Hornby Drummond 700

[Steve Smith]

This currently pristine loco is another variation of the 4mm Black Motor which we believe is a Jidenco Kit built originally (and very wisely) to 00 gauge.  I have since converted it to EM gauge with compensated Perseverance chassis for loco and tender.  The posing of the loco crew with the driver sat on the tool box/splasher is as the model came to me, and I would like to think was something the original builder saw in real life, perhaps when shunting.   Some details of the conversion (which was not the 'quick win' it was supposed to be) can be found here.

[darren01]

I have this one a PDK 700, Good kit.

[NHY 581]

This is my Hornby example in service on Mutton, my ex L&SWR layout.

 

They are very nice indeed.

 

Rob.

[Scottest]

This is my Hornby example in service on Mutton, my ex L&SWR layout.

 

They are very nice indeed.

 

Rob.

Very nice, very nice indeed.

 

PB

 

PS

 

I, for one, would appreciate more pictures of this ilk

[Joseph_Pestell]

For those that like the Hornby model, some going very cheap from  Hattons at the moment in their "Sale of the Century".

 

I might just let myself be tempted.

[NHY 581]

Very nice, very nice indeed.

 

PB

 

PS

 

I, for one, would appreciate more pictures of this ilk

 

Cheers PB. There are a few more here...

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/122124-a-slice-of-mutton-more-sheep-tales-the-continuing-adventures-of-norman-lockhart/page-6&do=findComment&comment=3349239

 

 

Rob

[Robin Brasher]

Hi Robin,

Your name is familiar, did you write articles for Railway Modeller in the 1960s/70s?

All the best,

Dave.

Dear Dave,

 

Yes, I wrote some articles about the Swanage Railway buildings. The Railway Modeller does not want any more articles about the Swanage Railway as enough has been written about it mainly by myself.

 

Best wishes

 

Robin

[mikesndbs]

Hi guys, advice please?

 

I got my 700 yesterday and really love it.

 

However while it will run sweetly both ways I find I can't crawl going forward as there is a snag that occurs at the same rotation each time.

Oddly when I run it upside down in the service cradle there is no snag??

 

I have take it apart and checked everything, disengaged the motor and tried the chassis by hand, I was able to cause a sort of lock up by turning the rear wheels only, but when all wheels are turned by pushing it along the track there is no issue.

Motor also seems to run true.

 

I just can't find the issue and its very annoying lol

 

Anyone suggest please?

 

Here she is before I discovered the issue. Maybe it will run in?

 

Regards

 

Mike

[adb968008]

Hi guys, advice please?

 

I got my 700 yesterday and really love it.

 

However while it will run sweetly both ways I find I can't crawl going forward as there is a snag that occurs at the same rotation each time.

Oddly when I run it upside down in the service cradle there is no snag??

 

I have take it apart and checked everything, disengaged the motor and tried the chassis by hand, I was able to cause a sort of lock up by turning the rear wheels only, but when all wheels are turned by pushing it along the track there is no issue.

Motor also seems to run true.

 

I just can't find the issue and its very annoying lol

 

Anyone suggest please?

 

https://youtu.be/Up2X2focVXQ Here she is before I discovered the issue. Maybe it will run in?

 

Regards

 

Mike

Could it be a tiny bit of dirt in the worm thread or one of the gears ?

(I had something exactly like that problem myself, which was ok one way up, but not right side down, as upside down there was slack elsewhere which didnt manifest onto the wheels?)

[mikesndbs]

Could it be a tiny bit of dirt in the worm thread or one of the gears ?

(I had something exactly like that problem myself, which was ok one way up, but not right side down, as upside down there was slack elsewhere which didnt manifest onto the wheels?)

 

That is a very good thought, I'll have a good look later on and report back, thanks

[mikesndbs]

Well, went through the gears with a fine tooth comb and found nothing.

Check to make sure coupling rods are not snagging, Don't know what else to check???

[mikesndbs]

Hi, here she is with the issue, hard to get it to show up on film.

