Traeth Mawr -Building Mr Price's house , (mostly)

[Compound2632]

Clearly Mr Price needs a hobby. I hear that the Northampton firm of Bassett-Lowke have recently introduced a range of model trains in various small scales. Pricey, but with additional income coming in from the lad and Mrs Price sponging off the mother-in-law... They deal by mail order, too, and the railway parcels service will give next day delivery - especially to the stationmaster with his immediate access to the parcels as they come out of the van!

Edited May 25, 2019 by Compound2632

[ChrisN]

On ‎25‎/‎05‎/‎2019 at 11:41, Compound2632 said:

Clearly Mr Price needs a hobby. I hear that the Northampton firm of Bassett-Lowke have recently introduced a range of model trains in various small scales. Pricey, but with additional income coming in from the lad and Mrs Price sponging off the mother-in-law... They deal by mail order, too, and the railway parcels service will give next day delivery - especially to the stationmaster with his immediate access to the parcels as they come out of the van!

 

 

 

Well, I am sorry I have not replied before but my contractor has been away and has only just shown me his broadsheet.  I have come to see my friend Mr Lewis.  You may have heard that we did not get on, well we do now but that is another story.  I am here specifically as some of his passengers, visitors that is not locals, refer to his narrow gauge railway as a 'toy railway'.  You can see that it is not, but this is the only 'toy railway' I would want to run.

 

As for hobbies, I try and grow Peonies,  and I sing in the chapel Choir when I can, but on the subject of Bassett-Lowke I have spoken to my friend the 'Young Englishman'.  He knows about these things and tells me as far as he knows that they do not make any models of Cambrian engines or coaches.  Now even if I wanted to have a model railway, why would I want to run anything that was not the mighty Cambrian?  Even if they did there of course is one other problem.  My house is not built yet, so where would I put it?

[Budgie]

47 minutes ago, ChrisN said:

  My house is not built yet, so where would I put it?

 

In the garden, of course.

[ChrisN]

Has he gone?  Right, now an update.  Mind you, I cannot blame him, I think he is sleeping in the down shelter, at the end.  

 

Now, I am a bit behind as I am getting on slowly but have not explained how I have done the ends.  I did try to do 'Weld' but it did not work so here is how I then progressed.

 

 

So for the parts that are not curved, or as in the case of the roof so large a radius not to notice, two rectangles 'Weld'ed together.  

 

 

So two ellipses are drawn and then very carefully delete parts close to the lines I want to keep, you can just see this on the left.  The excess is then selected and deleted.  This is repeated at the top.  The final end section is grouped together, then copied and pasted twice to give:-

 

 

Three different colours, to be superimposed on themselves.  This is to help later.  Just to note, I did this before I was given the radius of the curves.  Now I know that I will in fact draw a curve of the correct radius.  I have in fact gone back and redrawn the tumblehome on the sides with the correct radius, mainly because it had been a corrected straight line and it was pretty poor.  Trying to fit the right length curve to the existing side and bottom was, how shall I put it, interesting.

 

Most panels are rounded rectangles  The bottom one is a little more complicated.

 

 

So first draw a rounded rectangle, and ellipse, and another rounded rectangle.  This is all done on the drawing but then removed to work with.  The second part is to delete tiny portions so the other parts can be moved away and finally deleted.  The smaller rounded rectangle has been moved up so as to delete a portion of it.  It is then moved back down and the shaped matched up.  I seem to remember with all of these it took more than one go to get it right.  The 'Undo' command is very useful.  The third picture shows the final little bit deleted and it all moved away, and the fourth picture shows the extra parts deleted and the rest grouped.  This is then copied, pasted, and flipped.

 

 

The windows are copied from the side and matched to the size on the drawing at the back.  Two things are now needed.  As you see above, heights are checked with the clerestory, and:-

 

 

panel heights checked and positioning of top and bottom panelling.  

 

So all the parts are drawn, now they have to be separated into the different laminates.

 

If you have been, thanks for looking.

[Mikkel]

Clever use of those ellipses, that tip will come in handy - many thanks Chris!

