Train spotting at Finsbury Square

[Sandhole]

2 minutes ago, Mallard60022 said:

I bet that Station is cosy almost all the time during the day due to its' position. In winter it might get a bit murky due to the smoke from the various fires and locally, as well as the locos of course.  I can even imagine the smell on a busy Summer's day. A heady mix of Sulpher, Dettol and Creosote and that was just the Buffet.

Clive needs to get a vest as he is a softy Southerner. He knows nuffink. When I were a lad down west, even in August, we used to have to set light to our spotter's Books to keep warm and we never had any shoes, just old sack that we nicked from the Tin Mine Manager's Bothy. 

Here is a pic of my School Bus in mid Summer:

P

 

 

That's a cold Bristol!!
I remember 1981, the diesel in our tractors froze in Wiltshire.
I could bleed a Ford tractor engine in 15 minutes.
Field Marshall engines never bunged up, however!!
I remember one of my agric. college lecturers, Dereck Sadler, thawing out one of the Ferguson 35's on his small holding, by lighting a bale of straw underneath it!!!
It worked and he didn't burn down his Dutch Barn either!!
Regards,
Chris.

[Mallard60022]

4 minutes ago, Sandhole said:

That's a cold Bristol!!
I remember 1981, the diesel in our tractors froze in Wiltshire.
I could bleed a Ford tractor engine in 15 minutes.
Field Marshall engines never bunged up, however!!
I remember one of my agric. college lecturers, Dereck Sadler, thawing out one of the Ferguson 35's on his small holding, by lighting a bale of straw underneath it!!!
It worked and he didn't burn down his Dutch Barn either!!
Regards,
Chris.

Good job there wasn't two then!

P

[mullie]

39 minutes ago, Mallard60022 said:

I bet that Station is cosy almost all the time during the day due to its' position. In winter it might get a bit murky due to the smoke from the various fires and locally, as well as the locos of course.  I can even imagine the smell on a busy Summer's day. A heady mix of Sulpher, Dettol and Creosote and that was just the Buffet.

Clive needs to get a vest as he is a softy Southerner. He knows nuffink. When I were a lad down west, even in August, we used to have to set light to our spotter's Books to keep warm and we never had any shoes, just old sack that we nicked from the Tin Mine Manager's Bothy. 

Here is a pic of my School Bus in mid Summer:

P

 

 

If you were going between Bere Regis and Dorchester you were a very long way from a tin mine!

 

Martyn

[stewartingram]

2 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

I bet that Station is cosy almost all the time during the day due to its' position. In winter it might get a bit murky due to the smoke from the various fires and locally, as well as the locos of course.  I can even imagine the smell on a busy Summer's day. A heady mix of Sulpher, Dettol and Creosote and that was just the Buffet.

Clive needs to get a vest as he is a softy Southerner. He knows nuffink. When I were a lad down west, even in August, we used to have to set light to our spotter's Books to keep warm and we never had any shoes, just old sack that we nicked from the Tin Mine Manager's Bothy. 

Here is a pic of my School Bus in mid Summer:

Mid Summer - isn't that where all the murders were? Some guy called Barnaby sorted them out I believe? I always believed it was somewhere round the Bucks area.

 

 

 

[stewartingram]

2 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

I bet that Station is cosy almost all the time during the day due to its' position. In winter it might get a bit murky due to the smoke from the various fires and locally, as well as the locos of course.  I can even imagine the smell on a busy Summer's day. A heady mix of Sulpher, Dettol and Creosote and that was just the Buffet.

Clive needs to get a vest as he is a softy Southerner. He knows nuffink. When I were a lad down west, even in August, we used to have to set light to our spotter's Books to keep warm and we never had any shoes, just old sack that we nicked from the Tin Mine Manager's Bothy. 

Here is a pic of my School Bus in mid Summer:

Mid Summer - isn't that where all the murders were? Some guy called Barnaby sorted them out I believe? I always believed it was somewhere round the Bucks area.

 

 

 

[31A]

3 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

I bet that Station is cosy almost all the time during the day due to its' position. In winter it might get a bit murky due to the smoke from the various fires and locally, as well as the locos of course.  I can even imagine the smell on a busy Summer's day. A heady mix of Sulpher, Dettol and Creosote and that was just the Buffet.

Clive needs to get a vest as he is a softy Southerner. He knows nuffink. When I were a lad down west, even in August, we used to have to set light to our spotter's Books to keep warm and we never had any shoes, just old sack that we nicked from the Tin Mine Manager's Bothy. 

