Introduction to using Inkscape to produce cutting files

[MickRalph]

Happy Christmas to all following this thread.

 

Following up on Mike's informative posts, I am somewhat confused, as I have no problem in altering the Custom Size units in v92. As you may recall, I had difficulties in sizing when trying v92 immediately after its release, so I reverted to using v91. I use Silhouette Studio Designer Edition (SSDE), so I don't need to export from Inkscape in dxf format.

 

Noting that the dialogue for converting from earlier versions of Inkscape has changed in the later version, I took Mike's suggestion and installed the Portable version of Inkscape v92.2 (I had not previously found the portable versions).

 

I then took advantage on Thursday of a quiet shift in Kingscote signalbox on the Santa Specials at the Bluebell Railway to conduct some tests.

 

When using v91, I have found that saving the Inkscape file with Custom Size units set to px and saving as standard Inkscape format allows the file to open to the right size in SSDE. My tests also showed that using custom size measurements of mm and saving in plain svg format has the same effect. The other options of px/plain and mm/inkscape turn out respectively too large and too small when opened in SSDE.

 

I then tried importing the files created in v91 into v92 and here comes the confusing part: I will cover the conversion in a moment, but having opened the document in v92, I find that, unlike Mike, I have no difficulty in changing the custom size units, nor the display units, as required and they stay as I have changed them. Hence to be able to open the file in SSDE I have no need to go through Mike's dodge of converting first to pdf format and then reimporting into v92. I have no idea what is different in my setup to allow me to change the display units on converting to v92.

 

As to the conversion, I found that when the document has been saved in v91 in plain svg format it opens in v92 without the dpi conversion dialogue, but when saved in inkscape format, the dialogue appears. In all cases, the document opens with the same custom size units as it was saved in v91, while the display units are px for a plain svg file or mm for an Inkscape svg file. I found that all three of the options for saving a file in v91 opened it at the correct size when opened in v92, while for the fourth (custom units in px and plain svg format) , the drawing was too small in v92.

 

I then tried saving the drawing in v92 and opening it in SSDE. I found that when files were saved at the correct size in v92, if I saved the file with custom size units in mm and plain svg format, then the file opened the righgt size in SSDE.

 

Finally, I tried saving the files in dxf format and found that if the drawing is the correct size in v92, then it opens at the correct size in SSDE.

 

Consequently, I found that if I have a document created in v91 and saved with the custon size units as px in inkscape svg format, then it opens at the correct size in v92 and if I then save it in plain svg format with the custom size units set to mm, then it opens at the correct size in SSDE. Also, if I save the file in dxf format with the custom size units as either mm or px, then the file will open to the correct size in SS, without the need to employ Mike's intermediate pdf stage.

 

Lastly, I always create the drawing in Inkscape and add layers for each size of plasticard (10 thou and 20 thou) which I want to cut and I save separate files containing only those two layers, for opening in SSDE. This will avoid the problem that Mike experienced of the layers being lost when opening a full file in v92.

 

Sorry about the length of this post.

 

Mick

Edited December 26, 2017 by MickRalph

[MikeTrice]

Thanks for taking the time to try all those options out. I think what we are saying is "you might experience problems" in which case the work arounds will get you out of them, or you might not. Inkscape versions are released quite quickly as a whole community are fixing bugs as they are reported, so it is quite possible we all have slightly different versions of Inkscape installed at a time. In all honesty for some of my Inkscape files I have lost track which versions of Inkscape they have been edited with over time, so anything is possible. It might also be that SSDE is slightly more forgiving that the free version.

 

I note you also refer to saving as a non Inkscape svg file. I must admit I have not tried that. I did try unsuccessfully to save as a compressed svg which did not work at which point I gave up.

Edited December 27, 2017 by MikeTrice

[1965Paul]

Hi

 

I am trying to teach myself Inkscape as part of my personal "due diligence" before possibly buying an Emblaser, likely to be an Emblaser 1 unless we win the lottery pretty quickly. I am making reasonable progress in no small part due to the help from this thread, but have two questions relating to creating a drawing of a brick building prior to sending for cutting.

