Sheffield Exchange, Toy trains, music and fun!

[Mallard60022]

9 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

Hi Gibbo

 

Here is my very old conversion , which has never been finished and was badly damaged after the box it was in fell off the shelf.

That is my bestist weathering that is.

Ar$£

[Gibbo675]

9 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

Hi Gibbo

 

Here is my very old conversion , which has never been finished and was badly damaged after the box it was in fell off the shelf.

Hi Clive,

 

A minor amount of filling, filing and painting would see that right in no time. Does your two car Craven have DC kits cab ends ?

I am part way through a DC kits one with another in a box and the best modification I made was to form the filler caps in the body sides which seem to make quite a difference to how it looks.

 

Your Pullman conversions remind me of my Pullman conversions which also need painting, all far too many of them.

 

Gibbo.

[Clive Mortimore]

47 minutes ago, Gibbo675 said:

Hi Clive,

 

A minor amount of filling, filing and painting would see that right in no time. Does your two car Craven have DC kits cab ends ?

I am part way through a DC kits one with another in a box and the best modification I made was to form the filler caps in the body sides which seem to make quite a difference to how it looks.

 

Your Pullman conversions remind me of my Pullman conversions which also need painting, all far too many of them.

 

Gibbo.

Hi Gibbo

 

The conversion pre-dates the Dc kit, they are scratch built.

 

On a demo stand I was making cabs for a class 107 and Charlie stopped and said something on the lines that I could buy some from him. My reply  was "Where's the fun in that?" and walked off saying "What ever".

[Ravenser]

On 03/02/2019 at 23:51, Clive Mortimore said:

 

Shall I repair and motorise the Cravens I was making from Tri-ang Mk1 coaches?

 

Yes - they certainly worked Sheffield - Retford-Lincoln in the 1980s and I presume were there much earlier.

 

Definitely a local type in the 1980s and I'm pretty confident the 70s too

[31A]

On 04/02/2019 at 22:23, Andrew P said:

Impressive pics mate, the Station throat looks good.

 

Can I ask about the Silver Coaches / Units? When I was modelling the German Railways, (pre Brexit) I had the Silver Fish Sets that were the Urban Commuter Trains, but I've never seen them before in the UK.

 

I thought they'd escaped from the Circle Line!

[Gibbo675]

5 minutes ago, 31A said:

 

I thought they'd escaped from the Circle Line!

Hi 31A,

 

How can that be ?

Clive's railway has a triangle in it.

 

Gibbo.

[31A]

2 minutes ago, Gibbo675 said:

Hi 31A,

 

How can that be ?

Clive's railway has a triangle in it.

 

Gibbo.

Unpainted like C69 Stock!

 

[Clive Mortimore]

Another unpainted unit ran tonight, all be it o the BRCW units chassis. A Cravens unit, the MTK one has the other brake arrangement to the Bachmann one , making it ideal for either a LMR or NER set. It could well become a 112.

 

 

 

I am using Hornby clip fit bogies, the front lug catches on the floor mounting mouldings inside the cabs and coach ends. So there is me trying to file away 5 mm of white metal inside the coach. Then I thought with the mini drill I have there are some grinding tools,. The soon clogged up with white metal, then I thought what about one of the milling looking tools. I done five coaches in under half the time it had taken me to do one with a file.

 

The Pullmans ran again and the passengers on the 3.23pm to Doncaster had some extra seating as the train was formed of two class 114 DMUs instead of the normal four coach train made up of Cravens or met cam units.

[Clive Mortimore]

I keep slipping up and forgetting a song, well tonight while I was in the train room I was listening to

 

 

[Clive Mortimore]

OK on another thread I have been told that I could do so much more with DCC.

 

I like wiring, so that is not a problem for me.

 

My trains go backwards and the other way. Sometimes the wrong way but that is the fault of the operator.

 

The in the main stay on the track. If they don't is due to an operator error or a mechanical problem....crappy wheels being the main culprit.

 

The role of driver and signalman are separate. The signal man sets the route by changing the points and then (when installed) clears the right signals. Once the guard has blown his whistle the driver opens the throttle and off the train trundles. Apparently you can't do this in DC? What is the difference with DCC because the real railway does the same thing. The singnaller sets the route and clears it with the signals and the driver drives the train. With any one man model railway you end up being the signalman, driver, and guard. Any problems are due to the operator not the system.

 

My layout is wired up for operational purposes. So where I need to park a loco or multiple unit I have an isolating section. Recently I installed two extra isolating sections because of an oversight in the design phase. I don't park locos or units just anywhere but where they would and are protected by signals.

