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Class 143 Arriva Trains Wales Project


charliepetty
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  • 4 weeks later...

We are currently working on the 'Seriously Brilliant' new sound decoder for the 143 Arriva TW.  This will feature:

 

Both Horns Playable, Opening & Closing of all doors sound + door bleeps, air release for brakes, drivers door only opening/closing, Compressor Run up (Engine revving while stationery),

Speed dependant flange squeal + extra 143 squeal! , Right Away whistle, Guard to Driver buzz - buzz, internal hot air blowers, BSI Uncoupling, BSI Coupling, Track Detonators (3 Bang stop)

and CV selectable passenger announcements with 13 (YES THIRTEEN) different destination announcements.   All based on ATW Cardiff orientated routes.

 

SO THERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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  • 4 weeks later...

Very busy here testing the Arriva ones, deliveries to direct customers will commence in about 4 weeks, the things have arrived during our very busy period, not when we planned for them to arrive!  Typical!!!!!!! 

 

The older orders will be processed first.

 

Charlie

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Has anyone received the same email from Charlie as I did yesterday regarding my class 143 pre order?

 

It says that due to a security software update carried out by Sagepay older pre orders can no longer be processed and anyone who still wants a 143 is directed to the Realtrack site to re - place their order.

 

However, the price has now increased from £110 to £120 per unit. I questioned Charlie about this and his response was that the production costs had gone up and to order at the new price if you still want one.

 

Can someone in the know say whether or not Realtrack are legally obliged to honour the original amount of any order's which are affected like mine.

 

I believe that the same was true with the 144s when they where subject to a price increase from £100 to £110, those who pre ordered at £100 paid £100.

 

Dale

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Dale

 

It would really depend upon the wording of your "agreement", if there was one in writing.

 

My feeling would be that Mr Petty, mindful of previous price increases, will have written that into the agreement to allow some "wiggle" room in case of supplier(s) increasing costs.

 

Did you pay a deposit? If so, do you have the option to cancel it rather than go through at the previous price? If the answer is yes and then no to that then I would suggest they are in breach- other than that, it's impossible to say without the agreement to view.

 

I use Sagepay and haven't been aware of this problem personally. But in fairness to Realtrack, they have produced probably the best RTR model in the history of model railways (certainly British outline) and have taken a huge financial risk to do so. If you choose to fight them for £10 then you might just find they say "sod it- we're not doing any more of this as it's too much hassle."

Setting aside point of principle for the moment, Realtrack must be expected to make a financial return on their investment. At £110 is it not already a pretty good deal?

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OK, I agree and accept that an extra £10, well £20 in my case as I had 2 on order, isn't going to bankrupt me however it is the principle which has annoyed me more than the actual monetary part of it.

 

Here's the confirmation email I received when I placed my pre order placed on 9th June 2014

post-11362-0-55719900-1424100305.jpg

Obviously I have had to blank out my personal details from this but as far as I was concerned this represented an agreement to pay £230.81 when the item was in stock and available for dispatch which I knew was some time off. No mention that the price may increase if the cost of manufacture goes up. No deposit had been requested so none was paid - that's how most pre orders work isn't it?

 

And here is the email I got from Charlie last night

post-11362-0-05711500-1424100302_thumb.jpg

Again no mention that the price had gone up just directed to the realtrack site to find it for myself.

 

Perhaps an email from Charlie saying "we're sorry but the price will be going up due to increased cost of production" I would have been fine with that, but instead your pre order has been deleted please re order though our website if still interested.

 

One other thing - Charlie says the software update occurred 'over 12 months ago' - well I only placed my order in June and by my maths that's only 8 months ago.

 

Surely I can't be the only one who thinks this is wrong?

 

Dale

Edited by dale159
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I recieved that email maybe 9 months ago and have had to pay the extra.

That's a bit strange, can anybody clarify when the price actually went up, as can't see any mention of it being made on here.

 

To my mind it still doesn't add up right as the update Charlie has cited as the reason for the cancellation happened 4 months before my order was placed. Yet my transaction was accepted presumably on the updated security software.

 

Also I find it quite disgusting the manner in which the cancellation email didn't mention that the price had gone up and they will not honour the old price as they did with the 144s as pointed out in my previous post in this thread, why is it different this time?

 

I would urge Charlie in the name of good customer relations and the excellent customer service that the Realtrack website boasts about to demonstrate this, swallow your pride and please honour the previous agreement, not just for me but anyone else who is in the same situation, it can't just be me - please speak up if this has happened you too.

 

Dale

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HI Dale

 

The retail price went up 9% when we got the final production costs "thats less than others"

 

Why different from the 144 !!   well less margins TBH, so it's £120.00 and every publication thats reviewed the 143 says it very good value for money.

 

Regards Arran

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Dale

 

There is no obligation for Realtrack to honour the original price unless they explicitly said they would - even the big retailers don't always honour their pre-order prices if the trade prices changes.

 

Sagepay had a relatively recent issue which affected some of their systems from a longstanding problem - so the original problem might have been before your order but the Sagepay fix might well have been after your order.

 

Either way, you still have the choice that you had originally which is to pay the asking price (admittedly £10 higher) or not. As Arran said the price they have been charged has increased and they need to get their investment back.

 

Cheers, Mike

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Mike

 

**Purely for the academic debate**, what is your reason for believing that the pre-authorisation of the card does not count as binding? (you may or may not be right, I am not a CC Judge and if there's a precedent set on this, I am not aware of it).