 

I - I have created a stretcher bond pattern, using create tiled clones. However, where the tiled clones touch, there is a double thickness of line. Hopefully the attached picture shows the problem. Firstly, is this an issue for the cuter (guess it is?), and secondly, if so, how do I avoid it and create a brick wall suitable for cutting?

 

2  -  I can create an outline of a wall in one colour for cutting and then overlay the brick pattern for engraving in another. Unfortunately, I don't know how to create the honey comb pattern on the edge of the wall to allow interlocking with adjacent walls.

 

Would appreciate any suggestions on how to move forward and give myself (and the household chancellor) the confidence that I can build up the drawing skills to make suitable use of an Emblaser.

 

Thanks in advance for any advice

 

kind regards

 

 

Paul

 

edited to add picture which didn't upload first time

Edited January 11, 2018 by 1965Paul

[JCL]

Hi Paul, I think I can help you there.

 

The stroke around the rectangle is comprised of the path of the line itself, which runs along the middle of the stroke, and the stroke thickness. Your bricks are butting up the outer edge of the stroke thickness, and you need them to butt up to the path.

 

 

To do this in Inkscape, you need to choose Edit -> Preferences from the menu, then, in the preferences panel, click on the Tools option on the left and choose Geometric Bounding Box. You can see below the path is the dotted line in the middle of the stroke that encompasses each rectangle, and that the paths representing the brick's mortar lines within the wall overlap each other, and consequently are the same thickness as those around it.

 

 

With regards to your second question, I'm afraid I don't know an easy way of doing this. My method is to:

1. Make sure you have snap to corner turned on (green arrow)
2. Choose the pen tool (red arrow)
3. Click on the corner or each brick - having snap turned on ensures that Inkscape will place your line node right on the corner of the brick.
4. Work your way around the whole wall, and then when you get back to where you started, hover over the last corner until you see the red square, then click. This will close the wall shape

 

 

Whether you use a laser cutter or a Silhouette cutter, remember that the brick edges that are butted against each other will be cut or burned twice, so you need to take this into account on your settings. 

Edited January 12, 2018 by JCL

[MickRalph]

Jason's suggestion of using the geometric bounding box to ensure that lines overlay each other, rather than butting up to each other, is a very useful one, as you will frequently need this when drawing up plans.  As Jason says, you need to remember that these lines will be cut/scored twice, so that you need to account for this when doing the cutting.

For a wall, this is not a problem, as all lines will be scored twice (except for the very outside ones, so they will all be scored to the same depth.  However, where an individual item is overlaying another, you will find that some parts of the drawing will be cut twice and others only once.  The same applies when creating the final cutting pattern by butting different parts of the design against each other, in order to use the minimum amount of plastic sheet.

Actually, thinking further about the wall, if you use duplication of sections of the wall to enlarge it (rather than simply duplicating a single brick multiple times), then some parts of the wall may have multiple lines overlaying each other.  This can be dealt with as below, the technique of  “Path > Object to Path” and “Path > Break Apart” being very useful.

For this,  you select an object or multiple objects and apply “Path > Object to Path”.  Then select “Edit paths by nodes” (F2 or the second icon on the left toolbar); now select pairs of nodes (or all nodes using crtl-A, which allows you to turn the rectangle into four separate lines, which can be turned into different colours so that they can be cut separately to avoid the slightly rounded corners that a single colour rectangle gets on cutting). With, for example, two nodes selected, click on the arrowed icon for “break path at selected nodes” and then use “Path .> Break Apart” (or ctrl-shift-K) to form the separate lines.  Now selecting the pointer mode, select the line you have just separated and you can then delete this line – you may need to bring it to the top, if another rectangle  has been laid over the one you have worked on.

 

I think that Jason's suggested way of completing the outer shape of the wall by creating a bounding rectangular shape is easy enough, but other ways would be to create a simply rectangle around the wall – this would create the half-bricks and then paste into place, using the snap function, or to make the wall half a brick too wide and then use the technique of turning the end bricks on the odd rows into paths,  selecting the two outside nodes, and then by clicking onto one of the pair move them inwards until they snap onto the outer nodes of the rows above and below (using the control key to ensure the nodes move truly horizontally.  

I hope this all makes sense.

