Fancy a Budd, Jason?

[dibber25]

Budd RDCs - or simply 'the Dayliner' as it was known on Vancouver Island - have been top of my list of favourite Canadian trains ever since my first visit to Shawnigan Lake in 1976 in the dying days of CP Rail passenger trains. So here is the first train I ever saw in Canada and the first picture I took, along with a shot a day or two later at Shawnigan station. It was a flagstop - you stuck your arm out to stop the train, just like stopping a bus at a request stop. The little wooden station was replaced by a VIA shelter a few years afterwards and today there's no Dayliner and the island main line has been shut down since 2011. Dayliner 9103 was, I think, an RDC-2. It would make a nice model to include in the next batch, Rapido...... (CJL)

[pH]

Britannia Models in BC, Canada still has most of the Canadian paint schemes in stock.

 

http://www.britanniamodels.com

 

Britannia Models' stand at Western Rails in Burnaby this afternoon:

 

[BR60103]

I only saw 4 for sale at the Kitchener show today.

Possibly one on a layout.

[Talltim]

Quick question, when running in multiple, do the chains across the ends doors go between the cars? (on the real thing)

Edited March 20, 2017 by Talltim

[dibber25]

Quick question, when running in multiple, do the chains across the ends doors go between the cars?

 

They might have been intended to, but whether they actually did...... I think the only current MU operation is VIA Rail's Sudbury-White River, which is usually a two-car with an RDC-2 and a RDC-4. As one is baggage only there would not need to be access. I travelled on BC Rail's 'Cariboo Dayliner' in a six-car formation but I think only the Conductor moved between cars. Transport Canada has strict rules about passenger access to the vestibules. It may have been more relaxed about cars with a gangway connection such as 6133, Rapido's preserved example. (CJL)

[AndrewC]

Quick question, when running in multiple, do the chains across the ends doors go between the cars? (on the real thing)

short answer is never saw it. That is from riding the things from 1966-78. CP at least on the Calgary Edmonton run kept them separate with no allowed pass through between units. I remember more than one trip where I hopped off one car onto the other at a station to get away from my annoying little brother.

[Talltim]

I'll have to examine pics of MBTA examples, trouble is between cars is the bit that gets missed in photos

[BR60103]

refer back to Jason's pic on page 1. While the RDC3 front end has no connector, there are corridor connections diaphragms on the other ends visible. I know my wife once went up to the baggage section where our cats were riding; she was a little horrified at how loud the horn was with no sound insulation in the ceiling. I don't really remember how the rest of the connections were made.

 

TTC subway cars had triple chains across the doorways. Mounted to the body at one end and to an iron rod at the other. The rod had a hook at the top and fitted in two rings. When cars were coupled, the rod was transferred to the next car providing a bit of safety, although only crew were allowed through. This was needed on the original cars as the door controls were inside the cab only; later versions had a set under the window opposite the cab.

(We'll have more discussion of this when Jason announces his Red Rocket series.)

Edited March 21, 2017 by BR60103

[railroadbill]

Following on from Dibber25's post #77 above of the Vancouver Island Dayliner, here's a couple of pictures of 9103 again, in 1977. It's at Parksville.

 

 

 

 

 

Here's a shot from the cab.  I got a cab ride, being for most of the journey the only passenger!

 

Pity the line has closed.

 

I posted a couple of these before, Chris, during a previous discussion of the line, but it seemed worth putting them back up again!

 

 

 

[No Decorum]

Following on from Dibber25's post #77 above of the Vancouver Island Dayliner, here's a couple of pictures of 9103 again, in 1977. It's at Parksville.

 

P1020834.JPG

 

P1020832.JPG

 

P1020830.JPG

 

P1020840.JPG

 

Here's a shot from the cab.  I got a cab ride, being for most of the journey the only passenger!

 

Pity the line has closed.

 

I posted a couple of these before, Chris, during a previous discussion of the line, but it seemed worth putting them back up again!

I suppose if you were the only passenger, it’s little wonder the line had to close. Years ago I was on the island and was fascinated by the tracks. No-one seemed to know much about them, which might go some way to explaining why you were the only passenger! It is sad that it closed. Nice pics, thank you.

[dibber25]

I suppose if you were the only passenger, it’s little wonder the line had to close. Years ago I was on the island and was fascinated by the tracks. No-one seemed to know much about them, which might go some way to explaining why you were the only passenger! It is sad that it closed. Nice pics, thank you.

