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Hello all,

 

N Gauge Society members should be receiving their Journals about now, and will see on p7 the announcement of a proposed modern image commission.

 

This is an effort to answer criticism that the NGS's RTR projects have been too biased towards the BR steam/diesel transition era.

 

The options are:

 

Mk1 Pullman PSP 99347 in West Coast maroon.

 

post-420-0-77735300-1387119170_thumb.jpg

(Photo courtesy Mike Wallington)

 

 

JJA Autoballaster GERS12904 in Carillion maroon/cream

 

post-420-0-36336100-1387119186_thumb.jpg

(Photo courtesy Robert Stevens)

 

 

Mk2a BSO 977337 in Network Rail yellow

 

post-420-0-98851000-1387119289_thumb.jpg

(Photo courtesy Andy Jupe)

 

Mk2 TSO 5350 in Riviera trains chocolate and cream.

 

post-420-0-98240300-1387119299.jpg

(Photo courtesy Hugh Llewellyn)

 

 

Whichever model reaches 350 pre orders will be commissioned; if none reach this number then the project will not proceed. No monies are being sought at this time; just expressions of interest. Details of how to indicate which you would buy are in the journal. The deadline is Feb 28th at which date we will collate all the data and see if any models have reached the threshold.

 

If this project is a success then it may be that others can be forthcoming, however in the past N Gauge Limited run commissions have proved to be relatively poor sellers compared to OO. Any questions please ask!

 

cheers

 

Ben A.

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however in the past N Gauge Limited run commissions have proved to be relatively poor sellers compared to OO.

Perhaps there is a reason?

 

Here we have 4 very limited interest items. How many N modellers model yellow? How many autobalasters does one need? Even the other two coaches might have limited appeal. Mk1 Pullman probably stands best chance if you model that era and WR. The Mk2 again is a very small niche within a niche.

 

I'm not trying to pour oil on the water, but isn't there more common options/gaps to fill where modellers are more likely to order in greater numbers?

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Hi Ben,

 

Great to see this initiative under way - a very sensible way of proceeding. I presume the NGS magazine will contain details of how to register interest.

 

To answer one of Kenton's comments - although I already have 45 autoballasters, some more are always welcome, especially in a new livery, so I'll be ordering at least 5.

 

Cheers,

Dave

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Hello Kenton,

 

Interesting question!  To give some context to the selections, the criteria was that the options had to be:

 

1)  Suitable for present day, since NGS RTR products so far (even in EWS liveries) aren't, with the exception of the Snowplough.

2)  A relivery of existing model rather than expensive new tooling.

3)  Unlikely to be produced in Farish standard range.

4)  Based on "new generation" models (ie not Farish Mk3 or Mk4 reliveries)

 

I think all four are pretty good contenders on that basis.  What models did you have in mind?  If there are better selections then I'd be interested to hear them!

 

cheers

 

Ben A.

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Ben,

 

how about Mk2a in something like Regional Railways , Scotrail , Transpennine or NSE? the BSO alone is probably not worthwhile , but I'd have thought a TSO in one of those would be popular and sell multiple quantities - Bachmann themselves claim that NSE is not that popular , so perhaps a smaller overall quantity might sell enough?

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In answer to Kenton's question - lots of peoples want yellow! My own model range aside, talking to Bachmann apparently the network rail coaches they produced this year were among their fastest selling items, and they are keen to bring out as much as they can (affordably) in yellow.

 

David

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Ben,

 

how about Mk2a in something like Regional Railways , Scotrail , Transpennine or NSE? the BSO alone is probably not worthwhile , but I'd have thought a TSO in one of those would be popular and sell multiple quantities - Bachmann themselves claim that NSE is not that popular , so perhaps a smaller overall quantity might sell enough?

 

Hi Supaned,

 

In the first instance "present day" items were chosen as it was felt that NGS members modelling that era had been hardest done by.  Even our EWS-liveried models are pushing it a bit for post 2000.  For sectorisation era modellers the picture is better.

 

Nonetheless, if this project is a success I see no reason why a similar line up of sectorisation possibles should not be considered.  However, probably makes sense to hold off on any wishlisting until we know whether any of these models have reached the finish line at the end of February.

 

cheers

 

Ben A.