Mick
 

Edited January 12, 2018 by MickRalph

[1965Paul]

Jason

 

thank you very much for such a clear and concise explanation. I have been able to follow your instructions and have been able to create the section here:-

 

 

Still a long way to go to reach the standard shown on this thread and on the Silhouette Portrait thread, but another step up the learning curve. Next challenge for myself:- brick arches

 

I already have a portrait, and any additional drawing skills can only help me to make it sing like I have seen others do on this site, as I am not really using it beyond window frames at the moment....

 

Thanks once again, much appreciated

 

kind regards

 

Paul

[1965Paul]

Hi Mick

 

apologies   -  I  think our posts crossed in the ether, I hope you don't think I was ignoring your post!   

 

Creating the outer black line as a cutting line as Jason suggested seemed to work for me, may be a bit tedious on a large section but easy enough. My proposed method for a complete building section would be to create a brick pattern larger than needed and then "count the bricks" to add the outer cutting line and remove any excess pattern outside the finished wall section that I I don't want.  Its really replicating the method I use on pre printed plasticard to make sure that I can get the ends/doors/windows etc in line with the pattern (within the confines of a preset embossed pattern at any rate). Hopefully this will avoid the multiple line issue you highlight above  - what do you think? Apologies to any other browser of this thread if these are "Noddy" questions. 

 

I now have a choice, try and draw a wall in its entirety or wine.  hmmmmmmmm?

 

Advice always welcome, but I think I can answer the last question myself.

 

Thanks very much

 

 

Paul

[MickRalph]

Thanks Paul,

 

I certainly didn't think that you ignored my post - indeed, I have only just logged on again so I saw your replies to Jason and me.  I had fogotten that, particularly with the laser embosser, people prepare the interlocking brick courses, so I concentrated on creating a rectyangular shape.  I have so far only made buildings which are planked or have a DAS covering for inscribing rough stone. My main use so far has preparing sides for coaches and waggons.

 

I think that your proposal for preparing the sides/ends of walls is probably the best approach.  Certainly, your questions are not "Noddy" questions.  We all have to start somewhere and we keep on learning, particularly when we don't use the program/cutter all the time.  I bought mine soon after Jason and Mike started their threads, so I was learning at the same time that they were experimenting.  However, it was only recently that I learned from Jon Hall that there are two buttons on the Portrait - one for feeding in material on the mat and the other for when the material is not on it; I had been using the latter and wondering why the cutter started cutting above the material and damaged the mat.

 

There are lots of knowledgeable and helpful people on the forums, so that any question should get a prompt answer.

 

Mick

[JCL]

I completely agree Mick, Mick, Mike, others and I are happy to help if people are experimenting with something new and can't work something out. Thing is, once you are up to speed, I can see you providing answers to new people yourself.

 

I'm looking forward to you showing me how to do brick arches for example.

[MickRalph]

Yes, it is interesting to see that there is now a new group of people using Inkscape and the Silhouette (and Emblaser) and showing new tips and techniques.

 

Mick

[JCL]

Well, I've been having a lot of problems with the latest Inskcape and corrupt SVG files and and it's got to the point where my file is almost unusable. The files that I create in the latest version of Inkscape cause issues in both Illustrator and Cut2D, the laser cutter software. After writing out the information below, I've found that neither the 'bad' file nor the good file cause a problem in Silhouette Studio - which is good news for Studio users.

 

I've found that the problems are definitely to do with the path modifiers such a union and difference, but the errors seem to have crept into other objects including circles. I'll also say that although path modifiers are involved, they don't always cause problems, and the issue is difficult to replicate. For a while I'd run the file through Illustrator to clean it up a bit, but eventually this added problems rather than removed them (including resizing the image).

 

I was in despair at one point as the file is pretty big, but I decided to take the bull by the horns and do something about it. Here's what the file looks like:

 

 

Anyway, not all objects have problems, so to get around the issues I've created a second file called goodfile.svg.

