RMweb Gold MikeParkin65 Posted February 4, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 4, 2021 13 minutes ago, robmcg said: I used to think that way too, I couldn't enjoy a model of a machine I thought was so flawed in design, and thus in looks, especially the over-long front end. Equally I have read a fair bit about Thompson the man and he was not in my opinion a very likeable nor admirable person, in contrast to Gresley. But the change to leadership was sudden in 1941 and Britain was at war, the P2s were a mess because of axles and other major issues, the V2s were ok excellent even, but had conjugated valve gear, so a powerful mixed traffic engine was a good idea... worked for Bulleid! The biggest problem was that for whatever reason the A2/2 was never 'sorted' in terms of ride at speed, and steam chest/frame flexing issues. Wasn't Bill Hoole the driver who miraculously survived the 1947 Scottish crash which was attributed to poor track where it was at least partially due to poor engine design, with inadequate front bogie side control? My comment is purely on the aesthetics Rob. That said the P2 rebuilds don’t look like they would perform well and they look ungainly almost like a wheel is missing lol Hornby have made a fine model though Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritishRail60062 Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 The Hornby Class 60 for me :). 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted February 5, 2021 Author Share Posted February 5, 2021 4 hours ago, MikeParkin65 said: Beauty is truly in the eye of the beholder of course but for me the A3, A4 and P2 were all ‘handsome’. Whereas this is like an earlier take on ‘steam punk’; bashing all 3 with the ugly stick then joining the battered parts together lol Indeed, one may well say that. I couldn't possibly comment. Except to say I have read many descriptions of Thompson both as a designer and a man and he doesn't come out too well, thus it has been difficult to be objective, especially when he ordered the rebuilding of Great Northern against the wishes of his own senior staff. I was going to write, 'small-minded little git' but then thought better of it... O S Nock and C J Allen wrote something broadly similar but perhaps more circumspect. In 1941-2 there was a good argument for standardising everything, and on paper the A2s weren't entirely bad, the long wheelbase and equal-length connecting rods were I think just too stupid, especially when he expected the long wheelbase to work with a B1 front bogie without accounting for the dynamics at speed, .... but the boilers, exhausts, steam brake, all good as on for instance the O1. Personally I wouldn't let the man work on a Morris Minor, but we did end up with some engines which could steam and pull well. More down to the staff under Thompson than the designer himself. I had to say that because I have just pre-ordered a 60523 'Sun Castle' A2/3 and also bought a nice straight Bachmann 60534 'Irish Elegance. Both are examples of design dragged back from ruin by tradesmen, engine crews and so on, and eventually Peppercorn and his staff. In anticipation of the A2/3 I took the published Hornby images of the engine and tidied them... the paint evaluation models were poorly thrown together, such as front bogie was reversed, and parts don't line up in the photos, but using the standard of manufacture and assembly evident on the new A2/2 60505 'Thane of Fife' I think we can reasonably expect the new 60523 'Sun Castle' A2/3 to look like this... Another case of a model looking better than the prototype? '. 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Decorum Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 10 hours ago, robmcg said: Indeed, one may well say that. I couldn't possibly comment. Except to say I have read many descriptions of Thompson both as a designer and a man and he doesn't come out too well, thus it has been difficult to be objective, especially when he ordered the rebuilding of Great Northern against the wishes of his own senior staff. I was going to write, 'small-minded little git' but then thought better of it... O S Nock and C J Allen wrote something broadly similar but perhaps more circumspect. In 1941-2 there was a good argument for standardising everything, and on paper the A2s weren't entirely bad, the long wheelbase and equal-length connecting rods were I think just too stupid, especially when he expected the long wheelbase to work with a B1 front bogie without accounting for the dynamics at speed, .... but the boilers, exhausts, steam brake, all good as on for instance the O1. Personally I wouldn't let the man work on a Morris Minor, but we did end up with some engines which could steam and pull well. More down to the staff under Thompson than the designer himself. I had to say that because I have just pre-ordered a 60523 'Sun Castle' A2/3 and also bought a nice straight Bachmann 60534 'Irish Elegance. Both are examples of design dragged back from ruin by tradesmen, engine crews and so on, and eventually Peppercorn and his staff. In anticipation of the A2/3 I took the published Hornby images of the engine and tidied them... the paint evaluation models were poorly thrown together, such as front bogie was reversed, and parts don't line up in the photos, but using the standard of manufacture and assembly evident on the new A2/2 60505 'Thane of Fife' I think we can reasonably expect the new 60523 'Sun Castle' A2/3 to look like this... Another case of a model looking better than the prototype? '. I haven’t taken the plunge just yet but from the photographs I’ve seen on here, that has a lot more sheen than the production models and it looks the better for it, so it isn’t quite what I would reasonably expect, sadly. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted March 16, 2021 Author Share Posted March 16, 2021 (edited) More mixed-traffic wartime adventures.... well, post-war built, and in stock at Hornby today... photo edited, colour guessed. Does this look good or what! Edited March 16, 2021 by robmcg correction 4 1 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 16, 2021 Share Posted March 16, 2021 Hi Rob, I haven’t been back through all the previous pages, but by far the best Hornby model I have is the J36, closely followed by the J15, Q6 and the B12. They may not have the glitz and glamour of the large Pacific’s, but are way out there in terms of running quality. The diminutive J36 has running quality I have never seen in any RTR model. 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold MikeParkin65 Posted March 16, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 16, 2021 2 hours ago, gordon s said: Hi Rob, I haven’t been back through all the previous pages, but by far the best Hornby model I have is the J36, closely followed by the J15, Q6 and the B12. They may not have the glitz and glamour of the large Pacific’s, but are way out there in terms of running quality. The diminutive J36 has running quality I have never seen in any RTR model. Agree re the J36, so smooth it is almost hypnotic to watch in action. The Terrier is the same. Not so sure about the Q6, mine was smooth but I am now getting more variable running (fast then unexpectedly slowing down) so I fear it is the start of the motor problems that have been reported elsewhere. Just acquired a J15 which is on the workbench awaiting fitting out (detail parts, chip fitting, Kadees's etc) but I am optimistic it will be a good smooth runner as it was silky smooth on DC running in on the rolling road. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 16, 2021 Share Posted March 16, 2021 (edited) Hypnotic? A really accurate description, Mike. I cannot believe how slow it will run and how it easily pulls a train of wagons that appears far too long for the size of the loco. When pulling away from a standing start, I cannot believe it will move off at a barely discernible speed where other locos need far more volts to get them moving. I meant to say at the outset, all my loco’s are DCC and most fitted with Zimo decoders. Edited March 16, 2021 by gordon s 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted March 16, 2021 Author Share Posted March 16, 2021 11 hours ago, gordon s said: Hi Rob, I haven’t been back through all the previous pages, but by far the best Hornby model I have is the J36, closely followed by the J15, Q6 and the B12. They may not have the glitz and glamour of the large Pacific’s, but are way out there in terms of running quality. The diminutive J36 has running quality I have never seen in any RTR model. The J36 is clearly a state of the art model, and I confess I do tend to concentrate on bigger locos, but in my defence I bought a couple of B12s recently, and before that had a craze on Ivatt 2-6-2Ts , but I fear that if I bought and photographed every model I liked there would be no room left in my house for me... Half the fun was that the split chassis models were cheap, the upgraded chassis versions are rare and over-priced. 8 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black 5 Bear Posted March 16, 2021 Share Posted March 16, 2021 19 hours ago, robmcg said: More mixed-traffic wartime adventures.... well, post-war built, and in stock at Hornby today... photo edited, colour guessed. Does this look good or what! Rob, can you by any chance perform your magic on a wartime black M/N ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted March 16, 2021 Author Share Posted March 16, 2021 1 hour ago, Black 5 Bear said: Rob, can you by any chance perform your magic on a wartime black M/N ? Easily... I had a burst of Bulleid-mania a while ago but never found all the variations in body-styles! 6 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted April 11, 2021 Author Share Posted April 11, 2021 With various Merchant Navy engines in the offing, especially 21C7, time to remember the one one which set it all off... A certain blue 35024 is in the works for photos too. Who ever thought Thompson could build a 6' 2" mixed traffic engine which would still be running express trains at over 100mph in 1967? 