 

Lights, look at 1960s photos of trains on summer days ( I like modelling the summer) and point out where you can see lights on trains.

 

Sound.....tone deaf so most is just engine noise and 'orrid.

 

Consisting.....I do that three or four units running in multiple.

 

Running multiple trains. Normally I run three, two on the main lines as I do loco changes or limited shunting ( I get bored quickly with too much shunting) with a third engine. I find trying to drive a fourth on my own difficult in as much as I need to concentrate on too much. This would happen if I had a different form of control. I will not run two trains on the same mainline in the same direction, even if one doesn't catch the other up. Each mainline is a block section and it isn't permissive block. When guest operators are present four trains is easy , two each. There cannot be more than four trains moving in the station area at one time, there isn't the capacity to do so without ignoring the signalling.

 

Talking of permissive working I can have permissive use of the platforms with DMUs or other short trains, there is a need to make sure any model power unit is standing on the length of track that can be isolated. For most operating sessions I don't need to do it, so not a major problem.

 

What can DCC do that I cannot do with DC on my layout?

 

If DCC can eliminate operator error and stop stuff jumping off the track I might buy it.

 

[Andrew P]

5 minutes ago, Clive Mortimore said:

OK on another thread I have been told that I could do so much more with DCC.

 

I like wiring, so that is not a problem for me.

 

My trains go backwards and the other way. Sometimes the wrong way but that is the fault of the operator.

 

The in the main stay on the track. If they don't is due to an operator error or a mechanical problem....crappy wheels being the main culprit.

 

The role of driver and signalman are separate. The signal man sets the route by changing the points and then (when installed) clears the right signals. Once the guard has blown his whistle the driver opens the throttle and off the train trundles. Apparently you can't do this in DC? What is the difference with DCC because the real railway does the same thing. The singnaller sets the route and clears it with the signals and the driver drives the train. With any one man model railway you end up being the signalman, driver, and guard. Any problems are due to the operator not the system.

 

My layout is wired up for operational purposes. So where I need to park a loco or multiple unit I have an isolating section. Recently I installed two extra isolating sections because of an oversight in the design phase. I don't park locos or units just anywhere but where they would and are protected by signals.

 

Lights, look at 1960s photos of trains on summer days ( I like modelling the summer) and point out where you can see lights on trains.

 

Sound.....tone deaf so most is just engine noise and 'orrid.

 

Consisting.....I do that three or four units running in multiple.

 

Running multiple trains. Normally I run three, two on the main lines as I do loco changes or limited shunting ( I get bored quickly with too much shunting) with a third engine. I find trying to drive a fourth on my own difficult in as much as I need to concentrate on too much. This would happen if I had a different form of control. I will not run two trains on the same mainline in the same direction, even if one doesn't catch the other up. Each mainline is a block section and it isn't permissive block. When guest operators are present four trains is easy , two each. There cannot be more than four trains moving in the station area at one time, there isn't the capacity to do so without ignoring the signalling.

 

Talking of permissive working I can have permissive use of the platforms with DMUs or other short trains, there is a need to make sure any model power unit is standing on the length of track that can be isolated. For most operating sessions I don't need to do it, so not a major problem.

 

What can DCC do that I cannot do with DC on my layout?

 

If DCC can eliminate operator error and stop stuff jumping off the track I might buy it.

 

Well said Young Man, my next OO Layout will probably be DC / Anolog, / Finger Poke / simples.

[Gibbo675]

4 minutes ago, Clive Mortimore said:

OK on another thread I have been told that I could do so much more with DCC.

 

I like wiring, so that is not a problem for me.

 

My trains go backwards and the other way. Sometimes the wrong way but that is the fault of the operator.

 

The in the main stay on the track. If they don't is due to an operator error or a mechanical problem....crappy wheels being the main culprit.

 

The role of driver and signalman are separate. The signal man sets the route by changing the points and then (when installed) clears the right signals. Once the guard has blown his whistle the driver opens the throttle and off the train trundles. Apparently you can't do this in DC? What is the difference with DCC because the real railway does the same thing. The singnaller sets the route and clears it with the signals and the driver drives the train. With any one man model railway you end up being the signalman, driver, and guard. Any problems are due to the operator not the system.

 

My layout is wired up for operational purposes. So where I need to park a loco or multiple unit I have an isolating section. Recently I installed two extra isolating sections because of an oversight in the design phase. I don't park locos or units just anywhere but where they would and are protected by signals.

 

Lights, look at 1960s photos of trains on summer days ( I like modelling the summer) and point out where you can see lights on trains.

 

Sound.....tone deaf so most is just engine noise and 'orrid.