 

I travelled a number of times and I was never the only passenger, but there were never very many. It was one train per day and that doesn't constitute a train service by any stretch of the imagination. It shut due to the condition of the track and bridges. It seems that on these minor lines, once they were built, maintenance was minimal. I first travelled in 1976, then 1981, 91 and numerous times in the 2000s. Each time I thought my journey would be the last. It finally finished in 2011 but even now there is a smokescreen of service restoration at some future date. More likely is a tourist operation between Parksville and Port Alberni on the former freight-only branch which is even more scenic than the main line. (CJL)

[rapidotrains]

Right - tried to "love" Chris's post and ended up thanking him for being friendly.

Nice photos, Chris!

 

-Jason

[pH]

It was one train per day and that doesn't constitute a train service by any stretch of the imagination. 

 

For a non-commuter operation in western Canada, that is a pretty intensive service! The only more frequent current service I can think of is Amtrak into/out of Vancouver from/to Seattle - twice each way per day. The demand is just not there. 

 

It seems that on these minor lines, once they were built, maintenance was minimal. 

 

I'm not sure I would agree that the E&N was a "minor line" - certainly not in all respects. It was a major factor in British Columbia joining, and remaining, in Canada! - 

 

http://www.timescolonist.com/life/islander/our-history-the-e-n-s-long-journey-from-dream-to-doubt-1.2227824

 

More likely is a tourist operation between Parksville and Port Alberni on the former freight-only branch which is even more scenic than the main line. 

 

As they say - I would not hold my breath waiting for that. 39 miles of railway with hard grades through pretty sparsely-inhabited countryside (though, I agree, very scenic). IMO the only chance for that would be if the branch was being used for freight operation and the tourist operation could piggyback on that. Despite talk of coal export through Port Alberni of coal from mines on the east side of the Island, I don't think that's going to happen. 

Edited March 21, 2017 by pH

[dibber25]

Right - tried to "love" Chris's post and ended up thanking him for being friendly.

Nice photos, Chris!

 

-Jason

Thank you for producing a VERY nice Dayliner! I must admit to a slight 'RMweb critic'-style disappointment that the PGE/BC Rail RDCs don't have the celebrated five-tone horns but I understand why. I once read an article explaining how Bob Swanson conducted tests to get the 'perfect' horn with the correct melodious note, as close as possible to a steam whistle. Those were the horns fitted to PGE locos and RDCs. The RDCs also had huge roof-mounted ditch-lights in the early days. I once made castings for the horns and the lights. I may still have some Athearn RDCs with those details in place. If so, I'll recover them before I scrap the cars. One of my colleagues wants me to stage a re-make of the X-Files using my old RDCs. (A BC Rail RDC was blown up in an episode of the X-Files). (CJL)

[dibber25]

More pictures of RDCs. I'm obsessed with single-unit railcars of all sorts. (CJL)

 

VIA Rail 6148 (RDC-2 but with a buffet counter) near Shawnigan Lake about 2006. There are rails there somewhere but probably not much by way of sleepers (ties) - one reason why the service was suspended. 

 

The lunch-time shunt at Lillooet BC as the 'Cariboo Dayliner' from North Vancouver-Prince George is split. Two cars lay over, four go north to Prince George.

 

BC-21 at Lillooet. This car would be withdrawn with fire damage a few years later after hitting debris on the line and rupturing a fuel tank.

 

The six-car 'Cariboo Dayliner' northbound along the lake shore of either Anderson or Seton lakes in about 1991. BC Rail was sold to CN and passenger service was withdrawn. Much of this incredibly scenic railway is now inaccessible, although 'Rocky Mountaineer' runs tourist trains over part of it.

 

 

Edited March 21, 2017 by dibber25

[Talltim]

 

Here's a shot from the cab.  I got a cab ride, being for most of the journey the only passenger!

Love that level crossing shot

 

 

I've been watching videos, but I can't see between the cars clearly but it looks like I need a larger mortgage!

https://youtu.be/ht4NH5R5nVw?t=3m44s

Edited March 21, 2017 by Talltim

[srihaggis]

Maybe not relevant to the route mentioned above but I found this video fascinating, mostly onboard shots, in-cab, saloon and vestibules.

 

Edited March 21, 2017 by srihaggis

[dibber25]

Maybe not relevant to the route mentioned above but I found this video fascinating, mostly onboard shots, in-cab, saloon and vestibules.

