letterspider Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 I doubt we wil now see more Class 90's until 2022/2023 but I would be very happy to be proved wrong reasons... The issue of broken bogies probably caused a headache for them with numerous returns that had to be investigated and a solution found - at the same time they will want to wait and see what sales have been like over time before considering whether there will be much demand or profit in a second batch then they will need to consider the perfect timing for a second run - it is a busy year for electrics with the arrival of an 86, a 92, more 87's an APT and more 85's all this during a period of contraction of the global economy and disruption of Brexit and apparently competition for production slots perhaps there may be a possibility of new liveries in time for Christmas - my guess is Bachmann is hoping to see prices rise as availability of the current batch of 90's become scarce. Until recently prices were actually falling - which is bad for them - for buyers it is good. What is clear is they know the market well - I would have thought it suicidal to release new liveries of the Class 66 but I think they were clever to release sound versions quite close to the price mark of the Hattons model. 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomScrut Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 8 hours ago, letterspider said: wait and see what sales have been like over time before considering whether there will be much demand or profit in a second batch Maybe, but given that they didn't do EWS they didn't exactly help themselves sales wise either IMO, it is probably the livery carried by the most locos for the longest time. EWS and DB are probably straightforward ones to do on a next run, and would work for ECML modellers with the new mk4s too. RES I also think would be popular as they got about on all sorts. My favourite would be an "Over The Rainbow" FL orange one, to work with my current FL one but I appreciate that won't be as popular as DB or EWS. 8 hours ago, letterspider said: What is clear is they know the market well - I would have thought it suicidal to release new liveries of the Class 66 but I think they were clever to release sound versions quite close to the price mark of the Hattons model. I think that's maybe more luck than judgement. If the Hattons one had lived up to expectations then I expect it might have been another story, and then also at £119 the Hattons one seem to have been selling well from what analysis has taken place on that thread. The cleverest thing they could do is sort the marker lights out on the 66. If illuminated models can do a kit for about a tenner then how much would it cost them to add a couple of LEDs to a circuit board they are already making?! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
letterspider Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 Perhaps DB was reluctant to give a reasonable licensing fee for EWS Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Street IEMD Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 7 hours ago, letterspider said: Perhaps DB was reluctant to give a reasonable licensing fee for EWS Thats really unlikely, given the number of EWS liveried locos Bachmann makes, 66, 37, 08 etc etc and also have done for some time, and also they do a number of DB, liveried locos - even most recently, with 66117 and also 66100, this will all about Bachmann and nothing to do with any issue DB has - IMO. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Street IEMD Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 @TomScrut Maybe, but given that they didn't do EWS they didn't exactly help themselves sales wise either IMO, it is probably the livery carried by the most locos for the longest time. EWS and DB are probably straightforward ones to do on a next run, and would work for ECML modellers with the new mk4s too. RES I also think would be popular as they got about on all sorts. My favourite would be an "Over The Rainbow" FL orange one, to work with my current FL one but I appreciate that won't be as popular as DB or EWS. Regarding the above, yes, EWS liveried 90s can still be seen at Crewe IEMD in the long term storage sidings, EWS 90s were also seen on the GEML backing up Anglia services initially, and also seen on the WCML on Caledonian Sleeper movements in the days of EWS operations alongside the three dedicated liveried locos (90019, 90021 and 90024) . DB ones, like EWS, also have been used on both ECML and WCML, 90035 in up to date DB has also been seen on the GWML and MML electrification projects. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
letterspider Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 4 hours ago, DBC90024 said: Thats really unlikely, given the number of EWS liveried locos Bachmann makes, 66, 37, 08 etc etc and also have done for some time, and also they do a number of DB, liveried locos - even most recently, with 66117 and also 66100, this will all about Bachmann and nothing to do with any issue DB has - IMO. I assume they can't just have sweeping licensing rights? They would have to renegotiate for each new model. That is assuming DB deals with marketing directly. They may have sold their imaging rights to 3rd parties who make a business of such. Whatever, if the fee becomes too high Bachmann may decide that they don't want to pay it. I do hope not as I would like an EWS and DB 90 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomScrut Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 36 minutes ago, letterspider said: I assume they can't just have sweeping licensing rights? They would have to renegotiate for each new model. That is assuming DB deals with marketing directly. They may have sold their imaging rights to 3rd parties who make a business of such. Whatever, if the fee becomes too high Bachmann may decide that they don't want to pay it. I do hope not as I would like an EWS and DB 90 No, but unless there is some silly technicality then I doubt it would be an issue. I expect such a thing will be on a release by release basis. There have been a lot of DB models released since Bachmann did the 90. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 On 19/02/2021 at 23:20, classy52 said: I just don't get it. I follow the work being done in this thread on the Class 90's and the beautiful and expert resprays constantly being undertaken but why since its announcement nearly 7 years ago would Bachmann only release 3 Class 90 liveries outside of the Collector's Club which are only good until 2015 (yes you have to update the Freightliner from 2015 to current day) and don't do anymore after that, now bear in mind it's been nearly 3 years since these three were released. I am genuinely curious as to why this is the case, have Bachmann come to the conclusion that nobody wants to buy anymore new Class 90's thus shelving it (no that wouldn't make any sense) or what else could be the reason since they have the new tooling. You look at the rate Hornby churn out D&E's at their level of tooling and with Hattons being able to get out 30+ Class 66's and not to mention everybody else releasing loads of Classes with a huge amount of liveries then why is it so difficult for Bachmann to do the same or to a lesser extent and this way of thinking appears to inflict their new Class 20/3 range as well, yes you guessed it only 3 liveries. Everyone keeps saying 'next quarter they will do more', almost like people wishing to win the lottery but that has been the case for the past 2 years at least. Anyway, love the work being done on the 90's in this thread. They have limited manufacturing capacity; simple as that. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verulam Central Posted February 21, 2021 Share Posted February 21, 2021 I think limited manufacturing capacity is also the reason given the backlog of models. I think if i was at Hornby i might tempted to updated their class 90 and take advantage of Bachmann taking so long and beat them to market. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Street IEMD Posted February 21, 2021 Share Posted February 21, 2021 1 hour ago, Verulam Central said: I think limited manufacturing capacity is also the reason given the backlog of models. I think if i was at Hornby i might tempted to updated their class 90 and take advantage of Bachmann taking so long and beat them to market. I think there could be some mileage in them (Hornby) simply launching other new liveries with their existing tooling 90 for some customers who don't want the fancy tech from the bachy90 ... remember they have recently launched a Malcolm 90, they could do the orange Freightliner and a newer db one relatively easily. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
letterspider Posted February 21, 2021 Share Posted February 21, 2021 If Hornby put the new Class 87 S-F pantograph onto the roof of the 90, they could certainly sell a lot more if they added TTS - they would sell a lot lot more. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dagworth Posted February 21, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 21, 2021 20 minutes ago, letterspider said: If Hornby put the new Class 87 S-F pantograph onto the roof of the 90, they could certainly sell a lot more if they added TTS - they would sell a lot lot more. 90s never carried SF pans. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Street IEMD Posted February 21, 2021 Share Posted February 21, 2021 S-F ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
letterspider Posted February 21, 2021 Share Posted February 21, 2021 Sorry I meant B W Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Street IEMD Posted February 21, 2021 Share Posted February 21, 2021 B W ? What's that ? You mean the newer look panto ... not the scissor one obviously... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dagworth Posted February 21, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 21, 2021 SF - Stone Faively BW - Brecknal Willis. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Street IEMD Posted February 21, 2021 Share Posted February 21, 2021 Ahhhh okay thank you pet @Dagworth Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
letterspider Posted February 21, 2021 Share Posted February 21, 2021 Maybe Hornby could put dual drive in there while they are at it and a driver Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Street IEMD Posted February 21, 2021 Share Posted February 21, 2021 2 minutes ago, letterspider said: Maybe Hornby could put dual drive in there while they are at it and a driver I think you are getting carried away ... what we need is a properly cured problem-free Bachmann 90 in a yet to be seen livery .. ie EWS/DB/Virgin etc 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Decorum Posted February 21, 2021 Share Posted February 21, 2021 20 minutes ago, DBC90024 said: I think you are getting carried away ... what we need is a properly cured problem-free Bachmann 90 in a yet to be seen livery .. ie EWS/DB/Virgin etc Agreed. Hornby would possibly undermine sales of the old 90. As it is, the Railroad range captures a lot of sales from less particular and less prosperous customers. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomScrut Posted February 21, 2021 Share Posted February 21, 2021 17 hours ago, 'CHARD said: They have limited manufacturing capacity; simple as that. From what I have gathered on here, Bachmann compete with other Kader companies for production slots (although AFAIK they are no longer owned by Laser as such). Therefore bigger markets may take priority? I don't know, just a point of view derived from what I have seen said on here. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Street IEMD Posted February 21, 2021 Share Posted February 21, 2021 I'm sure I have seen something like that too ... as a 90 owner, I'm just glad there are ways of having the liveries you want without having to wait five or more years before they are launched. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrel Rail Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 Old DB or New DB, that is the question! 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
letterspider Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 90 pages of the Class 90 Why not start a wishlist? Before anyone asks...the double arrows were just too hard to draw...and no it isn't a Bachmann... 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Street IEMD Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 (edited) Drat ... someone beat me to it ... the ninetyth page, well second best will have to do, a wishlist for me is topped by Grand Central branded Class 90s (meaning the resurrection of the Blackpool north to London Euston services - this will be good for the economy - giving more folk access to UK tourism), seconded by a new Scottish highlands liveried DB Cargo 90 (hopefully meaning new deal for DB working with Malcolm - also good getting DB and Malcolm working together again with more Greener Cleaner logistics services)... beyond these two... a standard DB and EWS liveried 90 works for me and probably a number of people here too. Kat@johnsonstreetIEMD Edited February 23, 2021 by DBC90024 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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