 

Edited June 1, 2019 by Mikkel

[ChrisN]

10 hours ago, Mikkel said:

Clever use of those ellipses, that tip will come in handy - many thanks Chris!

 

 

Mikkel,

I think I shall use them for panelling but now I know the exact radius for the tumble home, I will probably use an arc for these.  However, as there are a limited number of types of design I am hoping to reuse a lot of this.  Different length coaches though if you expand or contract the side will alter the curve, I will have to see how much.  It could well be a new side and lower panel each time.

Edited June 1, 2019 by ChrisN

[ChrisN]

Thank you to everyone who gave ratings, they are appreciated.  Yes, this is another update in about a week, and no I am not feeling ill.  Well, we are nearly there.

 

So, it looked like this when everything had been drawn out.

 

 

(It should have been blue but we lost   )

 

Now to separate out the top laminate I firstly removed all the bolections and put them somewhere safe, well down the bottom of the cutting area.  I then changed all the top layer to blue.

 

 

This gives the idea.  I can then select by colour, chose blue and copy.   The blue was then pasted below

 

 

The original was then copied whole onto a new file Final 3, and the blue onto an even newer Final 4.  Why?  I needed to change some blue to red and did not want to lose the first side with all blue, and the second because Final 4 is the final Final.  The more files saved the less likely two months of work will disappear.  On the prototype there is an oval panel between the two rectangular panels on the clerestory but I have judged them too small to cut.

 

 

The outside of the windows, not the door panels, were change from blue to red and this time red was selected, copied and pasted.  The red was then pasted onto Final 4 and the inner windows holes were removed.

 

 

On the original file with the red side the door markings which will be scored not cut were changed to yellow, and red was selected again so this time they did not get copied.  This was pasted onto Final 4 and the outside window holes were removed this time.  The side was selected and grouped, as was the end and this was then copied and pasted giving four laminates.

 

 

The four laminates, (sounds like a Barber Shop quartet), are top, panel layer with panel around the door, outside window hole and scoring for doors, second, outside window hole on door outside window hole on windows and scoring for lower part of doors, third and fourth layers are inside windows for all windows.  The same is for the ends.  The clerestory is top laminate panels, other three inside windows.  I have again changed the lower door scorings to yellow.

 

Now, I thought that was it but the eagle eyed of you will notice that I have not changed the blue door scorings to yellow.  You may also notice that there are only four laminates and there should be five.  The fifth is the layer to hold the glazing.  Laminates three and four also need to be shortened to help form the tumble home.  It is all explained in Andy G's excellent coach building thread and I really should give you a link, which I will when I can get one.  So nearly there.

 

If you have been, thanks for looking.

[drduncan]

Chris,

 

Glad to see the CAD nearly finished!

 

Duncan

[drduncan]

Chris,

 

Glad to see the CAD nearly finished!

 

Duncan

[ChrisN]

Not so much an update....

 

Yesterday, Friday, my wife came to me and said, "Do you want to go on a steam train?"  I was surprised to say the least  You may have noticed that Friday it rained, and in between the rain there was heavy rain.  Now Fridays is the day that usually my wife and I go out together, usually walking or going to a National Trust place, or both.  There was no way we could do that so as my wife did not want to stay in she suggested a railway.  Railways bore my wife so the thought of staying in must have been quite bad.  

 

I looked and of course no trains run on a Friday.  I was about to give up when I checked Didcot.  Bingo!  There was, as some of you know, a three day event where both a Hall and a newly restored Saint, (the prototype?), were in steam together.  I explained to my wife that the train rides were really short and that there was a lot in the open.  She said that was fine as there was going to be a break in the weather.  So off we went.

 

 

I was told by a lady who knew, that the Hall in the centre was unmodified, and the one on the right was modified.  The Saint, Lady of Legend, is on the right.    Now to my great joy, no not an overstatement, I found round the corner three historic coaches.  The first was a T49

 

 

I was a bit disappointed with the finish, thought it had come too early out of the workshop.  As you may know I am building one of my own for the last train of the day from Dolgelley, which started at Ruabon.