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Could the NGS not open this up to non members, that would then give any project the best possible chance of life.

 

Money earned could then be ploughed back into the society to maintain it's running, to encourage membership the price could be at a premium for non members.

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Could the NGS not open this up to non members, that would then give any project the best possible chance of life.

 

Money earned could then be ploughed back into the society to maintain it's running, to encourage membership the price could be at a premium for non members.

 

Non-members could always join. Also, as clearly stated on the website products cannot be sold to non-members for tax reasons.

 

As for the models I would be interested in the first three but I don't like committing to purchasing anything which may turn out to be a dud. This still happens, look at the Dapol IC executive hauled coaches which are labelled as HST trailers.

 

Can anyone confirm if the Carillion Autoballasters only run in similarly livered sets?

 

I also agree that some of the liveries which Fairish avoid should be looked at, given that some of the 'liveries which don't sell', including NSE were as much to so with poor models as the livery.

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My only gripe with having to join is that models often run late. You end up joining one year to pay the deposit, then having to join again in the year when the model is finally released, to pay the balance.

 

It works out very expensive for anyone not really interested in N gauge issues as such. I joined up and paid a deposit for one model, but decided paying another year's subs was a cost too far - so I never got the model I put the deposit down on.

 

Perhaps there could be a reduced membership fee for people who don't want all the strings attached to normal membership.

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For me the Mk1 Pullman is a good idea, as these run in West Coast Trains formations that turn up all over the place including on steam specials.  These are otherwise mostly formed of maroon Mk1s which can easily be modified from the Farish ones, though for the perfectionists some maroon Mk1s on B4 bogies and a maroon Mk2 brake would complete the set accurately. 

 

I can see that the choc/cream Mk2 is aimed at the same market, but does it not need a brake in the same livery to make up a train? 

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My only gripe with having to join is that models often run late. You end up joining one year to pay the deposit, then having to join again in the year when the model is finally released, to pay the balance.

 

It works out very expensive for anyone not really interested in N gauge issues as such. I joined up and paid a deposit for one model, but decided paying another year's subs was a cost too far - so I never got the model I put the deposit down on.

 

An interesting point which I had not thought about before. Could be something to think about at the next AGM?

 

Paul A. 

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Good choices in my eyes, joking aside can i pre order all four or just one?

 

Graham. 

 

Hello Graham,

 

Please send a note to the address in the journal indicating how many of each model you want.  At the end of February all the totals will be added up and then whichever model has the most orders will be produced, provided it has reached 350 pre orders.  I think it's unlikely that all four will reach the threshold but if they do we are planning just to order the one with the highest number of orders, so members who vote for two or three different models aren't faced with sudden demands for more cash than they might expect!

 

 

cheers

 

Ben A.

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I can see that the choc/cream Mk2 is aimed at the same market, but does it not need a brake in the same livery to make up a train?

 

http://joalder.smugmug.com/Trains/Class-By-Class/Class-20/i-9x3kcPx/A

The Riviera trains mk2s normally run intermixed with mk1s, as seen here. The rake is all mk1 apart from the lead carriage.

Perfectly usable with steam, mainline operators diesels and preserved diesels on the mainline. Off the top of my head, in the last few years I have photos of these Riviera BR chocolate and cream and blood and custard sets behind DRS 20s and 37s; DB (and Mendip) 59, 60, 66 and 67; Tornado; Britannia; Western Champion and 40145.

Here's a bit of super power on a Riviera set, note the lead mk2 http://joalder.smugmug.com/Trains/Class-By-Class/Privately-owned-and-one-offs/i-vm8tVzT/A

 

The Carillion auto ballasters are very rarely seen together. Usually you'll see 4 Railtrack with a Carillion one in the mix. Originally they were converted as 2 sets of 5, but over time the JJA auto ballaster sets have been split and reformed, due to having screw couplings between vehicles, whereas the later build HQA auto ballasters remain in relatively fixed formations

 

jo

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My only gripe with having to join is that models often run late. You end up joining one year to pay the deposit, then having to join again in the year when the model is finally released, to pay the balance.

 

It works out very expensive for anyone not really interested in N gauge issues as such. I joined up and paid a deposit for one model, but decided paying another year's subs was a cost too far - so I never got the model I put the deposit down on.