 

Consisting.....I do that three or four units running in multiple.

 

Running multiple trains. Normally I run three, two on the main lines as I do loco changes or limited shunting ( I get bored quickly with too much shunting) with a third engine. I find trying to drive a fourth on my own difficult in as much as I need to concentrate on too much. This would happen if I had a different form of control. I will not run two trains on the same mainline in the same direction, even if one doesn't catch the other up. Each mainline is a block section and it isn't permissive block. When guest operators are present four trains is easy , two each. There cannot be more than four trains moving in the station area at one time, there isn't the capacity to do so without ignoring the signalling.

 

Talking of permissive working I can have permissive use of the platforms with DMUs or other short trains, there is a need to make sure any model power unit is standing on the length of track that can be isolated. For most operating sessions I don't need to do it, so not a major problem.

 

What can DCC do that I cannot do with DC on my layout?

 

If DCC can eliminate operator error and stop stuff jumping off the track I might buy it.

 

Hi Clive,

 

I agree, my last layout was full cab control and it was great, I would set the road and select which controller and of I would go. The loco yard had plenty of isolated sections so I could place a locomotive anywhere I wanted it and also move locomotives that were between others in sidings etc.

 

I feel that there is an aspect of "latest gizmo! to DCC along with all of the extra expense, worse still should it fail how do you fix it ?

By comparison at least with the traditional analogue system its all relatively easy and cheap to fix.

 

As for toy trains with noises it would seem to me that removes the fun of making your own noises, comedy value if nothing else !

 

Gibbo.

[Zomboid]

DCC can do stuff that you don't value.

 

Having heard my toy Alcos authentically sounding like they're falling to bits, I wouldn't be without sound myself, and I'm a liability with a soldering iron so not having to have isolating sections and so on works for me - and I'm quite happy to cheat and use frog juicers and the like.

 

It's the great thing about having choice - we can all make different ones and enjoy ourselves. I'm envious of how much you're enjoying your layout, because I rarely get to run mine.

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

I am using DCC for independent control of locos with sound, but also poking the points with fingers.  So, full digital control I would say.

 

One day I would like to fit mechanical signalling and point control, like The Lairds or St Enodocs - but that's a long way off - mainly because I don't understand it yet.

 

Then I will have the best of both worlds.

[jazzer]

On 2 February 2019 at 22:47, Clive Mortimore said:

Hi Peter

 

I had considered the excuse of locos coming from Doncaster after a works visit. That is why there is a 70 ft turntable for the Pacifics which sadly no longer appear since the advent of the diesels. Just I cannot flood the layout with 10 scratchbuilt , 6 cut and shuts and a Heljan Baby Deltics. One now and then might be OK. As for services to London, I have purposely made Exchange face northwards so it serves towns in Lancashire, Yorkshire and north Lincolnshire. That is why I have a reasonable amount of DMUs and non-gangway coaches for the shorter journeys.

 

In my stash of stuff that needs finishing I do have enough Pullmans for both the Master Cutler and Sheffield Pullman when they consisted of 1930s built K stock. All cut and shut old Hornby ones for the correct formations. I also have a few Bachmann and Southern Pride Mk1 Pullmans and a Tri-ang Blue Pullman I was making into a Midland Pullman . I think I have as many Pullman coaches as I have Mk1 gangway stock.

Hi Clive, I can't comment on Pacifics or Master Cutler but your layout and its 70ft turntable came to mind this morning when I was looking at a Stanier 8F with an express passenger head code and a motley collection of coaches. It's reporting code pasted on the smoke box was 1E 21 which in the Summer 1961 Timetable identifies it as the 11.30 am Summer Saturday's Only Sheffield - Llandudno. Goodness knows why anyone other than trainspotters would want to go to Liandudno, but it gives you scope for a big engine on something a bit different. 

 

The new Platforms lot impressive BTW.

[Stubby47]

Llandudno is quite nice, actually, much better than Rhyl, where I was brought up. 

 

On another thought, our host regularly adds videos of young ladies playing loud music then informs us he's tone deaf..  am I missing something?

[timbowilts]

Stubby, how do you think he became tone deaf???

Tim T

Modelling Cwm Cynon in EM

[Derek 19B]

Station looking good Clive.

 

Of course the Master Cutler and the Sheffield Pullman could not be in the station at the same time as it was the same stock!

Cutler to London , London to Sheffield , Sheffield to London , The Sheffield Pullman, Cutler London to Sheffield. When spotting I would leave Midland for a quick jog down to Victoria to see what was on the Pullman. DP2 was never on for me , but the Retford Rocket (standby B1 )appeared  a few times and a New England V2 , never when i was there the required pacific, more likely in midland on the York / Bristol.