Here is a pic of my School Bus in mid Summer:

P

 

 

 

I went to school on a bus like that too, but it said UNITED COUNTIES on the side.  Once on a day like that, it had to go onto the verge of a lane to let the bus going the other way pass, but it slid off the verge in the snow and hit the other bus!  We were stuck for a couple of hours until parents came with cars; no mobile phones in those days of course.

 

[Foulounoux]

That winter in Dorset a family friend was the manager of key markets supermarket in blandford forum.

He had the only keys to the store and lived out towards shaftesbury 

 

No way could he get in by car so stepping two tennis rackets to his boots ( yes !!!) He set out having rung his son who lived in Blandford to let him know he was walking in   they tried to stop him but he was insistent that the store had to opened

 

He later recounted hevrealised he was an idiot when he stopped to try and get his bearings and walked towards some fence posts sticking out of the drifts    only to realise that it was the top of telegraph poles he could see and he was probably only yards from the river.

 

He was met a few miles out of by a combination of a  jcb his son and the local constables who told him in no uncertain terms that his journey  was not one he should have undertaken 

[31A]

Bit of a fraught morning, or couple of days here at FSQ.  The other day, the B12 61533 was bringing in the "GE" train, when it failed completely.  After a few seconds, it would move forward about half a turn then stop again.  And so it went on, as if the motor was overheating, although the was no heat to be felt.  With the help of the Big Hand from the Sky, and an L1 that happened to be in the Loco Spur, the train eventually reached it's terminus, and the B12 was dismantled for inspection.

 

Nothing visibly amiss, so a dead motor was assumed.  None of the usual sources seemed to have any B12 motors in stock, but the motor for the Hornby S15 looked as though it was the same, albeit with a different part number.  One was ordered and duly arrived this morning.

 

The motor is indeed the same.  But the flywheels are different!  The B12's flywheels incorporate the coupling for the drive shaft, whereas the S15s have a hexagonal recess in the end.  Don't know how that works as I haven't got an S15.  Anyway thinking nothing ventured nothing gained, I got one of the flywheels off the dead B12 motor with a lot of brute force, a broken scriber as a drift and a big hammer.  The diameter of the flywheel was bigger than the motor, so the flywheel could sit on the jaws of the vice.  However the S15's flywheels are smaller so all I could do was clamp the flywheel as tightly as possible between the jaws, and keep hitting until the motor fell out of the vice onto the floor.  Then repeat, until eventually the flywheel was off.  Then pressed the B12 flywheel onto the S15 motor shaft, using a big G Clamp as a press.

 

After all that mistreatment, luckily the new motor still worked, and was installed in the demic loco.  Putting the body on however, it would run backwards but not forwards!  Dismantle again (not helped by the almost impossible location of the rear end fixing screw, beneath the cab floor) and found that one of the motor feed wires was getting trapped in the slot in the flywheel!  Sorted that (I hope) and re-assemble, then notice the coupling rods are upside down!  Initially cursing Hornby QC under my breath, I then realised that I'd put the driving wheels back in back to front when I'd taken it to bits the other day.  B12s have an equal driving wheelbase - who knew!  Not me, evidently, or I had forgotten.  Anyway easily enough swapped round again, and 61533 seems to be a good runner again, in fact possibly better than it was before.

 

Here are the two flywheels, S15 on the left and B12 on the right (attached to the dead motor).

 

 

61533 is now back on shed, waiting to take its back working in the evening.  As you can see, apart from the motor it s still in 'ex box' condition.  This B12 was used on the M&GN Section, for which it had a tablet catcher on the left hand side of the tender.  When the M&GN closed, it spent its last few moths at Cambridge.  The tablet catcher was removed but I have a distant photo of it, in "LNER 4-6-0s at Work", which shows that something remained on the tender side, probably the bracket that the tablet catcher had been fixed to.  I was hoping to find a better picture to enable me to model whatever it is, before weathering etc, but so far have not ben able to.

 

 

 

 

 

[Neil]

Good to see that you're going the extra mile in the pursuit of realism; shed fitters having to hit things with big hammers to get them working. 

[lezz01]

Personally I would have gone with some sort of gear puller rather than hitting it with a hammer. Although that would all depend upon how much room you have between the flywheel and the motor.

Regards Lez.

[31A]

47 minutes ago, lezz01 said:

Personally I would have gone with some sort of gear puller rather than hitting it with a hammer. Although that would all depend upon how much room you have between the flywheel and the motor.

Regards Lez.

 

So would I if I'd had one, Lezz!  I always tend to be impatient.  Actually there wasn't much room between the flywheel and the motor.