 

 

It took me ages to get it into this condition     

 

I had hoped when Lady of Legend was sniffing around them that they would be taken on the main line and I could have a ride in it, but it was not to be.

 

Next up

 

 

A C22 with a Dean Bogie

 

 

Even though an 8ft 6" one.

 

Finally,

 

 

 

A D62.  The last two are of course too late for me but I was interested that the D62 had 'Moorgate' as a destination.

 

We did other things but we eventually ended up in the carriage shed.  It was raining heavily again by now.  They of course had the third class saloon, the G20.  The toilet window was open but I could not hear any Danish Maths teachers crying to get out, so I moved along and took a picture of rain strips

 

 

They must be all of 1/4" wide, (sorry about 8mm), so about a hairs breadth in 4mm.  I could try painting a hair in the groove, then again...…...

 

The cakes are really interesting and very good.

 

If you have been, thanks for looking.

[Nick Gough]

I must have almost bumped into you in the carriage shed Chris!

I was also pottering around in there during the heavy downpour.

 

I also took close up photos of door strips on the Dean brake as well as bolections and other bits and bobs.

 

The vintage coach rake was running with the 'Lady' before lunch time.

 

Glad you had a productive visit.

 

Nick

[ChrisN]

10 minutes ago, Nick Gough said:

I must have almost bumped into you in the carriage shed Chris!

I was also pottering around in there during the heavy downpour.

 

I also took close up photos of door strips on the Dean brake as well as bolections and other bits and bobs.

 

The vintage coach rake was running with the 'Lady' before lunch time.

 

Glad you had a productive visit.

 

Nick

 

Nick,

I was looking at people wondering if I might 'know' them.  Perhaps we should wear badges or something.  

[Nick Gough]

Just to clarify Chris,

The restored clerestorey coach is actually a C10, being 6" narrower than a C22 at 8'0 3/4". There is a C22 in the far recesses of the carriage shed awaiting restoration.

The D62, when built, formed part of a six-coach 'Main Line & City' set. Prior to WW2 these worked into Paddington, from the London suburban area, where the motive power changed over from GWR steam to Metropolitan electric locomotive prior to working over the Metropolitan into the city.  Hence the 'Moorgate' destination. Consequently these coaches were built to smaller dimensions than the prevailing standards (48' length). These workings ceased at the start of the war and never resumed.

 

Nick

[ChrisN]

2 hours ago, Nick Gough said:

Just to clarify Chris,

The restored clerestorey coach is actually a C10, being 6" narrower than a C22 at 8'0 3/4". There is a C22 in the far recesses of the carriage shed awaiting restoration.

The D62, when built, formed part of a six-coach 'Main Line & City' set. Prior to WW2 these worked into Paddington, from the London suburban area, where the motive power changed over from GWR steam to Metropolitan electric locomotive prior to working over the Metropolitan into the city.  Hence the 'Moorgate' destination. Consequently these coaches were built to smaller dimensions than the prevailing standards (48' length). These workings ceased at the start of the war and never resumed.

 

Nick

Thanks Nick,

I thought I had checked the numbers of the coach against Didcot's stock list, but obviously not.

 

I did know the GWR, along with others ran along the Widened Lines, including goods as well, but never really researched it.  I also thought that the GWR ran straight down from their main line, but probably that was earlier.  You probably know that the GWR and GE tried to agree for through running and that a tunnel was built but they could never agree terms so the tunnel was used as an office until Liverpool Street was rebuilt.  We think we have had a long time to wait for Crossrail but it is much longer than we realise.

 

 

 

[ChrisN]

Now do not faint, this is the third update in a week.  

 

I have mentioned Andy G's thread as where I have got by ideas of how to laminate coach sides, and how to do the tumblehomes  So here is the thread, and here is the post about the tumblehome.  I have also have had email conversations with Andy about both of these, so thank you Andy.  The only reason that I have not got further with some of the earlier cuts has been lack of time and also I have been waiting for Dart Castings to produce GCR coach springs, which I think are on their website.

 

Now how have I finished the coach off?