 

Derek 19B

[Clive Mortimore]

7 hours ago, Stubby47 said:

Llandudno is quite nice, actually, much better than Rhyl, where I was brought up. 

 

On another thought, our host regularly adds videos of young ladies playing loud music then informs us he's tone deaf..  am I missing something?

I like Llandudno. Last time I was there Frank Carson was appearing there. He was walking around the town centre, he looked over to me and a very pregnant Mrs M and said "I see the honeymoon is over"......how good is that Frank Carson cracking a personal joke.

 

OK tone deaf, I cannot distinguish between different sounds, I know they are and when I hear a song I can recognise it but notes on their own, not a clue. I have tried to play all sorts of instruments no success. It was suggested I try the drums. I cannot keep a beat....when I was in the army I was the corporal Jones in our unit when doing drill. My sister says that occasionally I hit the right note when singing.....accidentally. I was a good roadie and I have been known to do the lights at gigs.

[Clive Mortimore]

4 hours ago, Derek 19B said:

Station looking good Clive.

 

Of course the Master Cutler and the Sheffield Pullman could not be in the station at the same time as it was the same stock!

Cutler to London , London to Sheffield , Sheffield to London , The Sheffield Pullman, Cutler London to Sheffield. When spotting I would leave Midland for a quick jog down to Victoria to see what was on the Pullman. DP2 was never on for me , but the Retford Rocket (standby B1 )appeared  a few times and a New England V2 , never when i was there the required pacific, more likely in midland on the York / Bristol.

 

Derek 19B

Hi Derek 

 

I did call them the Master Cutler and Sheffield Pullman......I will go and sit on the naughty step after typing this. It was the same stock. 

 

The two trains come from my Kings Cross project when these were the only Pullmans you could buy. I needed two Pullman sets to represent all the Pullman trains for the 1969 WTT. I had the formations for the Master Cutler and it seemed an ideal formation for what I was doing.  For some reason they were not disposed off when I got rid of all the other coaches I had for the project. Even today they do not fit my plans, why have I still got them? Answers on a post card to the normal address. 

 

Anyhow the Master Cutler always had D1575 on the front. And it wasn't a Pullman. It was the only passenger train that regularly had a Brush 4 1/2  going through Bedford. All the other trains had Peaks hauling them.

[Dagworth]

Nothing wrong with Llandudno, I've just come back from a long weekend there with some band. 

Only trouble is that a lot of my friends who were there seem to have gone down with the Llurgy, hoping I don't!

 

Badge 

[Clive Mortimore]

5 minutes ago, Dagworth said:

Nothing wrong with Llandudno, I've just come back from a long weekend there with some band. 

Only trouble is that a lot of my friends who were there seem to have gone down with the Llurgy, hoping I don't!

 

Badge 

Hi Badge 

 

I always thought the sound of the Alarm was only to be really heard in Rhyl? 

 

 

For other readers of this thread , Mr Dagworth is pretty hot at doing the lights at gigs.......including Basil Brush. 

[St Enodoc]

15 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

What can DCC do that I cannot do with DC on my layout?

At the risk of opening a second front, the short answer to your question is... nothing. However, on other layouts DCC can do some things in a more straightforward way than can DC; and conversely on some layouts (particularly if you have hidden and/or remote fiddle yards or if you are a lone operator) DC can do some things in a more straightforward way than can DCC.

All I've tried to do in the Other Place is to explain why I chose DCC to achieve my specific goals.

 

Keep calm and play trains!

[Clive Mortimore]

Well I had good intentions tonight, I did start to make some more chassis for the MTK units but only got as far as cutting out the holes for the bogies.

 

Now I have a lap top computer in the toy room.  I went to open up Firefox, just to see what rude comments people are making on here. It wouldn't open it came up with some message saying it couldn't load b0ll0x  of something like it. Contact Firefox. Yeah if I cannot load it how can I contact Firefox? So I had a brain wave and uninstalled it. Reloaded it. Great thought I. No No No I couldn't get RMweb or even Goggle as the screen said that they were insecure sites and it was protecting me. Uninstalled and reloaded again. Yeah!!!! at least I thought so. It said the spell check was in place, but it wasn't working. So I opened Chrome and wrote me message on that. Tomorra I will use Chrome on the flip-flop.

 

 

 

[Bogie]

17 hours ago, Andrew P said:

Well said Young Man, my next OO Layout will probably be DC / Anolog, / Finger Poke / simples.

 

Your next what?