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Andy Y

2014 Hornby Announcements

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I hate to ask but for the 42xx/52xx/72xx classes, is a separately fitted smokebox door handle worth a 10 quid increase in price?

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HornbyFAN - as you will see from the posting above yours, they are on Model Railway Express Magazine (or MREMag) today - 2 photos of Hornby's Mark 2E coach. With thanks to Phil Parker of MREMag, fresh from the London Toy Fair held on Tuesday to Thirsday this week. The link is http://www.mremag.com/news/bulletin.asp

 

John

 

 

Thanks! Interesting images.

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The Mk2s actually look quite good. A little better than the Mk1s IMHO. Atleast the glazing isn't as bad as the earlier ones.....

The 700 looks really nice too.

Edited by HornbyFAN

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Certainly seems they are some way down the line with the mk2e's.

We cant see any coupling yet.hopefully its a close coupler with nem pocket.

tge gangway moulding on the bso looks squarer than the curved top on the open 2nd.

Not sure if this was what brake vehicles had.it could just be the only spare moulding Hornby had lying around.on 2e fairly certain they were curved.

be good to get up close to these at the next roadshow.

I thought it was Bachmann who planned on mk2e and it was then decided to go for mk2f when they discovered Hornby was in already on the mk2e......

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I hate to ask but for the 42xx/52xx/72xx classes, is a separately fitted smokebox door handle worth a 10 quid increase in price?

But labour costs in China are rising so you've got to allow for a general year on year price increase as well, don't forget.

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I hate to ask but for the 42xx/52xx/72xx classes, is a separately fitted smokebox door handle worth a 10 quid increase in price?

A fair question - but RMwebbers seem to put enormous store by it being a separate item, as noted in virtually every thread about new steam models, so on that basis, this is what the customer expects in 2014.

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I hate to ask but for the 42xx/52xx/72xx classes, is a separately fitted smokebox door handle worth a 10 quid increase in price?

I, personally, think the smokebox door, being the "face" of a loco, is what immediately gives the character of the loco.

IMHO Moulded detail makes it look flat and lifeless.

If the new release is only £10 more then I think it is good value having seperate fittings.

 

Keith

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I hate to ask but for the 42xx/52xx/72xx classes, is a separately fitted smokebox door handle worth a 10 quid increase in price?

I'm afraid my answer is no.  Of all the possible upgrades to RTR locos, removing a moulded smokebox door handle and fitting a separate one must be the easiest.  

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I hate to ask but for the 42xx/52xx/72xx classes, is a separately fitted smokebox door handle worth a 10 quid increase in price?

 

Well I did say Last year that I'd be happy to spend an extra tenner on them if they came with separate fitted smokebox door handles so my answer remains 'yes' (and as already noted we are also looking at a Chinese wage increase since then).  These engines have several other shortcomings hich if corrected might result in further price increases but they would still be worth it as the basic shape is excellent and 'catches' the prototypes really well.

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I hate to ask but for the 42xx/52xx/72xx classes, is a separately fitted smokebox door handle worth a 10 quid increase in price?

 

To be fair, most Hornby locos have gone up £10 more or less this year - most of which have not had any improvements made.

So getting the improved handle on the 42xx/52xx/72xx locos is really not costing the whole £10.

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I'm afraid my answer is no.  Of all the possible upgrades to RTR locos, removing a moulded smokebox door handle and fitting a separate one must be the easiest.  

I'm sorry, but not everybody wants to modify their newly purchased RTR locos.

I would rather they were already "up to the mark" so to speak.

 

Keith

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I'm sorry, but not everybody wants to modify their newly purchased RTR locos.

I would rather they were already "up to the mark" so to speak.

 

Keith

Agreed. Yes it might be a simple job to replace the moulded one - provided you can aim accurately and carefully with knife and various abrasives and then accurately centre and drill a hole in the smokebox door.  BUT the thing is we were doing all of this 30 or 40 years ago - and one would have have hoped that several decades of development in r-t-r manufacture plus, in more recent years, rises in real prices, would at least see manufacturers maintain the standards they reached a few years ago.

 

Yes these models are going to cost more - after all the Chinese workers are actually daring to aspire to the standard of living and relative disposable income we have enjoyed for many years, the cost of raw materials is rising because everybody wants the latest in electronic gimmicks, and the cost of other things is rising because of increased demand.   The other day I popped in and bought a 'Dukedog; I have long been waiting for it and I paid for it with some very grubby banknotes - because I've been saving for it (and had plenty of time to do so).

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I'm sorry, but not everybody wants to modify their newly purchased RTR locos.

I would rather they were already "up to the mark" so to speak.

 

Keith

And while some may sniff that it's easy to replace the moulded item - what happens to that nice factory paint-job in the vicinity? Some of us don't want the weathered finish that is the traditional recommended camouflage for such blemishes.

