Concrete

[ThePurplePrimer]

Hi

 

Can anyone tell me a little about the dating of concrete things on the SR ?

 

What I mean is there any easily accessible information about when it started to come in and what kind of structures etc they used and when those came in ?

[grandadbob]

Quite a lot of information on Southern structures can be found on http://www.semgonline.com/home.html

Edited December 14, 2013 by grandadbob

[bécasse]

The LSWR had already created a concrete-product factory at Exmouth Junction before the Southern Railway was formed in 1923. The SR quickly saw the potential of concrete and the Exmouth Junction works were considerably expanded in the mid-1920s and some of the familiar designs date from then. However, design work continually evolved, even post-nationalisation and into the 1960s, and many product designs were only topical for a decade or two.

 

To give just four examples:

 

There were several very different designs of station running-in name board as the design evolved; they couldn't be re-used elsewhere so the design used at any location was specific to the period when the boards were installed.

 

The "classic" permanent way hut with the clipped roof (to ensure that they stayed within loading gauge when conveyed to/from site) was a post-war (effectively post-nationalisation) design quite out of place on a Southern Railway layout.

 

There were two basic designs of the "classic" footbridge which may look superficially similar but are actually quite different, and, again, one was older and one was newer, but here reuse of the old design was possible (but didn't happen very often).

 

An early product of the expanded Exmouth Junction works was concrete signal posts and these were widely used by the SR for perhaps two or three years in the mid-1920s. They were found to be less versatile than had been anticipated and were quickly discontinued. However, post-nationalisation a new design of concrete bracket signal post was developed and examples were installed at a number of locations during the Brighton line London area resignalling of the early 1950s (and one or two may still exist) but nowhere else.

Edited December 14, 2013 by bécasse

[sem34090]

Regarding concrete bits, I have several questions. 

 

- When was the style of Concrete platform modelled by PECO introduced?

- The same question, but for the Concrete Panel fencing. I gather there are multiple designs of this - which is the earliest?

- And what about the date for the Concrete Lamposts (as per the Ratio ones)? I gather there are several variants of these, so which is the earliest?

- Regarding Running-in boards, is the earliest design the one with the more ornate finials on each end, as per many Isle of Wight Stations and still in place at Havenstreet?

 

I ask these questions for a layout set very much pre-WWII, and with its last supposed great infrastructure change was between 1927 and 1931. The station building is of roughly 1926 design (see Havenstreet) but I imagine this can be slightly flexible. The platform edging is the PECO product.

[Wickham Green]

On 14/12/2013 at 16:31, bécasse said:

........ The "classic" permanent way hut with the clipped roof (to ensure that they stayed within loading gauge when conveyed to/from site) was a post-war (effectively post-nationalisation) design quite out of place on a Southern Railway layout. .......

Many, many yonks ago I borrowed the Southern Wagon Diagram Book from the HMRS library and - among other investigations - tried in vain to find what wagon these huts were carried on ( comparing roof shape with loading gauge gave a very specific floor height ) .............. it was only years later - probably when "Southern Nouveau" was published - that I found that they weren't carried on Southern wagons at all !

[Ian Morgan]

4 hours ago, Wickham Green said:

Many, many yonks ago I borrowed the Southern Wagon Diagram Book from the HMRS library and - among other investigations - tried in vain to find what wagon these huts were carried on ( comparing roof shape with loading gauge gave a very specific floor height ) .............. it was only years later - probably when "Southern Nouveau" was published - that I found that they weren't carried on Southern wagons at all !

 

What were they carried on, then? I thought I remembered seeing a photo somewhere.

[Ian Morgan]

On 19/07/2019 at 23:45, sem34090 said:

- When was the style of Concrete platform modelled by PECO introduced?

 

Their N gauge platform edging does not seem to conform to any Southern prototype I am aware of. The OO version is more familiar.

 

I can thoroughly recommend the book "Southern Nouveau", if you can find a copy.

[Wickham Green]

46 minutes ago, Ian Morgan said:

 

What were they carried on, then? I thought I remembered seeing a photo somewhere.

Can't remember exact details but I think I recall a pair of open goods wagons with the bodies removed - one ex LMS and one ex LNER ....................................... but don't take my word for it !

[Dunsignalling]

5 hours ago, Wickham Green said:

Many, many yonks ago I borrowed the Southern Wagon Diagram Book from the HMRS library and - among other investigations - tried in vain to find what wagon these huts were carried on ( comparing roof shape with loading gauge gave a very specific floor height ) .............. it was only years later - probably when "Southern Nouveau" was published - that I found that they weren't carried on Southern wagons at all !

 

51 minutes ago, Ian Morgan said:

 

Their N gauge platform edging does not seem to conform to any Southern prototype I am aware of. The OO version is more familiar.

 

I can thoroughly recommend the book "Southern Nouveau", if you can find a copy.

Not in Southern Railway days is what I think he means.

 

 The wagons used were converted from the Dia.1773 15-ton drop-side engineers wagon (designated "Ling" under BR), and could carry one of the standard huts and one of the smaller tool huts that were often found alongside them. Pics in Southern wagons Vol.4 pps 127/8.

 

It also states that the huts went into production in 1946.

 

Note also that there are two incarnations of Southern Nouveau, the original paperback and a more recent, much-expanded hardback.

 

John 

Edited July 22, 2019 by Dunsignalling

[melmoth]

Both editions of "Southern Nouveau" are out of print, but the more recent one was published by Irwell (isbn 9781911262022). 

[Goldhawk]

On 22/07/2019 at 17:06, melmoth said:

Both editions of "Southern Nouveau" are out of print, but the more recent one was published by Irwell (isbn 9781911262022). 

Irwell Press have announced reprint "by popular demand" this month.