1. I'm copying the objects one-by-one from the issue file (badcopy.svg) and pasting them into goodcopy.svg.
2. I then import goodfile.svg into my cutting program. In my case it's Cut2D by Ventric.
3. If a copied object causes a problem in goodfile.svg, I then delete the corrupt object. 
4. I then redraw the corrup object in badcopy.svg without using any path modifiers. This isn't so difficult as I:
   1. turn on snap to nodes,
   2. change the line colour,
   3. and use the pen to click over each corner of the corrupt object until I have a complete copy of the corrupt object.
   4. delete the original corrupt object.
5. I copy the newly drawn object into goodfile.svg

I'll learn illustrator at some point, but it's a steep learning curve and I don't have much time at the moment. Anyway, after going through all of the objects, the following image shows all of the ones I've had to recreate in pink. The new file can now be imported into Cut2D.

 

 

Now to cut something.

[JCL]

Quick question, have I changed a setting somewhere? When I stretch a rectangle horizontally, the vertical lines at each end change thickness. The further the stretch, the thicker they become.

 

 

The object isn't grouped, and Scale Stroke Width is switched off. :-/

 

Edited to say that "turning it off and on again" sorted it. I think I've done so much in Inkscape this evening that the program doesn't know whether it's coming or going.

Edited January 28, 2018 by JCL

[MikeTrice]

Jason, might be worth raising the issues with the Inkscape developer community. Certainly if there are compatibility issues with svg files going into Illustrator.

[JCL]

Yes, I was thinking about that. I was hoping to be able to reproduce the issue reliably, but I'm not sure I'm going to be able to do this. Just found this, so I'll write up a report for them:

 

https://bugs.launchpad.net/inkscape 

[RectoryLane]

As a friend of Dave at Honley Tank and one who pointed him in the right direction to buy his cutter perhaps I can explain what I am actually doing with my machine.

 

Currently it is beavering away scribing a large sheet of 10thou plastic for me - what is it? Well actually it is English Bond brick paper. Why bother? Well it actually looks a lot better than the Slaters equivalent as the Slaters mortar courses are far too deep and the bricks have rounded corners so why not use the Silhouette to do a much better job for a fraction of the price? It is very easy despite it taking a long time but then what else does it have to do?

 

The artwork is drawn in Coreldraw and I use version 12. I also use this to produce my etch drawings so, for me, this is a no brainer - no point in learning Inkscape for me although I have been very impressed with Mike Trice's achievements using it. The only issue with using Coreldraw is that the drawing starts printing at the bottom of the sheet so before cutting I just move it all to the bottom of the page and then it cuts from the top - leave a gap or it will cut the backing sheet. You don't need to go through any conversion software, just select the Silhouette as if you are sending the job to a printer(yes of course you need to load the driver). Before printing you need to go to properties and select the colour of the line you want to cut, the default on my machine is a grey so just pick black or whatever colour you have used to draw in. Then leave it to cut, no need to go into any other package or buy the Coreldraw add on they are now selling.

 

I have used it to produce 4mm doors and windows for buildings and I intend to use it to mark plastic for buildings and bridges from drawings in thicker materials. 

 

As far as the cutting heads go I am currently using a Roland blade with an adaptor (Ebay) which is working just fine and keeps the costs down compared to the Silhouette blades.

 

Hope this helps Dave to quickly get up and running with his machine once Santa has been.

 

Ralph

just reading through the pages on this - can you point me to where drawing brick arches has been covered in this or a related topic

[JCL]

This is something that I meant to look into properly a long time ago, and never got around to. I've a head cold at the moment, so I can't to anything dangerous today, so I thought I'd have a look at how to do it without having to individually deform each brick. I think I might have worked something out. One caveat, your bricks are going to be wider at the top than at the bottom.

 

The instructions might look long, but took 10 times longer to write than it took to actually create the arches

 

1. Create your arch's bottom curve as a guide
2. Create your bricks or stone blocks using the rectangle shape
3. Group your bricks together and then choose Path -> Object to Path from the top menu
4. Move the brick group so that the bottom left hand corner of the brick lines up with the left-hand end of the path
5. Click on 'Path Effects' at the bottom of the Path menu to display the 'Path Effects' window
6. Select the grouped bricks
7. On the Path Effects window, click on the + and choose Bend and then ok.
8. You'll now have options underneath, click on the nodes icon (circled in the image below)

You should now have this:

 

1. Now, press the shift key down, click on one of the diamond points (there's one on each end halfway up the brick) and drag slightly upwards and towards the centre of the arch to make a handle (circled in red)
2. You may find you need to move the left hand side of the bricks to the left, just click and drag the anchor point (circled in green) to the left without pressing the shift key.
3. You just need to drag the anchors and handles around until you get the effect you are looking for.
4. Once you're done, you can delete the guide.
5. If you now un-group the bricks, the path effect will be deleted and you'll have to do it again. To get around this, select the bricks and then choose Path  -> Object to Path again. This can be useful if you have a brick/block in the middle that you want to make bigger to use as a keystone.

