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BEIJIAO - a large Chinese HO exhibition layout set in the 21st century


TEAMYAKIMA
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22 hours ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

The main pressure on me is that after 30 months off the exhibition circuit, and me having been furloughed for most of that time,I will have absolutely no excuse if the layout is not 100% PERFECT when it finally goes on show again. 99.9% perfect will NOT be acceptable.

 

I'm no psychiatrist, and I make no claims or assumptions about your good self,  but if I may sound a note of caution here as a fellow modeller.

You're taking this far too seriously, no layout can be 100% perfect, I'd be happy with 50/50 the way things are these days, and I think you are putting too much pressure on yourself to try and achieve the impossible. Don't let frustration turn to exasperation.

It's an excellent layout, and your commitment to it and it's prototypical fidelity does you proud, but I have seen too many people in all walks of life. including railway modelling, strive for the impossible, fail within their own minds eye, and give up and walk away and I should hate this to happen.

I know we all are what we are, and making changes is difficult, (and I say that as a perfect Yorkshireman as we all are!}, but standing back and looking at the bigger picture, it's only toy trains, and we're supposed to enjoy the hobby.

 

Mike.

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2 minutes ago, luke_stevens said:

I assume you'll want the layout fully signalled and interlocked by next exhibition? :)!

 

I'd be happy to just get the layout up and get one train running. Followed by an evening in the pub to celebrate. 

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8 hours ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

You're taking this far too seriously, no layout can be 100% perfect, I'd be happy with 50/50 the way things are these days, and I think you are putting too much pressure on yourself to try and achieve the impossible.

I must admit that at times when reading this Thread, I've thought to myself that I wouldn't want to be on the operating team myself. It sounds like a lot of hard work to be honest, with a lot expected of each person. Doesn't sound like fun at all, despite the very interesting subject matter.

I would happily spend a lot of time watching as a punter, and would be utterly none-the-wiser if things didn't run at 100% - or a lot less - of accuracy, perfection or expectation.

In short - lighten up a bit!!! ;) :good:

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20 minutes ago, Al. said:

 

I'd be happy to just get the layout up and get one train running. Followed by an evening in the pub to celebrate. 

Is that just Once in total? :laugh:

 

Or just once every exhibition? :laugh::laugh:

 

Luke

 

PS Actually the China Rail main would be easy: Light is green, train passes and signal goes red, signal goes green after set period of time (2 aspect operation). Could be done reasonably easily by using  a TrainTech SC100 for each line. http://www.train-tech.com/index.php/signalling/sensor-signals-fully-automatic-signalling) I am NOT volunteering!

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2 hours ago, F-UnitMad said:

I must admit that at times when reading this Thread, I've thought to myself that I wouldn't want to be on the operating team myself. It sounds like a lot of hard work to be honest, with a lot expected of each person. Doesn't sound like fun at all, despite the very interesting subject matter.

 

Hmmmmmm??

 

All I would say is that a lot of what I'm doing is to try to make life easier for my operators. No-one appreciates their efforts more that me. My two main concerns are

 

1. To make the operation as stress-free as possible - which means making the layout work reliably. This is not easy to achieve when we can't test the layout except at a show.

2. To minimise the set-up and take-down time. (The former so as to maximise the time in the pub)

 

I am trying to get 'everything done' because I have plenty of other hobby related things I want to get on with - I want to get this layout to the stage where it is reliable and finished so that between shows I get get on with other things.

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5 minutes ago, ColinK said:

We are all different, I would be very happy to operate a layout that is interesting to run.

That has been one of our problems actually. 

The layout was designed with (more) interesting operation in mind, but for a variety of reasons we have never attempted to fully exploit what the layout is capable of. Hopefully, next time out we will be able to show the layout's full potential. 

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9 hours ago, ColinK said:

We are all different, I would be very happy to operate a layout that is interesting to run.

I should think if a layout isn't interesting to run, it isn't worth building in the first place?

 

That isn't really what I meant, and you are right that we are all different. I wouldn't want to help operate any of those massive American basement empire layouts, either, or a big UK 'main line station' with lots of complex moves. Watch, yes - operate, no. That's just me - my interest in operations is taking a freight down a branch & switching spurs along the way, at a nice relaxed pace. That's what my layout does. For me. :good:

My comment was really in response to the thoughts around '100% perfect', and '99.99%' not being acceptable - seems, on the written page, to be what is called these days, a "Big Ask". :scratchhead:

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39 minutes ago, F-UnitMad said:

My comment was really in response to the thoughts around '100% perfect', and '99.99%' not being acceptable - seems, on the written page, to be what is called these days, a "Big Ask". :scratchhead:

 

Yes, of course I was exaggerating to emphasise a point. TBH I exaggerate quite a lot and people often comment on it. In fact, if I've been told I exaggerate once, I've been told a million times.

