SJC03 Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 I have two DCC systems Roco and Lenz both have a feed back bus.. so can they be connected to enable Roco feedback decoders to work on the Lenz feedback bus and vice versa so I can use the Lenz Ls100 and Roco 10787 on both systems ? Any pinout interface would help if it is possible please. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
corax67 Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 They are both Expressnet so theoretically yes - I have manuals for both but the Roco one is in German so I need to be focused to give you an answer and that will be after the rugby I'm afraid. I have a feeling if it does then connection is via J&K but will check. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzie Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 The Lenz feedback bus is the 'RS' bus which connects to the RS terminals on the LZV100 command station. J and K go to the track. LDT offer different modules for Lenz and Roco so I suspect that they are not compatible in any way. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJC03 Posted March 15, 2014 Author Share Posted March 15, 2014 Thanks Suzie, I am sure that you may be correct but think on another Spanish forum I did see a pin out of the Roco Feedback cable to expressnet conection and wondered if that would be enough and patch through some of the lines to the Lenz feedback terminals ? I gather the Roco feedback cable has power lines and coms where the Lenz separate the two , I assume being Expressnet they would talk to each other. If the worst case I would need to have both sets of kit although I think the Lenz Ls150 would be ok on the Roco black boxes the same can not perhaps be ok for the Roco black boxes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky Dicky Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Xpressnet is basically a command bus connecting input devices such as the LH100 handset and the PC interface to the controller. Lenz feedback modules connect as Suzie has pointed out via the RS feedback bus. If the Roco feedback modules do not have a suitable port to connect to this bus then I am afraid they will not be able to communicate with the controller. I believe Roco handsets can communicate with the Lenz controller as they too use Xpressnet. Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJC03 Posted March 15, 2014 Author Share Posted March 15, 2014 Thankyou Richard, I do use the multimause on the Lenz system as I prefere the handsets to the Lenz offerings and confirm they work well. The Roco feedback bus and socket is a six wired cable with a telephone type connector and this is not the handset cable interface of the multimause. The lenz system splits its connectors for track J & K and feedback R & S the DCC signal going through the track.. I assume the Rocco cable does the same connections albeit in one connection. So that is 4 wires sorted for use the other pair I do not know about.. perhaps power ? The new Z21 Roco system does have a sniffer port to enable connection to a Lenz system as a extension or booster so I assume feedback through to Roco older systems is possible and have heard rumours that Roco did contract out to Lenz the design and building of some of the gear they sell. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzie Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 Paco's site has the Gen-Li-RS module which allows you to connect Lenz style RS-Bus feedback devices to any ExpressNet system including Roco via the Expressnet and it also includes a computer interface. It is quite a handy device if you want to have Lenz functionality without buying a Lenz top-end command station, but I am not aware of anything that works the other way round to give Roco functionality to ExpressNet systems. Paco's Gen-Li-RS module does enable you to protect your investment in RS-Bus devices from Lenz or LDT if you should go that way. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil S Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 The Roco feedback bus uses a variation or extension of the expressnet protocol... At least in the information passed from the interface box to the pc.... Ie the equivalent place to the lens pc interfaces. .... Or opendcc expressnet interface costing 15euro approx. The protocol for the rocomotion i/f has been published for the original rocomotion interface and the current z21 unit..... They are very similar which might be suggestive about the middle version using the multi centralepro. Because the rocomotion software is bundled free with the rocomotion box the feedback modules are effectively tied to the system so as to pay for the software. Some deduction of how they operate can be deduced from the commands provided.... There are commands to specify how frequently they are read eg 1 in 3 cycles of commands. Unique are the commands to initially program the feedback modules giving each a unique identity.... 1...10 of either group 1 or group 2 Giving the 20 maximum in the later version. Users are reminded that there must be no gaps in the number sequence 1..10 in group 1 before group2.... But the groups are hidden from the users. As the user numbers are 1...20 I have not yet checked whether the modules need to be physically in the correct order... I suspect not, as the cabling is serial (By contrast, zero1 controllers shifted a parallel connection for each controller, and then every four, but the zero1 micro mimic system was a serial data shifter, which also required no gaps, and a known number of locations.... I suspect the feedback modules use a similar shift idea...but the split into 2 groups, and they need per programming, reveals that roco's addressing is more complex!) I have no knowledge of the lens rs protocols.... But they are probably public domain, knowing lenz Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJC03 Posted March 17, 2014 Author Share Posted March 17, 2014 Cheers Phil S and Suzie X.. I think it is more complicated than I realized so I shall stick with two systems and each having its own feedback equipment.. at least the switch gear can be shared so it is just the feedback modules. Perhaps in the future things may change with the Z21 having a big impact but I am using older Roco 10830 & 10764 black boxes on the Lenz LZV100 I wonder if Version 4 is due soon being announced some long time ago. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PaulCheffus Posted March 17, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 17, 2014 Cheers Phil S and Suzie X.. I think it is more complicated than I realized so I shall stick with two systems and each having its own feedback equipment.. at least the switch gear can be shared so it is just the feedback modules. Perhaps in the future things may change with the Z21 having a big impact but I am using older Roco 10830 & 10764 black boxes on the Lenz LZV100 I wonder if Version 4 is due soon being announced some long time ago. Hi I wouldn't hold your breath for version 4. I think it was originally announced in 2010 and since then no news. Cheers Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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