Dad just said it might be a crank pin not in straight, so I'll check

 

[mikesndbs]

OK crank pins all look ok, but what I have discovered is if I run hr upside down in the cradle, and put a little drag on the front driving wheels the middle wheels pop to one side a little, about the same place as the snag.

Is this normal?

Edited November 27, 2018 by mikesndbs

[adb968008]

That sounds a bit more like wheel quartering, if your not familiar with it, theres a thread on here, its a bit of an art.

[mikesndbs]

That sounds a bit more like wheel quartering, if your not familiar with it, theres a thread on here, its a bit of an art.

 

Hmm thanks, well it has been improving with use, I have written to Hattons and asked them for advice as well.

My dad thinks it should run it

[31A]

Hmm thanks, well it has been improving with use, I have written to Hattons and asked them for advice as well.

My dad thinks it should run it

 

 

Sounds a bit like one of my J50s.  I bought it in Rails' shop a coupe of years ago, and the nice man in the shop gave it a run on their test track.  Something obviously wasn't right, it hopped along terribly but he persisted and it seemed to be getting better but still not perfect.  I suggested perhaps I could take another one, but he said it was the last one they had of that version, so I took it anyway (the price was good!).

 

Getting it home, it still limped.  I took it to bits, could see nothing wrong but anyway stripped the 'white grease' from its mechanism and re-lubricated with oil.

 

Running is now much better, whether or not due to my lubrication or just running in I'm not sure but it still thumps quite distinctly as it goes along, but actually moves quite smoothly.  I think the root of the issue probably is the quartering of the driving wheels but as it runs smoothly enough I'm happy to leave that alone.  

 

Meanwhile its drivers book "Big Ends to re-metal" on the repair card every time it goes out!

[Hilux5972]

Could perhaps be a small burr on the back of a wheel catching on the pickups?

[90rob]

Could perhaps be a small burr on the back of a wheel catching on the pickups?

 

I got an M7 as a clearance item a couple of years back and it had a very similar problem. It turned out to be a tiny blob of glue on the back of one of the wheel rims. It took just a couple of seconds to scrape it off.

[Butler Henderson]

Having acquired a second one (Hattons - 10% on ebay) thought a ESU Lokpilot Standard v2 (ie Bachmann 36-566) would be a good decoder to try in it as comes in an insulated wrap so no issues with the exposed pick up rails in the tender. One weight removed the decoder stuck in place with double sided sticky tape and the body went back on without anything needing to be modified. Has anyone used such a decoder in a Hornby Steam Loco and is there any tweaks particularly recommended.

Edited January 10, 2019 by Butler Henderson

[JohnR]

I got my first 700 for christmas - guess the £59 price at Hattons was just too good to resist for OH. I am seriously impressed - its easily the best loco in my fleet. Smooth and slow running out of the box, and with exceptional haulage power. I ran it in on my sons train set oval, and it coped with over 20 wagons with ease.

 

I'm going to be adding more.

[liathach]

Regarding running at slow speeds: today I took delivery of a 700 from a reputable shop.  I'm now on DCC.  A quick test on direct current showed the engine to be very stuttery at low speeds on a feedback controller compared to other engines.  It was a similar story initially with a decoder.  I tested different decoders and varied CVs without much improvement, although the engine was smooth in the moderate to high speed range.  Having read earlier posts, I tried putting a shim against the worm to reduce the noticeable play.  This helped somewhat reduce the slow-speed stuttering.  As a final test, I opted to snip out the TV interference capacitor hid underneath the decoder plug.  Removing the capacitor there has made a great improvement to slow-speed running.  Hopefully, with more running and CV tweaking, it will improve.  Comparing some locos I have on DCC, the 700 looks marginally less smooth than the Bachmann C Class.  I recently got a bargain Hornby LNER J15.  The running on that is extraordinary.  If I get a rainy day, I should try and look at seeing if it would be feasible to fit a J15 motor to the 700.