[31A]

1 hour ago, Neil said:

Good to see that you're going the extra mile in the pursuit of realism; shed fitters having to hit things with big hammers to get them working. 

 

Thanks Neil; big hammers often seem to be the way to fix steam locos.....

 

[lezz01]

5 minutes ago, 31A said:

 

So would I if I'd had one, Lezz!  I always tend to be impatient.  Actually there wasn't much room between the flywheel and the motor.

Ah well if there isn't room and you don't have one then you can't use a gear puller.

Regards Lez.

[31A]

8 minutes ago, lezz01 said:

Ah well if there isn't room and you don't have one then you can't use a gear puller.

Regards Lez.

 

I did think of getting one, it might be a useful thing to have anyway.  But I couldn't wait and thought I'd try and improvise with what I've got.  Still a bit surprised I didn't ruin the new motor!  I did briefly think of heating up the flywheel over the gas hob to make it expand but didn't think I'd be able to do that without melting the plastic end of the motor!

[lezz01]

Well I found these two for you should you feel the need.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/133772719398

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/402987441030?var=673180046649

Regards Lez.

 

[31A]

17 minutes ago, lezz01 said:

Well I found these two for you should you feel the need.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/133772719398

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/402987441030?var=673180046649

Regards Lez.

 

 

Thank you for looking, Lez.  The alloy one (your first link) looks as though it would have been able to fit over between the flywheel and the motor for what I did today.

[PhilJ W]

2 hours ago, 31A said:

 

I did think of getting one, it might be a useful thing to have anyway.  But I couldn't wait and thought I'd try and improvise with what I've got.  Still a bit surprised I didn't ruin the new motor!  I did briefly think of heating up the flywheel over the gas hob to make it expand but didn't think I'd be able to do that without melting the plastic end of the motor!

And heat can destroy a motor.

[31A]

1 hour ago, PhilJ W said:

And heat can destroy a motor.

 

I took the old motor apart afterwards actually; it looked perfectly OK inside so I don't know why it didn't work!

[Tony Wright]

19 hours ago, 31A said:

Bit of a fraught morning, or couple of days here at FSQ.  The other day, the B12 61533 was bringing in the "GE" train, when it failed completely.  After a few seconds, it would move forward about half a turn then stop again.  And so it went on, as if the motor was overheating, although the was no heat to be felt.  With the help of the Big Hand from the Sky, and an L1 that happened to be in the Loco Spur, the train eventually reached it's terminus, and the B12 was dismantled for inspection.

 

Nothing visibly amiss, so a dead motor was assumed.  None of the usual sources seemed to have any B12 motors in stock, but the motor for the Hornby S15 looked as though it was the same, albeit with a different part number.  One was ordered and duly arrived this morning.

 

The motor is indeed the same.  But the flywheels are different!  The B12's flywheels incorporate the coupling for the drive shaft, whereas the S15s have a hexagonal recess in the end.  Don't know how that works as I haven't got an S15.  Anyway thinking nothing ventured nothing gained, I got one of the flywheels off the dead B12 motor with a lot of brute force, a broken scriber as a drift and a big hammer.  The diameter of the flywheel was bigger than the motor, so the flywheel could sit on the jaws of the vice.  However the S15's flywheels are smaller so all I could do was clamp the flywheel as tightly as possible between the jaws, and keep hitting until the motor fell out of the vice onto the floor.  Then repeat, until eventually the flywheel was off.  Then pressed the B12 flywheel onto the S15 motor shaft, using a big G Clamp as a press.

 

After all that mistreatment, luckily the new motor still worked, and was installed in the demic loco.  Putting the body on however, it would run backwards but not forwards!  Dismantle again (not helped by the almost impossible location of the rear end fixing screw, beneath the cab floor) and found that one of the motor feed wires was getting trapped in the slot in the flywheel!  Sorted that (I hope) and re-assemble, then notice the coupling rods are upside down!  Initially cursing Hornby QC under my breath, I then realised that I'd put the driving wheels back in back to front when I'd taken it to bits the other day.  B12s have an equal driving wheelbase - who knew!  Not me, evidently, or I had forgotten.  Anyway easily enough swapped round again, and 61533 seems to be a good runner again, in fact possibly better than it was before.

 

Here are the two flywheels, S15 on the left and B12 on the right (attached to the dead motor).

 

 

61533 is now back on shed, waiting to take its back working in the evening.  As you can see, apart from the motor it s still in 'ex box' condition.  This B12 was used on the M&GN Section, for which it had a tablet catcher on the left hand side of the tender.  When the M&GN closed, it spent its last few moths at Cambridge.  The tablet catcher was removed but I have a distant photo of it, in "LNER 4-6-0s at Work", which shows that something remained on the tender side, probably the bracket that the tablet catcher had been fixed to.  I was hoping to find a better picture to enable me to model whatever it is, before weathering etc, but so far have not ben able to.