 

Regarding Sagepay- I use this for one of my companies and I have never heard of this issue- could you enlighten me as to what to look for please?

**Purely for reality**, this model is equivelant to a bach/by loco AND carriage for £120. It is still a bargain and is a damned good contender for the best RTR model ever. I have heard no one say a bad word about it. If Realtrack cannot make a profit- or even worse, make a loss, then there's a damned good chance that's the last release we will see. What I think might have got up the nose of the OP was the mannerism in which he was advised of the price increase.

 

I ordered from DCK in its formative years a number of times, all barring once I had to chase my order with a "just doing it now" response. Perhaps not 10/10 for customer services or mannerisms. But you have to remember that throughout their history they have been pioneers. That 101 wasn't great by modern standards, but was pretty good back then- the 105 was- AND STILL IS- an excellent kit.... and now we see the 143/144. I think if you want a polished "Good morning and thank you for calling Realtrack/DCK, which department may I transfer you through to today?" type customer service then that is just not possible at the prices they are selling models for. I must admit that I would rather buy at an exhibition or via a dealer where I can go in dump some cash and walk away with a 143, but that's a personal preference and I do not know anyone who has had any major complaints about RT/DCK personally. I hope that constructive criticism of PR/customer services is taken in the spirit in which it is intended.

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Mike

 

**Purely for the academic debate**, what is your reason for believing that the pre-authorisation of the card does not count as binding? (you may or may not be right, I am not a CC Judge and if there's a precedent set on this, I am not aware of it).

 

Regarding Sagepay- I use this for one of my companies and I have never heard of this issue- could you enlighten me as to what to look for please?

 

IIRC Sage Pay had an issue when they were removing SSLv3 access which they fixed recently but related to a longstanding (if unknown) bug - whether that was the cause of Charlie's issues with Sagepay I don't know, but my point was that Dale seemed to be questioning the specifics of the dates of Sagepay's problem and I was just pointing out a possible scenario. 

 

On the contract issue, it isn't a pre-authorisation (which would block a certain amount of money and could be argued to form a contract), but an authentication that a card is valid and can be potentially charged in the future.

 

Cheers, Mike

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**Purely for reality**, this model is equivelant to a bach/by loco AND carriage for £120. It is still a bargain and is a damned good contender for the best RTR model ever. I have heard no one say a bad word about it. If Realtrack cannot make a profit- or even worse, make a loss, then there's a damned good chance that's the last release we will see. What I think might have got up the nose of the OP was the mannerism in which he was advised of the price increase.

 

You've hit the nail square on the head

 

Dale

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It's all academic anyway.

 

1. No one is going to take action over £10 (or £20 in this case)

 

2. You are buying a model train. Not Mr Petty's personality.

 

3. RT need to make profit or there won't be a new release.

 

 

I know how you feel about principle. I have this morning argued over 10 pence change in the garage this morning. He was short of change but rather than ASK me if I minded, he just assumed it would be OK... After forcing him to go speak with the manager, he came back with my 10p- only for me to tell him that it wasn't a problem and that he could keep it if he was low on change, but it was the principle.

 

The moral of that tale is thus:

1. If you go to this BP just off the motorway in Hemel Hempstead and you're 10p short on something- there should be mine sitting on the counter. Please feel free...

2. If you were in this BP just of the motorway in Hemel Hempstead this morning and were really narked at being stuck in a queue whilst a customer argued over 10p, my apologies.

 

Seriosuly though, Dale. If you are happy to pay the extra, pay it and move on with life. Don't get too tied up on principle as if you do that each time you feel aggrieved then you will end up the worse for it. Trust me- I know from experience ;) If you look through the small suppliers section here you will see that RT isn't that bad at all!

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It's all academic anyway.

 

1. No one is going to take action over £10 (or £20 in this case) , agreed!

 

2. You are buying a model train. Not Mr Petty's personality. I would want a rebate!

 

3. RT need to make profit or there won't be a new release. exactly!

 

 

Item 3 covers the situation perfectly, because of the time it has taken to get these right the price of manufacturing them has gone up, there isnt anything Charlie or Arran can do about it and no doubt they have reduced their profit margin to keep the increase to the minimum.

 

£10 to each customer isnt much but if all those £10 have to be covered by the seller thaen bang goes their profit margin and any chance of anymore new models, Charlie and Arran are in this to make a profit and if they dont make enough then they will simply go back to the day job and then we will all lose out.

 

TBH I am surprised it is only an extra £10, for example, if you had ordered a new car last February for delivery this February (without putting down a deposit) what price would you expect to pay, this years or last years?

 

The only alternative is for manufacturers not to state the expected retail price when the models are announced and I dont think any of us want that! 

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PLEASE don't start chasing 'YOUR' order, as the more phone calls we get, the slower despatching them will be!!!!!

I had a good look at the real thing last night and the Arrvia colour looks way to light ?

 

Maybe a tad of toning down would be required, also the seats aren't red more green.

 

Great Western

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GW

 

Have the arriva models already been released then? I thought they hadn't- or are you going by the colour reproduction in magazines and on the internet?

 

The Northern and First ones have won an awful lot of praise for their accuracy.

 

One thing you cannot fault RT on is pursuit of accuracy and authenticity. I would go as far as to say if there is a difference, it is probably the real Arriva colours that are wrong. ;)

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