[melmerby]

10 hours ago, liathach said:

Regarding running at slow speeds: today I took delivery of a 700 from a reputable shop.  I'm now on DCC.  A quick test on direct current showed the engine to be very stuttery at low speeds on a feedback controller compared to other engines.  It was a similar story initially with a decoder.  I tested different decoders and varied CVs without much improvement, although the engine was smooth in the moderate to high speed range.  Having read earlier posts, I tried putting a shim against the worm to reduce the noticeable play.  This helped somewhat reduce the slow-speed stuttering.  As a final test, I opted to snip out the TV interference capacitor hid underneath the decoder plug.  Removing the capacitor there has made a great improvement to slow-speed running.  Hopefully, with more running and CV tweaking, it will improve.  Comparing some locos I have on DCC, the 700 looks marginally less smooth than the Bachmann C Class.  I recently got a bargain Hornby LNER J15.  The running on that is extraordinary.  If I get a rainy day, I should try and look at seeing if it would be feasible to fit a J15 motor to the 700.

I'm always puzzled when people say this as I have never found it makes the slightest difference.

I use Lenz or Zimo decoders only.

[NHY 581]

13 hours ago, liathach said:

Regarding running at slow speeds: today I took delivery of a 700 from a reputable shop.  I'm now on DCC.  A quick test on direct current showed the engine to be very stuttery at low speeds on a feedback controller compared to other engines.  It was a similar story initially with a decoder.  I tested different decoders and varied CVs without much improvement, although the engine was smooth in the moderate to high speed range.  Having read earlier posts, I tried putting a shim against the worm to reduce the noticeable play.  This helped somewhat reduce the slow-speed stuttering.  As a final test, I opted to snip out the TV interference capacitor hid underneath the decoder plug.  Removing the capacitor there has made a great improvement to slow-speed running.  Hopefully, with more running and CV tweaking, it will improve.  Comparing some locos I have on DCC, the 700 looks marginally less smooth than the Bachmann C Class.  I recently got a bargain Hornby LNER J15.  The running on that is extraordinary.  If I get a rainy day, I should try and look at seeing if it would be feasible to fit a J15 motor to the 700.

 

The 700 runs very well. I do not have DCC. I  have two examples and they are fine after a period of running in. 

I also have a J15. What makes the difference between the two of them is the fact that the J15 has twin flywheels. Not the motor. If you look at the service sheet you will see that the 700 is shown to have a flywheel but they were produced without them. The worm has a thick collar, probably as a result of having to fill the gap left by the never fitted flywheel.  

 

 

 

Rob. 

[PMP]

18 hours ago, liathach said:

 If I get a rainy day, I should try and look at seeing if it would be feasible to fit a J15 motor to the 700.

 

The simple answer is ‘no’. The J15 uses a smaller motor with double flywheels and has a different (and finer) tower gear arrangement. Reviews with images of the chassis’ are attached 

 

https://albionyard.wordpress.com/2015/06/26/700-Hornby-hat-trick-r3240-drummond-review/

 

 

https://albionyard.wordpress.com/2015/03/27/j15-red-box-treat/

 

The J15 chassis is more refined in design and assembly, I suspect the 700 was designed before the J15, even though the J15 was first out of the blocks.

[liathach]

8 hours ago, melmerby said:

I'm always puzzled when people say this as I have never found it makes the slightest difference.

I use Lenz or Zimo decoders only.

 

When starting on DCC, I tried Gaugemaster and DCC Concepts.  Found them rubbish compared to analogue control.  Tried Lenz: much better but that jump from standing to speed step one on all locos put me off Lenz.  I had a good look at information from Lenz and there wasn't a fix to improve the starting to step one. Similar with ESU decoders.  I've opted for Zimo in the end for the sheer choice in CV control.  Testing the 700 closely against the Bachmann C Class, the C Class is much smoother.  Without the 700 motor in place, the chassis rolls smoothly and the gears don't appear to have any visible cracks or dirt that might impact motion.  In my head, it must be the motor that's the weak point compared to other locos.  Must admit, I've had a number of Bachmann Halls in the 32-000 to 32-005 range and they all behave in a similar manner to the 700 Class, noticeable stuttering at low smooth (similar gearing and basic three pole motors).