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted April 17, 2021 Author Share Posted April 17, 2021 (edited) Bulleid 21C7 'Aberdeen Commonwealth' sometime between mid-1942 and 1944 at Salisbury shed. Probably nearer 1943 with three sanders and a WD alongside. I hope the WDs were around by then. Someone will now tell me that Salisbury shed didn't get built like that until 1960.... I have a more generic shed background if that be the case. Edited April 18, 2021 by robmcg correction 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hroth Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 I really must get an canned MN. I've got an uncanned one (Lamport and Holt Line*), a canned BoB (Manston) and an uncanned WC (Trevone) so an addition would complete the quartet. * My grandfather was an engineer on the L&H Vestris, but luckily had left the ship before it sank in 1928. I'll have to look up the other lines he sailed with, see if there are any canned MNs that match... 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 I am liking the terms, “canned” and “uncanned”. So much better than “un-rebuilt”.... Original is better than that too! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted April 19, 2021 Author Share Posted April 19, 2021 An original 21C3 'Royal Mail' in wartime black looks just the part! Who needed WDs, 8Fs and V2s when you could have this, eh? And what WD or 8F could exceed 100mph too... 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hroth Posted April 19, 2021 Share Posted April 19, 2021 2 hours ago, robmcg said: An original 21C3 'Royal Mail' in wartime black looks just the part! Who needed WDs, 8Fs and V2s when you could have this, eh? And what WD or 8F could exceed 100mph too... Very striking! But the claim by Bulleid that they were "mixed traffic" locos was a bare-faced marketing lie to get production permission past the Men from the Ministry who wouldn't know the difference between one of Bulleids finest and a real mixed traffic loco if they were hit (repeatedly, if possible) in the face with a wet fish! 3 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mckinneyc Posted April 19, 2021 Share Posted April 19, 2021 Rob, I have two Hornby B12s and think they are probably the best steam model they have ever made, closely followed by the J36. I'd get another B12 but have no more room to display my models! 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black 5 Bear Posted April 19, 2021 Share Posted April 19, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, mckinneyc said: Rob, I have two Hornby B12s and think they are probably the best steam model they have ever made, closely followed by the J36. I'd get another B12 but have no more room to display my models! The "Unsung Hero" for me is the Hornby J15, a lovely running loco with excellent detailing and paintwork. Edited April 19, 2021 by Black 5 Bear Typo 4 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted April 19, 2021 Author Share Posted April 19, 2021 2 hours ago, mckinneyc said: Rob, I have two Hornby B12s and think they are probably the best steam model they have ever made, closely followed by the J36. I'd get another B12 but have no more room to display my models! But, but, they are not large nor green nor influenced by Swindon. With evocative names... I agree the B12 is a great model, I had an original Triang one and painted it matt black, it probably still goes, if I knew where it was! cheers 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
33C Posted April 19, 2021 Share Posted April 19, 2021 4 minutes ago, robmcg said: But, but, they are not large nor green nor influenced by Swindon. With evocative names... I agree the B12 is a great model, I had an original Triang one and painted it matt black, it probably still goes, if I knew where it was! cheers Love the B12. You can do so much with it. But i think the bomb-proof, Rovex/Triang/Hornby Princess is an all time great! 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted April 19, 2021 Share Posted April 19, 2021 19 minutes ago, robmcg said: But, but, they are not large nor green nor influenced by Swindon. With evocative names... I agree the B12 is a great model, I had an original Triang one and painted it matt black, it probably still goes, if I knew where it was! cheers Nice... I spy some transfers from a Kitmaster or Airfix Ex GWR 61xx kit. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted April 19, 2021 Author Share Posted April 19, 2021 Just now, Ruffnut Thorston said: Nice... I spy some transfers from a Kitmaster or Airfix Ex GWR 61xx kit. Ah, I shall blame my younger brother for that. I think he exhumed it after I had finished messing with it .... At one stage I had the chassis under a Hornby Duchess of Atholl with botched Kitmaster or Airfix scraps fashioned into valve gear, and I suspect he saved it and returned to to a semblance of sanity. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted April 19, 2021 Author Share Posted April 19, 2021 Here is another photo of 21C7 derived from my pic of 21C3... nice dramatic wartime skies. Can't wait for the new model! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold toboldlygo Posted April 20, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 20, 2021 Resurrected one the M7's the other day for a client, it was a tad poorly - running wise and needed a few bits repairing and replacing. Then looking at my records it's the first M7 on my bench for 6 years 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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