 

 

 

 

 

Good morning Steve,

 

My compliments on your perseverance!

 

Regarding the B12/3s allocated to the M&GNR section, when they were moved away they lost the tablet catcher on the LH side of the tender, but, as far as I can tell, some sort of bracket remained. 

 

I just soldered a bit of etch to represent it on to the tender side on this PDK example I built.........

 

 

 

It's just visible in these two pictures, interrupting Ian Rathbone's perfect lining.

 

I also have a 61533.

 

 

Built from a McGowan kit (don't ask!), it's certainly not in Hornby's B12/3 league. 

 

I do have a Hornby B12/3 as well......................

 

 

Renumbered/detailed/weathered, it might well be the best model of the class I have!

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

[31A]

27 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Good morning Steve,

 

My compliments on your perseverance!

 

Regarding the B12/3s allocated to the M&GNR section, when they were moved away they lost the tablet catcher on the LH side of the tender, but, as far as I can tell, some sort of bracket remained. 

 

I just soldered a bit of etch to represent it on to the tender side on this PDK example I built.........

 

 

 

 

 

It's just visible in these two pictures, interrupting Ian Rathbone's perfect lining.

 

I also have a 61533.

 

 

 

Built from a McGowan kit (don't ask!), it's certainly not in Hornby's B12/3 league. 

 

I do have a Hornby B12/3 as well......................

 

 

 

Renumbered/detailed/weathered, it might well be the best model of the class I have!

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

 

Thank you, Tony.  That is the best information I've had so far on the tablet catcher brackets on B12 tenders.  If I'm interpreting your pictures correctly, it looks as though you've made it look like a kind of elongated lamp iron?  I think I'm correct in assuming that they were only fitted to the left hand (fireman's) side of the tender?

 

[31A]

4 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Regarding the B12/3s allocated to the M&GNR section, when they were moved away they lost the tablet catcher on the LH side of the tender, but, as far as I can tell, some sort of bracket remained. 

 

Actually this episode has made me think about B12 tenders again, and I wonder whether what I'm looking at in the picture of 61533 in "LNER 4-6-0s at Work" is just a hole in the side sheeting through which the exchanger could be worked, similar to that in the side of the 8-wheeled tenders that were coupled to the P2s?  See for example in Yeadon's Vol 7, the picture of 61516's tender on page 61.  61516 wasn't one of the 'M&GN' B12s that had tablet catchers, but perhaps it got the tender from one which was.

 

[Tony Wright]

4 hours ago, 31A said:

 

Thank you, Tony.  That is the best information I've had so far on the tablet catcher brackets on B12 tenders.  If I'm interpreting your pictures correctly, it looks as though you've made it look like a kind of elongated lamp iron?  I think I'm correct in assuming that they were only fitted to the left hand (fireman's) side of the tender?

 

Good afternoon Steve,

 

Never put too much emphasis on anything I make. I don't have access to a close-up picture (as far as I know) of what was left after the gear was taken off the B12 tenders so fitted. I just guessed at what it might look like, using too far away images, forming it from a bit of a fret (a bit bigger than a lamp bracket). The eye is aware of its being there, largely because it interrupts any lining. 

 

And, yes, as far as I'm aware, the Whitaker apparatus was only on the LH side of M&GNR tenders - the side adjacent to where the automatic catcher was sited.

 

Pictures illustrating it appear on pages 47 and 53 of the appropriate Yeadon's Register of the class. Locos fitted were 61520, 61530, 61533, 61537, 61540, 61545 and 61568. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony.  

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

On 20/11/2021 at 23:00, 31A said:

 

I took the old motor apart afterwards actually; it looked perfectly OK inside so I don't know why it didn't work!

 

1) because it's Hornby QC

2) probably assembled on a Friday afternoon...

[31A]

Happy New Year all, a bit belatedly!  January was an expensive month for Motive Power.  Here's one of them.  What a splendid beast!

 

 

 

 

Not much to do to improve this.  I made new lamp irons for the tender, so that I can hang lamps on it; besides that, just crew and coal.  It's fairly heavily weathered, the real one doesn't seem to have been kept very clean from photos I've seen of it, although my pictures don't really seem to have brought this out.

 

[Wheatley]

I saw that in the cabinet in Monkbar the other day while I was buying my Pilchard, I wondered whether you'd have one by now!