 

Perhaps there could be a reduced membership fee for people who don't want all the strings attached to normal membership.

 

If you paid a deposit in good faith then I am sure you are entitled to pay the balance and receive the model, even if you are no longer a member.  We try to avoid delays but sometimes it's just beyond our control.

 

Please contact the NGS shop and clarify.  If you don't get a satisfactory response please PM me and I will look into this.

 

cheers

 

Ben A.

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I'm an NGS member and a post-privatisation period modeller, so I ought to be squarely in the target market for this exercise. That said, I'm not sure that I'd pre-order any of these. I'm not an expert on railtours at all, but my impression is that the Pullman and the Riviera TSO would both need to part of a larger set of similarly-liveried coaches that aren't going to be available RTR and which aren't high enough up my personal "want list" for me to commit the time and energy to produce them myself. Again, the autoballaster - which I might be interested in since I saw a Carillion-liveried set at Edge Hill once around 2007 - would really commit me to a set of five, including a generator wagon, which I can't really afford.

 

The yellow BSO is something that I might buy - in fact, 977337 is part of a train formation that I was looking at just the other day (Rail Express no. 124, page 11: three NR mk.2s and a mk.1 generator coach topped-and-tailed by DRS class 37s) but I'm a bit put off by the note in the latest Journal that "some of the unique grill detail will be printed, not moulded". This isn't necessarily a deal-breaker for me: I'm struggling to see where these grills are, frankly, in photos I can find online; and I'm not implacably opposed to printed detail when it's done well. It does make me cautious, though.

 

Ironically, I've spent more at the Society shop this year than ever before. I have a ton of kits on hand: salmons, pirahnas, a shark, detail etches etc. I respect the fact that the Society is doing this and I appreciate it's not easy to find good choices; but honestly, none of these is more enticing to me than the regular shop stuff.

 

Jim

 

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For me the Mk1 Pullman is a good idea, as these run in West Coast Trains formations... otherwise mostly formed of maroon Mk1s which can easily be modified from the Farish ones, though for the perfectionists some maroon Mk1s on B4 bogies and a maroon Mk2 brake would complete the set accurately. 

 

The Riviera trains mk2s normally run intermixed with mk1s, as seen here. The rake is all mk1 apart from the lead carriage.

 

The Carillion auto ballasters are very rarely seen together. Usually you'll see 4 Railtrack with a Carillion one in the mix. Originally they were converted as 2 sets of 5, but over time the JJA auto ballaster sets have been split and reformed, due to having screw couplings between vehicles, whereas the later build HQA auto ballasters remain in relatively fixed formations

 

jo

Fair do's; these comments make the other three selections (i.e. not the Network Rail BSO) more logical choices than I'd supposed. The only time I've seen a Carillion autoballaster was as part of a full set of five, but perhaps that just shows how swiftly modelling around 2006 is becoming "historical", rather than "contemporary"

 

Jim

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This is a really positive initiative and I would say that Ben and the NGS are to be commended in this venture. From the recent criticism the society has received, this addresses some of these issues in an innovative way and gives members the ability to have an active role in deciding which one from this batch will make it to production. Bravo. I'll take a yellow one and if anyone's interested I don't really have a requirement for one but who said I have to stick to what I model? And another reason I'll buy this is because I'd like this type of member participation to continue to the next project and the project after that where there might be something that really suits me. Isn't this part of what of being a member is about?

Anyways, to expand on this concept of choice, as an idea how does an unpainted MK2 or MK1 sound, sold with a paint guide and decals for a particular livery and prototype? This would provide an opportunity to provide more variations and encourage a more hands approach to modelling? The NGS already sells an undecorated Stove R (I have two btw, but no need for them, lol), this would be the same but with decals.

Paul

 

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Interesting choices. I think the NR Mk2 BSO will be the first to be done. Yellow is big in N - although not with me!  How about putting in a detail etch with the model so modellers can overlay the printed details if they so wish.

 

On a slightly different tangent, is the NGS looking to do more R-T-R models as opposed to kits in the future? And a another suggestion, more of a conversion than a wagon kit though. I saw on another thread you mentioned the farish polybulk  is modelled only a specific type. How about doing a conversion kit  (if possible) for it but with an unpainted wagon and transfers included. An everything in the box conversion kit?

 

Carl

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