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1 minute ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

 

Yes, of course I was exaggerating to emphasise a point. TBH I exaggerate quite a lot and people often comment on it. In fact, if I've been told I exaggerate once, I've been told a million times.

 

The old ones are the best!

 

Mike.

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Going back to the concept of interesting operation........................

 

1.The industrial 

 

I spent a huge amount of time. effort and money building in all sorts of possible moves on the industrial and my team have made it clear that what they want is nice and simple - not complicated. Part of this is the fact that what is interesting if one is demonstrating a complicated move to a visitor to a home layout as a 'once off' becomes a chore if you have to repeat it forty times at an exhibition. Also complicated moves on the industrial slows down the through movements - if you're shunting or running round a train there can be no through traffic.

 

So my team have decided that it is better, all round, to concentrate on just one USP - the banking of up hill trains - and then keep things nice and simple. I have also increased the variety of trains on the industrial and so concentrating on through moves will cycle this greater variety of trains through the layout more quickly.

 

2. China Rail

 

Once things are reliable (100% or near enough) we will attempt more complicated moves on China Rail. So far we have never used the crossovers on the front of the layout, because the route selection never worked properly and there were so many points to change (and change back) that we never had the time and so all the trains on the three China Rail system just 'tail-chased'. Now the route selection works properly we will try more interesting moves.

Edited by TEAMYAKIMA
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It is difficult to predict what an audience wants to see. When we were exhibiting our model of Alresford Station, we would have a procession of trains passing up and down the line from one fiddle yard to the other, while the three sidings in the goods yard were being shunted. After shunting wagons around, a train was built up and would depart the goods yard and head off to the fiddle yard, to return shortly after to repeat the procedure. However, as soon as the goods train left the layout, the audience would rapidly disperse. We changed our operation so the goods train never left the yard, but continuously moved 10 or 12 wagons between the sidings all day long. We had a constant audience, with individuals not staying long enough to realise the goods train never left.

 

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31 minutes ago, Ian Morgan said:

 We changed our operation so the goods train never left the yard, but continuously moved 10 or 12 wagons between the sidings all day long. We had a constant audience, with individuals not staying long enough to realise the goods train never left.

 

That is so in line with my experience over the last 40 odd years and I know other layouts which have come to similar conclusions.

 

As I have said before we are going to re-think our operation to maximise interest for the viewers. Two examples....................

 

1.  Our biggest USP is the DOUBLE banked coal trains at the back of the layout which is very impressive with all three locos being sound equipped. But if a non-sound diesel hauled train runs through the layout on the China Rail lines closer to the audience then the viewer's attention is completely drawn to that rather mundane experience because it's right in front of them.

 

CONCLUSION - we will attempt to co-ordinate things so a train on China Rail does not run through when a banked train departs.

 

2.  One of our operators in particular has always thought that two trains passing each other on the China Rail double track main line is very impressive - and it is! But the consequence is that there is then a long delay with nothing appearing on the  China Rail double track main line until both trains are safely back in their respective fiddle yard roads.

 

CONCLUSION - whilst the two trains passing each other is a  very positive feature the negative consequences make it better (in general) to have trains sequencing in quick succession, clockwise then anti-clockwise, then clockwise etc. Maybe a double passing as a special request for some impressive video, but in general not.

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44 minutes ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

 

That is so in line with my experience over the last 40 odd years and I know other layouts which have come to similar conclusions.

 

As I have said before we are going to re-think our operation to maximise interest for the viewers. Two examples....................

 

1.  Our biggest USP is the DOUBLE banked coal trains at the back of the layout which is very impressive with all three locos being sound equipped. But if a non-sound diesel hauled train runs through the layout on the China Rail lines closer to the audience then the viewer's attention is completely drawn to that rather mundane experience because it's right in front of them.

 

CONCLUSION - we will attempt to co-ordinate things so a train on China Rail does not run through when a banked train departs.

 

2.  One of our operators in particular has always thought that two trains passing each other on the China Rail double track main line is very impressive - and it is! But the consequence is that there is then a long delay with nothing appearing on the  China Rail double track main line until both trains are safely back in their respective fiddle yard roads.

 

CONCLUSION - whilst the two trains passing each other is a  very positive feature the negative consequences make it better (in general) to have trains sequencing in quick succession, clockwise then anti-clockwise, then clockwise etc. Maybe a double passing as a special request for some impressive video, but in general not.

