve added some weight, and I’m not yet sure how much is required. Probably an ounce/25g per axle as usual. And I’ll cut the “L” shaped protectors off when I’m confident that I’ll not knock off the little rods that protrude, though they’re not obvious in the photo; Plate 593 in Atkins, Beard & Tourret shows an X9 in the later lettering style & confirms the screw couplers. I’m going for big red letters! I have some thoughts about this process, not all of which are positive. More anon. And you can see one of the two 1/4” holes I drilled in the floor to ensure that there are no vapours trapped in the van. You can’t see the piece of PK that fits across inside to stop any clumsy handling causing damage. More tomorrow Simon Edited October 28, 2019 by Simond 6 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted October 29, 2019 Author Share Posted October 29, 2019 Ok, moment of truth time... I’ve epoxied short lengths of NS wire into the tops of the axleboxes to ensure the springs can’t escape, and these engage in clearance holes in the spring buckles, which is my understanding of how Jeff did his in the tread that set me off... I also drilled sockets into the buckles to receive & locate the springs. Herewith a photo of the prepared axleboxes and W irons - I’ll use microstrip to reinstate the keepers. The other axle is already assembled, the wire is keeping the springs compressed so I can glue the keepers on. wish me luck, chaps, here goes... 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Major Posted October 29, 2019 Share Posted October 29, 2019 I watch with interest. As you ask -- Good Luck! I am sure will do your usual quality job. Ian. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted October 29, 2019 Author Share Posted October 29, 2019 Thanks Ian, just waiting for the epoxy to set on the vac pipes, I glued them on whilst waiting for the solvent to evaporate, we shall see if it has all been worthwhile in a very few minutes. Simon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold MarshLane Posted October 29, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 29, 2019 I feel this is one of those occasions for a low level drum roll in the background...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted October 29, 2019 Author Share Posted October 29, 2019 (edited) Well, perhaps not drumrolls, but a smile for sure. It’s a whole lot of fiddle & faff to do, and I had pretty much decided never to do it again, but I am really impressed with the way it rolls - it very definitely runs smoothly, better than my compensated PD Felix Pole wagons, and my rigid chassis Coopercraft ones. And somewhat surprisingly, it’s quieter too. I initially added about 35g of lead, and its all-up weight was 110g. There’s a few bits of plastic to add, which won’t make much odds. It was sitting a little higher than I would have liked, but nothing beyond the usual range of wagon heights. After a bit of a play, I’ve added another couple of bits of lead, and it’s now 177g, and the buffer heights are pretty much spot on. I’ll epoxy them in tomorrow and then finish it. g’night all Simon Edited October 30, 2019 by Simond 8 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold MarshLane Posted October 29, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 29, 2019 6 minutes ago, Simond said: Well, perhaps not drumrolls, but a smile for sure. It’s a whole lot of fiddle & faff to do, and I had pretty much decided never to do it again, but I am really impressed with the way it rolls - it very definitely runs smoothly, better than my compensated PD Felix Pole wagons, and my rigid chassis Coopercraft ones. Simon Well done Simon, it looks good. Despite all the "fiddle & faff" its always demoralising when its doesn't work as you hoped, and immensely satisfying when it does, so enjoy the latter experience Rich 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted October 30, 2019 Author Share Posted October 30, 2019 Thanks Rich. so, if I assume that I could have built the van to painting stage on Sunday evening if I hadn’t gone chasing rainbows, I estimate it’s at least an hour, possibly a bit more modelling time, to upgrade the kit. Which is fine, but remains a consideration. Now, meat vans ran in blocks because they supplied the Smithfield market, and at least one ran directly from the port, Birkenhead, where the Irish beef imports landed, so would run to suit the tides. One meat van might be acceptable, but it should likely be a rake of 6, 10, lots... and the kits cost around £36 each. A rake might get costly, and time consuming, so I’m developing a cunning plan involving photocopiers, card, MSF and lasers. And etched brass chassis. Anyone remember Peco Wonderful Wagons? atb Simon 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