 

 

So, you may be able to see that I have drawn in green around the windows.  The theory is that on the parts where there is plastic strips of 15 thou will go, and a 15 thou strip along the bottom.  I can then slot in 10 thou glazing sheets.  I could then select green and group them.  

 

 

I put it back and then drew a red line under the green so that I could remove the bottom half of layers 3 and 4.  It may be a little clearer below.

 

 

You can see the short 3 and 4 of the sides.  The ends are the same as there is a tumblehome in each direction, but the ends are not in order.

 

So the final file looks as follows

 

 

So from the top we have, panels, full side large windows, two half sides with inside windows and quarterlights.  Below that we have the same in reverse, then the two glazing layers.  You have similar for the ends and clerestories.  The shapes that look like windows are in fact the bolections.  According to Teddy Francis, you glue them to the window openings and when they are dry you cut around the inside of the window and then shape them slightly with your knife.  I shall have to see how that goes.

 

So there we have it.  The cutting area looks a bit busy to me so if those who have experience think some of the sections are too close together, although they are further apart than some of the parts inside the sections please tell me.  Al I have to do now is unpack my cutter and see how it works, do some practise cuts and add cutting information to the file, so done by Christmas then.

 

If you have been, thanks for looking.

[drduncan]

Chris,

Looking very nice, but I couldn’t spot the door and clerestory ventilators on the cutting sheet.

Regards,

Duncan

[ChrisN]

10 hours ago, drduncan said:

Chris,

Looking very nice, but I couldn’t spot the door and clerestory ventilators on the cutting sheet.

Regards,

Duncan

 

Duncan,

 The space for the ventilators is cut out but the ventilators themselves will have to be made, or if available, bought.  I suppose it would be possible to do the equivalent to what is done on brass kits and just score them on plasticard.  If I did that, which is of course possible, I might wish to do it on thicker card, either 15 or 20 thou so they stood proud as they would on the prototype.  I will have a think, and others thoughts are welcome.

[drduncan]

Chris,

Mike Trice did some nice looking ones here 

which might work.  I think they will have to be done on 20thou as you suggest or a double layer in 10thou used (a bit like you see on some etched brass coach kits).

 

I’m about to draw up some for my U9/U10 cutting file over the weekend (hopefully) so will share them with you on completion.  

Regards,

 

Duncan. 

[ChrisN]

On ‎25‎/‎05‎/‎2019 at 05:59, Mikkel said:

I seem to have missed this very important communication from Mr Price!

 

I hope he is all right. He sounds a bit lonely. His wife has clearly gone off to discover her true female self, whilst the son seems to have gotten into trouble, perhaps involving drugs. We hear nothing of the other children, but they are probably attending a climate change demo somewhere. Meanwhile everyone has forgotten Mr Price, the 50+ white male. Is there a men's support group in Traeth Mawr? 

 

I like the colouring of the building very much! 

 

Mikkel,

And I seemed to have missed your answer!  

 

I think Mrs Price has taken all the other four children with her.  I doubt they are at a climate change protest as there was nothing wrong with the climate in 1895.  Well, not so as you would notice.  As for the son, I think he is one f the H0 people I have not bought yet/painted/lost, but please do not tell Mr Price, he will be most upset.  You could ask him about his eldest daughter though, but he may keep you a little while.

 

As for a support group, he goes to the local Wesleyan Methodist Church where he is able to talk about his problems, and they may also give him a place to sleep.

 

Thank you for the comments about the cottage.  I started it as it is a representation of the cottage where I spent my honeymoon, but stopped it as I do not have a definite place to put it on the layout and thought I ought to spend the time on something that might go on.  I think I needed to do more chairs as well so...……..

Edited June 15, 2019 by ChrisN

[Mikkel]

On 14/06/2019 at 22:13, ChrisN said:

I doubt they are at a climate change protest as there was nothing wrong with the climate in 1895. 

 

Yes I suppose that was a bit of blue sky thinking 

 

Although, as an aside: https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/1*glQvYB_yaBu3EnH-UUwnqg.jpeg

[ChrisN]

34 minutes ago, Mikkel said:

 

Yes I suppose that was a bit of blue sky thinking 

 

Although, as an aside: https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/1*glQvYB_yaBu3EnH-UUwnqg.jpeg

 

Mikkel,

Thank you that is most interesting.

