Hornby K1

[Les1952]

Thanks mali, although that is not really the reason I wanted to see as it means they would be less likely to wander further afield. Still, I can always invoke Rule 1.

 

Try "it has been borrowed by (insert shed name here) while running in from Doncaster/Darlington after a repair" or "It failed at (shed) and has been working from there all week".   K1s were very popular with shed foremen at certain locations and one arriving would often be "failed" with a minor complaint and something else substituted for the return working.  The "failed" K1 would then magically appear on a passenger or fast freight the following morning and be long gone before the substitute reappeared with enginemen who wanted their own steed back.   This class had one of the highest levels of Friday teatime "failures" at Stratford of any LNER type.

 

It might explain some of the sightings at Bristol, Blackpool, Swindon and a few others reported in Trains Illustrated in the late fifties.

 

All the very best

Les

[newbryford]

Anyone for a green (and black/grey/red) 62005?

 

Cheers,

Mick

[JaymzHatstand]

Certainly a 'prototype for everything' photo! I don't think I'll be repainting mine just yet though!

 

Cheers

 

J

[The Black Hat]

resistance is futile...........................

 

I was going to tell you the same thing.

[Worsdell forever]

Spotted a 62027 this morning...

[locoholic]

The kind folk at my local model shop allowed me to look at 8 examples of R3243A today, so that I could pick one that had a roughly straight running plate (in exchange for my R3243 that looked like the running plate was made of rubber). Two out of the eight were OK. Maybe I'm unlucky, or too picky, as they said that no-one else had returned one of the first batch, although from the photos posted on here, my first K1 was one of the bendiest.

 

I'm glad I'm not a retailer - is a model with a curvy running plate faulty enough to be returned to Hornby, or do you send it to a mail order customer and hope that the buyer is so relieved to actually get hold of the model that they'll fix the fault themselves? And will any that do get returned to Hornby simply get sold on their own website complete with the bendy running plate?

 

So, thank you to Hornby for making the model - a good one is a great model, but they seem to have once again snatched defeat from the jaws of victory as far as their quality control is concerned.

[Legend]

Yes that's one of the unique aspects of this hobby . Faced with defective materials most people fix it. Compare this with buying a new digital cares, electronic equipment , where it's instantly returned! Strange behaviour. Which is why Hornby gets away with it.

 

Awaiting feedback on new 4 VEP with interest to see if any lessons learned.

[Les1952]

Yes that's one of the unique aspects of this hobby . Faced with defective materials most people fix it. Compare this with buying a new digital cares, electronic equipment , where it's instantly returned! Strange behaviour. Which is why Hornby gets away with it.

 

Awaiting feedback on new 4 VEP with interest to see if any lessons learned.

 

For Hornby read Hornby, Bachmann, Heljan,  Dapol and everyone else who has stuff made and inspected in China.  Not helped by a collector brigade who would reject a box showing signs of having been opened to check the model inside is perfect.....

 

Just a thought

Les

[robmcg]

The kind folk at my local model shop allowed me to look at 8 examples of R3243A today, so that I could pick one that had a roughly straight running plate (in exchange for my R3243 that looked like the running plate was made of rubber). Two out of the eight were OK. Maybe I'm unlucky, or too picky, as they said that no-one else had returned one of the first batch, although from the photos posted on here, my first K1 was one of the bendiest.

 

I'm glad I'm not a retailer - is a model with a curvy running plate faulty enough to be returned to Hornby, or do you send it to a mail order customer and hope that the buyer is so relieved to actually get hold of the model that they'll fix the fault themselves? And will any that do get returned to Hornby simply get sold on their own website complete with the bendy running plate?

 

So, thank you to Hornby for making the model - a good one is a great model, but they seem to have once again snatched defeat from the jaws of victory as far as their quality control is concerned.

When is a model 'ok' and when is it not? Even TMC's version of 62027 has a slight upward tilt in the front.. quite common with some Hornby models, even if slight, and also Bachmann's Std 2-6-4T.

 

It is arguably part of the reality of making things in plastic, and complex assembly. I wonder how easy it would be to fix?

 

[G-BOAF]

The Bachmann 4MT is an entirely different issue - the components are true but the way the parts are interfaced induces an angle. easily fixed with 0.5mm plasticard shim. A design flaw rather than a manufacturing flaw as with the K1.

 

Running plate aside, that weathered K1 does look a very impressive beast. Lets hope Hornby resolve the issue...

[RBAGE]

The Bachmann 4MT is an entirely different issue - the components are true but the way the parts are interfaced induces an angle. easily fixed with 0.5mm plasticard shim. A design flaw rather than a manufacturing flaw as with the K1.

 

Running plate aside, that weathered K1 does look a very impressive beast. Lets hope Hornby resolve the issue...

Hornby must be aware of the problem and I would hope that they are aware of the exchanges that are taking place in this thread.

 

Assuming they are, which is likely, would it not be appropriate for Hornby to at least acknowledge the issue and make some contribution to the debate?

 

Hello Hornby, are you there?

 

Bob 

[Lambton58]

Got one :imsohappy:

courtesy of Anthony at AGR Models in Leighton Buzzard.

 

But as it's a Christmas pressie I can't play with it till Christmas day though

Ralph

Lambton58

 

Edited for clarity

Edited December 23, 2014 by Lambton58

[manna]

G'day Gents

 

I'd take a few K1's with bendy running plates, off of anyone's hands for 25 quid a pop.