 

You'll never please all of the people all of the time. Some people want to see things moving and constant succession of trains, others don't. But my experience of exhibitions is that the "movers" are in the majority, so that's what I principally aim for on Deadmans Lane - a double track mainline with RTC yard behind.

 

Most of the time, the two mainline operators try and stagger the passing trains to avoid long gaps between trains. Holding one just off scene until the train passing in the opposite direction goes off-scene.

As much as it does look good to have two passing on the mains, it creates a relatively long gap (in punter attention span timescales) as they both have to be driven round to the storage yard and the next one selected and driven round to the front.

 

Either way, the yard operator keeps an eye on the mainline and makes sure he has a shunt move to do in the gap.

If I'm on the yard. I'll often stop a move, wait for the mainline to go by and then resume shunting.

 

As for 100% - it's a portable layout, shifted around in a van, subject to the vagaries of temperature, humidity and human error.

 

Luckily, I do have a location where I can assemble it completely and test/train stock/operators, but even then, errors will creep in at a show.

 

 

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11 hours ago, richard i said:

As a punter two passing on the front means I can not study each for the full time, but it does look good, so once in a while passing on the front is a good amount for me. 

 

You've given me an idea.

 

Passing trains on the double track leaves a long gap afterwards.

 

We don't want any trains on the China Rail when we make the banking move. So if we link the two that seems a good fit.

 

The industrial operator flags up that he is preparing a banking move. The China Rail operator sends out a passing move. The industrial operator waits and then does the banking move.

 

Perfect!

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You may remember that last year I bought a load of bespoke mugs for all the team to be used at shows.

 

The first batch were not 100% perfect, not even 99.9% perfect and so I bought another set and gave the first batch to the team to use at home. Here is a photo of the team receiving their (not perfect) mugs - 

 

IMG_20201023_152354.jpg.84f71cd2139904a5965ecfc44c3c503f.jpg

 

So, when the new batch of mugs arrived I thought I must make sure that these mugs can get to and from exhibitions safely and undamaged and so I went out and bought a designated 'mug box'.

 

DSC_1700.JPG.de2fe70cf1a15f8138df4b3863cb182a.JPG

 

Then I dropped the designated mug box ............................

 

IMG_20210510_161024.jpg.9a7d1dc22b32b999ec06234f1c5574b1.jpg

 

The best laid plans of mice and men !

 

 

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A lot of venues are now demanding that covered (lidded) mugs should be used. They are also unbreakable*.

 

IMG_20210615_091905 IMG_20210615_091927

 

 

I got mine from TF Graphics Cornwall

 

* well, if you try hard you might manage it.

 

(Unbreakable toys are useful for breaking other toys with)

 

Edited by Ian Morgan
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7 hours ago, Ian Morgan said:

A lot of venues are now demanding that covered (lidded) mugs should be used. They are also unbreakable*.

* well, if you try hard you might manage it.

 

 

An unlidded mug still makes a mess when dropped from a fiddle yard to a hard floor, even if it doen't break :)

 

Luke

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9 hours ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

 

You've given me an idea.

 

Passing trains on the double track leaves a long gap afterwards.

 

We don't want any trains on the China Rail when we make the banking move. So if we link the two that seems a good fit.

 

The industrial operator flags up that he is preparing a banking move. The China Rail operator sends out a passing move. The industrial operator waits and then does the banking move.

 

Perfect!

Or the industrial opperator flicks a switch and cuts the power to the 2 China Rail lines :) :) :) ?

 

Luke

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10 hours ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

You may remember that last year I bought a load of bespoke mugs for all the team to be used at shows.

 

The first batch were not 100% perfect, not even 99.9% perfect and so I bought another set and gave the first batch to the team to use at home. Here is a photo of the team receiving their (not perfect) mugs - 

 

IMG_20201023_152354.jpg.84f71cd2139904a5965ecfc44c3c503f.jpg

 

So, when the new batch of mugs arrived I thought I must make sure that these mugs can get to and from exhibitions safely and undamaged and so I went out and bought a designated 'mug box'.

 

DSC_1700.JPG.de2fe70cf1a15f8138df4b3863cb182a.JPG

 

Then I dropped the designated mug box ............................

 

IMG_20210510_161024.jpg.9a7d1dc22b32b999ec06234f1c5574b1.jpg

 

The best laid plans of mice and men !

 

 

 

I must admit, I have never bought mugs in kit form...

 

 

Kev.

 

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