[MikeOxon]

21 hours ago, Mikkel said:

 

..................

 

Although, as an aside: https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/1*glQvYB_yaBu3EnH-UUwnqg.jpeg

 

A remarkably prescient article.  The Braidwood Dispatch and Mining Journal seems to have been well ahead of its time, in thinking about climate change in 1912, although we now know that their estimate of several centuries for effects to appear was, sadly, incorreect.

[Allegheny1600]

A remarkable piece!

Makes you think how utterly stupid it is for the present day POTUS to still be in denial about climate change.

Surely President W. Wilson(or, Taft?) would have not been so ignorant.

 

Ahem! So sorry about thread drift (into the bludy colonies, especially!).

Meanwhile, that's excellent work on the drawings, young sir!

John.

[ChrisN]

8 hours ago, MikeOxon said:

 

A remarkably prescient article.  The Braidwood Dispatch and Mining Journal seems to have been well ahead of its time, in thinking about climate change in 1912, although we now know that their estimate of several centuries for effects to appear was, sadly, incorreect.

 

6 hours ago, Allegheny1600 said:

A remarkable piece!

Makes you think how utterly stupid it is for the present day POTUS to still be in denial about climate change.

Surely President W. Wilson(or, Taft?) would have not been so ignorant.

 

Ahem! So sorry about thread drift (into the bludy colonies, especially!).

Meanwhile, that's excellent work on the drawings, young sir!

John.

 

I will think you will find that if you draw a graph of the reduction in Pirates against the increase in global temperature you will find a surprising correlation!  

 

Thank you for your comments about my drawing.  As I have said Andy G has given advice and with actual sizes from Pehrhos and others it has added to it.  Now comes the difficult bit, cutting and making.

[ChrisN]

Now you are probably wondering what I have been up to recently.  No?  Oh sorry.  Still I will tell you anyway.  The answer is, not much.  I have been on holiday to Derbyshire.  I had thought of trying to draw the Dean Bogie, but more of that later.  I did see that we were near the Midland Railway Centre.  All excited, specially as my wife was suggesting we went.  I looked at what was on and it said, "This weekend enjoy a ride on our Heritage DMUs".  Now, I remember 'Heritage DMUs' when they were not heritage, and if one turned up I was disappointed, only alleviated slightly if they were the sort you could look out the front window with the driver's view.  I am not as easily pleased now.  Even though I mainly go on EMUs, or Voyagers, (Is Newcastle in the Gamma Quadrant?  It seems to take ages to get back from there), the only difference to 'Heritage' ones is that the seats are rubbish nowadays.  So I gave that a miss.  Still, there was somewhere else.  Cannot remember where.  The website really only explained what they did for school parties and had as instructions to get there, 'off Green Street.'  Needless to say even though we looked we never found it.

 

As for the Dean Bogie.  I have a picture, but thought I had a better one in another document.  Both had been sent to me.  I looked t the second one and found it was an 8ft 6" bogie not a 6ft 4".  I did start but did not get very far.  Maybe try later.    

 

So what have I been doing?  I want to say, "Are we there yet?"

 

 

 

and from the other side

 

 

 

These photos are rather cruel.  It has had about three or four coats of Halfords grey primer and had the boiler sanded down in between each coat.  The rest has been rubbed, where I can, with a cocktail stick.  Why a cocktail stick?  Someone suggested it as a good method.  I am happy with it as it is abrasive but not too much so.  There are parts I have not touched as I am worried about breaking things and losing detail; I have already broken off two lamp holders on the bunker.  I am not wonderfully happy although the tank is getting better.  I may need something thicker as filler on the tank though, not sure.

 

What is obvious is that I need something stronger on the smokebox door, but I am worried about detail.  My wife has just said, "That looks like a Swiss Roll,"  so something has to be done.  Need a abrasive on the end of a stick.  

 

So, if you have been, thanks for looking.

Edited September 19, 2023 by ChrisN