• Note: if the handles are symmetrical, the arch will be symmetrical - the arch below was asymmetrical when I took the screenprint.

 

Window arch and arch for a bridge

 

[JCL]

To make a flat top arch, I did the following:

1. Make sure you have snap 'Nodes, paths and handles' and 'Snap cusp nodes incl. rectangle corners' switched on.
2. Take the arch you created in the above post.
3. Copy and then paste in place
4. Change the colour of the stroke for this second arch so you will be able to see them both as you are working.
5. Add a guide to the centre-top of the arch.
6. Click on the node button on the toolbar and click on the first brick.
7. Click on the top corner of the brick and drag it up to the guide (see the black arrow below), making sure that the stroke stays in line with the copy of the arch that's underneath.
8. Keep doing this until you have done all of the bricks. Don't jump around, but do each corner one after the other. This way, if you have snap on, you will find that the corners snap to each other.

If you are finding the top of the arch looks weird and curvy, make sure that you change the corner style from smooth to straight by clicking on each corner and pressing the 'make selected nodes corner' button on the top menu. You should end up with this.

All you need to do now it remove the guide, and remove the original arch.

[paul9415]

Hi Mike

I am rather late to the party, but I am really excited  by the potential  of inkscape/ silhouette cutter combo. I have been reading your  posts with great interest,& as I am particularly interested in wagons , I was wondering  (if you haven't  already}  do a full work through of the LNER Diagram 86  van, of how  you would create the different  layers  with the different components  & then how you would lay them out  to make most economical use of the plasticard  when going thorough the cutter . Keep up the excellent work .

 

Thank you 

Paul Morgan

[paul9415]

Hi Mike &  Other Cutters,

 I am importing  line drawings  of wagons  into  inkscape  & using them as a  master file  & then creating a number of layers , for example  1 for planking lines, another for vertical  strapping, another  for diagonal strapping, & so on . MY thinking  is then to group all the layers together to  ensure a consistent size , but my  question how do you ensure the drawings arrive at the silhouette cutter  at the correct size   for OO  or O  gauge ?

 Is there anyone in & around Northampton who uses inkscape  for this purpose & might like to meet up & discuss various techniques, tips & tricks ?

 

Would it also be possible to set up an exchange/ donation of  files to save duplication of work & maybe encourage people to have a go ,, or stretch themselves  to try something new, having printed out a file & seen the results for themselves .

[Siberian Snooper]

I draw a box of known dimensions in Inkscape around what I want to cut and then in Studio I create a similar sizes box and lock it and create another layer for the import. The imported drawing is then resized so that the two boxes are overlaid.

 

 

[paul9415]

Thanks for that, I will certain;y try it out .

 

[Steadfast]

As an alternative, Silhouette studio will let you resize numerically, it's a bit easier and should be more precise than trying to align over a box.

I draw a box of known dimensions around my items, then when opened in studio, select all and right click and select group. Then resize the outer box by typing the size in the resize menu. I'm at work and typing on my phone at the mo so can't remember exactly where on the screen this is, sorry.

Just goes to shows there's multiple ways to get the same end result

 

Jo

[paul9415]

With the growing use of  cutters I wondered if anyone was interested in  having a meet up , where people can come an exchange  ideas, tips & hints , possibly bring along some of their work or do a demonstration ? 

What do people think ?  I live in Northampton , which is a fairly central location, so please let me have your thoughts .

 

[paul9415]

Thanks for that, I will certain;y try it out .

 

[paul9415]

Hi people, Am I being dumb, but when inkscape says to export your drawing as a PNG , where does it go, for after clicking the export button, I have searched all my files ,but cannot find a .png file , (getting very frustrated)  thanks