O-Gauge-Phil Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 Well that was really interesting, I wondered what someone with your engineering prowess would make of the problem. Of coarse this being the first is going to take a lot longer, I tend to faff when I'm unsure of what I'm doing, always takes ten times longer than when you are confident. Building a batch and with hindsight you can plan your day so bits can be left overnight drying. I personally dislike rigid as they tend to rattle but as you said sprung with some weight they just glide. Strange how you can just tell they are heavy. With a project as big as yours time management must be critical and in a large rake I doubt if you could tell much difference between rocking and sprung. Shunting a single sprung wagon however is just sooo nice. love the build most enjoyable. Phil 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hal Nail Posted October 30, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 30, 2019 4 hours ago, Simond said: One meat van might be acceptable, but it should likely be a rake of 6, 10, lots... and the kits cost around £36 each. Pity the bulk discount for 6 or more went when the range was sold. On top of that, you'd have to source enpugh springs as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WM183 Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 That is amazing! I decided just to go for a rocking axle on one end of my current build, but now I may want to try this. That looks good! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WM183 Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 2 hours ago, Hal Nail said: Pity the bulk discount for 6 or more went when the range was sold. On top of that, you'd have to source enpugh springs as well. Doesn't Eileen's offer discounts for 4+? And I know I have a ton of small springs that I bought from NWSL, an American firm, for springing hornblocks in brass locomotives. They'd probably be about right? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
N15class Posted October 30, 2019 Share Posted October 30, 2019 When I sprung mine Simon, I drilled the axle box under the springs and put a peg in the spring. I just copied the way Haywood do theirs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted October 31, 2019 Author Share Posted October 31, 2019 Thanks all, I’m sure it could be simplified, and perhaps the Haywood solution is what I should have done. Without some seriously fiddly measurements, working out a ride height before drilling the spring pockets is challenging. It now rides with maybe 0.5mm of “bump” travel and 1.5-2mm of droop. The latter is more important for staying on the track, the former for smoothness, so I’d suggest I’ve got it about right. but I’m still pondering alternatives.... atb Simon 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted November 3, 2019 Author Share Posted November 3, 2019 Just needs handrails fitting, then we’re off to the paint shop. I was a bit concerned about the brakes as they were hard on the wheels when it’s upside down, but they don’t bind at all when the wagon is sitting on its wheels. The springs seem to have settled, it’s right down, which is a tad frustrating, I rather preferred some up movement as well as droop, but it’s not to be. It’s not coming apart again... That roof needs to snug down a bit more! atb Simon 9 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Adrian Stevenson Posted November 3, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 3, 2019 Hi Simon, I have followed this with interest. I have found that the camera always picks up imperfections that the naked eye sometimes misses... Cheers, Ade. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted November 4, 2019 Author Share Posted November 4, 2019 (edited) Roof rather more firmly settled, and all the body ironwork installed. The kit is provided with 0.4mm brass, which looks too small to my eye (it would be about 5/8” in old money) for the handrails, but reasonable for the door pulls, etc, so the handrails were made from 0.7mm NS, just under 1.25”. Paint next. Two major options present themselves; blast all over with Halfords white primer (and then handpaint the non-white bits), or more measured approach using thinned Vallejo in the airbrush (which will still require some touching-up by hand). I’ve not tried the latter, so it would be an excursion out of the comfort zone, but I suspect it’s the right answer. I could use thinned enamel, but it doesn’t seem logical any more. I think I’ll try to paint a beer can tomorrow and see how I get on. If it goes well, I could be cautious and wait a day, before painting the model, but that would mean cleaning the airbrush twice... The footsteps on the ends are a PITA. Despite using actual MEK several of them required repair on more than one occasion. Happily didn’t lose any. They seem pretty well stuck now, fingers crossed they stay that way! Atb Simon Edited November 4, 2019 by Simond 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
N15class Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 Hope you will empty said can first, might get a few spares. I've not sprayed acrylics, but I'm sure somewhere I heard windscreen wash makes a suitable thinner retardant, but please I've never tried. Anyway the wagon looks the business. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Mikkel Posted November 4, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 4, 2019 Better hurry up with the painting, that bloke next to the van needs cheering up! It will be interesting to see how you get on with airbrushed Vallejo, if that's what you decide. Enjoy the beer! 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted November 8, 2019 Author Share Posted November 8, 2019 Acrylic spray paint is a good solution! Happy with that, hand painted the black (in dark grey) and will apply transfers when I and the wagon next coincide in time and space. photos to follow atb Simon 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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