 

Yes, it is very relevant - the northern section of the route. Total length of the run was about 150 miles. Took all morning and laid over for an hour and a bit at lunchtime in Courtenay, then all afternoon to get back to Victoria. 6135 and 6148 were the last two RDCs to work on the island. They are now stored at the TMC in Toronto. Jason and I sat in them during a visit in 2015. I notice the cameraman walked through between the two cars, but these are two of the ex-CN ones with gangways (diaphragms). Nanaimo station, seen in the film after a serious fire, has since been restored and is now a pub. (CJL)

[dibber25]

British Columbia Railway BC-31 in the 'dogwood' paint scheme (late 1970s) with the full complement of lights and the five-trumpet air horns (three on top, two below) in their unique arrangement. This one also has the fluted stainless steel wrapped around the front. Corners of pilot are missing - probably not replaced after accident damage. The line was notorious for rock falls. Speeders often ran in front of trains on the most dangerous sections to check for obstructions. Horns, lights, two-tone green and dogwood logo - the Budd cars surely never looked better than this. (CJL)

Edited March 21, 2017 by dibber25

[railroadbill]

Maybe not relevant to the route mentioned above but I found this video fascinating, mostly onboard shots, in-cab, saloon and vestibules.

 

 

Great video, Srihaggis. Thanks for that, really enjoyed watching it. Nanaimo station looked forlorn, but glad it's been restored as CJL said.

 

If I remember correctly, the horn was operated by the engineer pulling a wooden handle on the end of a chain, rather like an old fashioned toilet.... 

 

When I rode this line all those years ago in 1977, Parksville was as far as the train went, due to a problem with the line further north. This must have been later rectified and the service restored.

 

Take the last train to Parksville and I'll meet you at the station.....   :-)

[dibber25]

Great video, Srihaggis. Thanks for that, really enjoyed watching it. Nanaimo station looked forlorn, but glad it's been restored as CJL said.

 

If I remember correctly, the horn was operated by the engineer pulling a wooden handle on the end of a chain, rather like an old fashioned toilet.... 

 

When I rode this line all those years ago in 1977, Parksville was as far as the train went, due to a problem with the line further north. This must have been later rectified and the service restored.

 

Take the last train to Parksville and I'll meet you at the station.....   :-)

Yes, the horn was operated by a wooden handle hung on a cord across the windshield. Somewhere I have a picture of the engineer pulling it, from my one and only cab ride on the island. The northern part of the line was shut down due to problems with two trestle bridges in the late 1970s or early 1980s. Canadian Pacific was taken to court and made to repair them. The ladies of Parksville potters' guild sell some very nice pottery in the station now. (CJL)

[pH]

 

BC Rail was sold to CN and passenger service was withdrawn.

Other way round - passenger service was withdrawn before BC Rail operations were leased to CN for what could be a 990-year term. It would appear that a scheduled passenger service was not thought to be a selling point. If you've never read the story of the sale/long term lease of (most of) BC Rail, complete with raids on the BC Legislature, withdrawal of bids, criminal prosecutions etc. - it makes fascinating, and enraging, reading.

[dibber25]

Other way round - passenger service was withdrawn before BC Rail operations were leased to CN for what could be a 990-year term. It would appear that a scheduled passenger service was not thought to be a selling point. If you've never read the story of the sale/long term lease of (most of) BC Rail, complete with raids on the BC Legislature, withdrawal of bids, criminal prosecutions etc. - it makes fascinating, and enraging, reading.

 

I recall it was a travesty. Can't imagine CN buying anything that had either a passenger service or steam (WCRA access at Squamish) although CN does operate the Agawa Canyon service, having taken over the Algoma Central. The regular passenger service got withdrawn, though. (CJL)

[dibber25]

On the basis that Jason collects all things VIA, and I never throw anything away, I thought I'd post these, which I unearthed this afternoon while looking for something else. First are two consecutive timetables for E&N trains Nos. 1 and 2 (VIA 198 and 199, I think). Note that they cover the changeover from CP Rail to VIA, the second one having quietly dropped any reference to CP.

Also in the same drawer - in my garage - I found this package from Budd which formed the research for an article I wrote for Modern Transport magazine back in 1978. I've pulled out the section on how many cars were built, because it's from the horse's mouth, as it were. The SPV2000 was the big hope of the day - an AMcoach with an engine and a pointed nose on one end. It wasn't a success. (CJL)

[gridwatcher]

Anybody had any issues with their sound fitted RDC being a little bit eager/quick off the mark? Would have thought CVs would be set up perfectly, but no?! Any tips as to how I might slow the thing down a little? Looks like CVs have been set up as per a conventional big motor and large flywheels not this neat little set up in the Budd......?

Edited March 30, 2017 by gridwatcher