 

manna

[stock_2007]

And I still say there are two ways of looking at it...the loco that is 1/ a quick glance and you'll never see any bent bits or 2/ really look hard at it till it go's in to soft focus and again you'll never see a thing. You all may think I'm making light of the problem...I am. I'm also very happy to have a really nice K1.

[Legend]

To be honest I'm struggling to see issue with TMC one

[railroadbill]

Think in Rob's K1 pic the front running plate does look like it's pointing up a bit but also the running plate in front of the rear sand box filler  looks as if it has an upward wave in it.

[G-BOAF]

To be honest I'm struggling to see issue with TMC one

 

 

Think in Rob's K1 pic the front running plate does look like it's pointing up a bit but also the running plate in front of the rear sand box filler  looks as if it has an upward wave in it.

 

As railroadbill. And you can (I think) see the chassis block protruding below the front buffer beam due to its inclination.

Might TMC have dismantled and reassembled the model in the process of weathering?

[toboldlygo]

As railroadbill. And you can (I think) see the chassis block protruding below the front buffer beam due to its inclination.

Might TMC have dismantled and reassembled the model in the process of weathering?

 

Does look like the chassis block is protruding slightly, however it's more likely down to the front chassis screw not being screwed down properly (as was reported by another poster), rather than TMC dismantling the model for weathering.

[railroadbill]

Other than that it looks very realistic, which probably makes any flaws stand out more.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

Yes that's one of the unique aspects of this hobby . Faced with defective materials most people fix it. Compare this with buying a new digital cares, electronic equipment , where it's instantly returned!...

Far from unique to this hobby. You should see what gardeners have to put up with. And after 99% of the seeds have failed to germinate or the giant asiatic viper weed from a souurce unknown has invaded your borders it's rather difficult to get redress...

[RBAGE]

At the risk of being alienated, I cannot understand why so many posts which either fail to register a problem, apologise for the failings of the manufacturer or accept less of a service than if were some other product that had been purchased.

 

Wake up and smell the coffee. These organisations are not here for your benefit. They are here to make a profit. It seems at all cost.

 

The reason they moved to China was because it was cheap. Not to benefit the customer but to maximise profit. No that labour rates are rising and the better manufacturers in China are changing to more profitable, high tech or automotive product manufacture, model railways are suffering from low cost, low expertise, low quality manufacture so that profit margins can continue.

 

Product such as this needs to be designed for manufacture. Clearly the there is some design issue, there has been a failure in productionisation or the sub-supplier is not able to maintain the quality level that we should all expect.

 

I expect to get a number of unsubstantiated disagreements from this post but the fact is there has been a failure, somewhere.

 

Bob 

[G-BOAF]

Product such as this needs to be designed for manufacture. Clearly the there is some design issue, there has been a failure in productionisation or the sub-supplier is not able to maintain the quality level that we should all expect.

 

 

Which is what 'design clever' tried to be (designed for manufacture at a price and technology), until many of us shouted it down. Having shown us what was possible between 2000 and 2010, thankfully the community doesn't want to see a step backwards.

I presume what you meant was designed for manufacture at the design spec.

Speaking personally, I am most frustrated by rising prices and falling quality. I can't be alone when I say I will accept rising prices for a premium product if it is just that (which is isn't quiet at present).

Edited December 23, 2014 by G-BOAF

[robmcg]

With many and various recent Hornby models with wavy running plate issues I think there is a clear problem with some stage of the design-manufacture-assembly process. Possibly the 'pouring' of the plastic at improper temperatures, I don't know.

 

It does vary in degree, and a small amount of distortion may be inevitable, but can it be that designers think that plastic manufacture and multiple-parts-assembly is always optimal?

 

Of course if the models aren't returned, Hornby won't know about it apart from reading here. And with web-sales increasing, retailers reducing their presence, and importantly, couriers being so difficult, the chances of returns being a significant factor in Hornby's general trading would hard to measure.

 

I returned a poorly-assembled weathered A3 60103 and eventually got a return, it cost me £14 air freight post to send it back from NZ and yesterday, two months after the initial sale, a I received a cheque for £14... to cover the postage, thankyou Hornby ! Two hand-written signatures on it, the bank will charge I think about £5 to change it into my NZ currency. The initial purchase was by credit card, it appears they haven't heard of crediting a card?

 

Again, I think Hornby's management are possibly a bit new to retailing, and being 'streamlined', i.e. fewer employees than necessary, or untrained employees, the result has been, um, mixed.

[Bernard Lamb]

Finally got a K1 to call my own.

The good news.

A straight running plate.

It looks from the blurb on the box sleeve that each individual number has a loco history rather than a generic class note.

Well done Hornby. A nice touch.

The bad news. Well this is Hornby.

One tender side frame was detached and fortunately was to be found lying in the plastic fold up part of the packing.

It fits into two slots but there seemed to be no trace of glue.

Runs very well and certainly looks the dogs whatsits.

Looking at prototype photos the combination of lack of diamond works plates and leccy flashes is a minefield.

Also they did develop a rather run down appearance towards the end.

A spot of reading up is required before it gets let loose. Probably keep it to around 1962 as a compromise. 

Bernard

[WD0-6-0]

Got my K1 today, it was a pleasant surprise considering I wasn't expecting it until early next year. The left hand running plate is a little wobbly but the right is straight. For it's size it's the most powerful loco I own and I'm impressed with its slow running and turn of speed. I absolutely love it and if it wasn't for the vast number of dodgy running plates it would get my vote for model of the year.