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Up until a couple of years ago all model locomotives had been fitted with separately moulded smokebox darts for over twenty years. Then in a complete reversal of progress the RTR manufacturers started to mould on either half or full darts. If they are now responding to feedback by fitting separate darts and charging £10.00 for this 'progressive move', you've been conned mates!  Think about it.....With the fine assembly the Chinese workers are able to undertake on the rest of a model locomotive, how hard is it for them to put a dart in a hole? As for putting half a dart in a hole as Bachmann does on its J11, I'll say no more! If Horby and Bachmann wants or needs to cut assembly costs, then for goodness sakes put the damn dart in the little plastic bag along with the fire irons and what-not for buyers to fit.

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Watched a special CNN report on China today - they are about to relax the rules on migration from the countryside to the cities and manufacturing areas. Previously, if a Chinese person went to a city to look for work (as opposed to having already found a job before they went), they would not get any state benefits or housing, which put many off apparently (which is why there are virtually no shanty towns in China, unlike, say, Brazil or India). This had been the case for decades, to control the growth in demand for housing, transport, utilities and handouts, and also to ensure that domestic agriculture remained productive. However, such is the growing shortage of available labour in factories, partly from growth but also due to the ageing population, that they are now trying to mildly encourage people into satellite towns that have been, and are being constructed, around the largest major cities, and which are within easy commuting distance, but without denuding agriculture. The numbers are staggering. The Chinese government spokesman stated that they believed that around 10 million country dwellers would be attracted (although over what period was not made clear), but two of the economic commentators thought that there was pent up demand of around 100 million!! So, labour shortage being solved, at least temporarily, but all will need to be trained up, which other accounts have suggested can take up to 6 months (many are illiterate in Mandarin or Cantonese) for basic assembly work, and the Chinese New Year is just about to start. So, not a quick fix for our purposes, but, along with a slight relaxing of the one-baby rule, it does suggest that predictions of the early demise of the Chinese dominating world production are a little premature. 

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China - 1.351 BILLION people, and no "trained" smokebox dart fitters !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Coach is right, we are being conned.

 

Brit15

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Up until a couple of years ago all model locomotives had been fitted with separately moulded smokebox darts for over twenty years. Then in a complete reversal of progress the RTR manufacturers started to mould on either half or full darts. If they are now responding to feedback by fitting separate darts and charging £10.00 for this 'progressive move', you've been conned mates!  Think about it.....With the fine assembly the Chinese workers are able to undertake on the rest of a model locomotive, how hard is it for them to put a dart in a hole? As for putting half a dart in a hole as Bachmann does on its J11, I'll say no more! If Horby and Bachmann wants or needs to cut assembly costs, then for goodness sakes put the damn dart in the little plastic bag along with the fire irons and what-not for buyers to fit.

And the BR number plate too so we don't have to file it off when backdating pre-1948. (apologies to LMS modellers.)

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China may go "pop"

 

http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/archives/the-23-trillion-credit-bubble-in-china-is-starting-to-collapse-global-financial-crisis-next

 

Frightening read with implications for us all - not just model railways either.

 

Brit15

Yes, but that sort of thing has been appearing in economic commentaries and the business pages of various newspapers for the past two years or more.  It might well happen sometime but only when it happens and not before.

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China - 1.351 BILLION people, and no "trained" smokebox dart fitters !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Coach is right, we are being conned.

 

Brit15

 

Ah but the trained ones have already correctly put the smokebox dart on the inside of the door. Its the smokebox door handle fitters who have the problems!

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China may go "pop"

 

http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/archives/the-23-trillion-credit-bubble-in-china-is-starting-to-collapse-global-financial-crisis-next

 

Frightening read with implications for us all - not just model railways either.

 

Brit15

 

But just remember, the Chinese government has economic levers that Western Democratic countries do not have and they are not afraid of making unpopular decisions either. It should also be acknowledged that many of Chinese biggest companies are SOE (state owned enterprises). The Chinese leaders have a lot of skin in the game !

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I hate to ask but for the 42xx/52xx/72xx classes, is a separately fitted smokebox door handle worth a 10 quid increase in price?

2 things to consider here:-

 

Will we actually see these models for sale?

 

Will the box-shifters charge the extra tenner?

 

Ian

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2 things to consider here:-Will we actually see these models for sale?Will the box-shifters charge the extra tenner?Ian

Yes I think you will see them, and yes I think they would have been up a tenner anyway regardless of smoke box darts

Edited by Legend

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2 things to consider here:-

 

Will we actually see these models for sale?

 

Will the box-shifters charge the extra tenner?

 

Ian

Presumably 'yes' to the first and 'what's a box shifter?' to the second.  Hornby's revised margins, revised payment terms, and not yet known (so I understand) credit terms will all have an impact on retail prices and deep discounting (like as at box shifters) will have had its day, just look at Hattons latest prices for Hornby 2014 products.

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When Bachmann introduced a cap on retailer discounts, Rails introduced free postage to UK addresses. I wonder if we'll see more of that from other "box shifters" as a way to maintain customers once their price advantage disappears.

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