Jump to content

Andy Y

Bachmann FFA/FGA early container flats

Recommended Posts

 
On 04/02/2019 at 13:15, adb968008 said:

Isnt that the Water carrier made at some considerable expense for 6024 King Edward 1st ?

 

https://www.railpixtc.co.uk/Steam/Main-Line-Railtours/Main-Line-Steam-for-2007/i-KshQCzW

 

i seem to think it was only used a handful of times then sidelined.

Steam railtours dont make money by carrying water around with them.

 

The big objection to this was aesthetics - steam locos didn't co-exsist with modern container flats and tanks and paintig it GWR brown wasn't going to fool anybody.

 

I believe that as a result, the owning society went and added water tanks to a BR Mk1 GUV instead - which looks far more pleasing being coupled behind a steam loco.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
30 minutes ago, phil-b259 said:

 

The big objection to this was aesthetics - steam locos didn't co-exsist with modern container flats and tanks and paintig it GWR brown wasn't going to fool anybody.

 

I believe that as a result, the owning society went and added water tanks to a BR Mk1 GUV instead - which looks far more pleasing being coupled behind a steam loco.

Tyseley has the Brown GUV (unrelated to 6024).

 

WCRC also has a maroon GUV, but thats not been seen for ages.

 

Bittern has a second tender, ex4472 (I recall reading 60163 Tornado was also configured to be compatible to it, but ive never seen it use it).

 

I understood at the time, their was some discussion to cladding the water carrier for 6024 to make it look like a Siphon.

 

carrying water isnt popular, as it reduces trainload by upto 2 vehicles, can put axle load restrictions, and its cheaper/easier to stop and top up from a road tanker, than prolonged non-stop running, which is hard to path at slower than comparative operational speeds anyway.

If 90mph running was to return, then there may be a greater case for it, certainly Water was the only thing in Bitterns way in 2013, I recall waving at people in an EMU from the fastline south of Peterborough, as we over took it.

Edited by adb968008
  • Informative/Useful 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Would be interesting to see Tornado out with a 2nd tender. Especially when she I running at 90 regularly. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Since the last few posts have refered to steam, here's a legitmate example. Black five 45290 passing Moston with 4vac wagons leading what looks like a 5set, 2 pictures appear in "Manchester, Days of Steam" vol1, captioned as heading to Castleton(1966 Bernard Crick). There was a wagon repair facility there(Marcrofts in the 80's) . Stick that on at an exhibition as bait and see how long before someone passes a derogatory remark.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And on a different note, anyone attempting the Fletliner brick workings? I have fond memories of it passing the bottom of my school playing fields near Hinckley on the north bound working circa '76. I'd love to replecate the train, but 15 might be a tad long, even at a shortened 10 I'd still need 30 boxes. And there lies the problem, I've no idea what the bricks were actually carried in, pretty sure the old Triang open container is not what was used.

'Fletliner'

More from Flickr sort of answered my own question, big flat pallets by the look of these piccies https://www.flickr.com/search/?sort=interestingness-desc&safe_search=1&text=fletliner&view_all=1

Edited by w124bob
added flickr liink
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm coming back to the subject of the 5 (or 4?) set Freightliner Service to Paris in the late sixties featured in these two great little videos 

https://www.britishpathe.com/video/london-paris-freightliner-service-inaugurated-at-s

https://www.britishpathe.com/video/freight-liner-trains/query/freight+train

They still leave me with a few questions:

Was it a 5 or 4 set?

If it was a 5, would it have been two sets of outers and one inner? Or two outers and three inners?

Is it likely to have travelled from London to Dover as just a 5 (or 4) set?

Tantalisingly, on the second video, the Frieghtliner set is unloaded coupled to a number of traditional conflat type wagons. Might this have travelled as a mixed set between London and the coast?

Any thoughts?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, chrissixties said:

I'm coming back to the subject of the 5 (or 4?) set Freightliner Service to Paris in the late sixties featured in these two great little videos 

https://www.britishpathe.com/video/london-paris-freightliner-service-inaugurated-at-s

https://www.britishpathe.com/video/freight-liner-trains/query/freight+train

They still leave me with a few questions:

Was it a 5 or 4 set?

If it was a 5, would it have been two sets of outers and one inner? Or two outers and three inners?

Is it likely to have travelled from London to Dover as just a 5 (or 4) set?

Tantalisingly, on the second video, the Frieghtliner set is unloaded coupled to a number of traditional conflat type wagons. Might this have travelled as a mixed set between London and the coast?

Any thoughts?

 

A five-wagon set would be: FGA, FFA, FFA, FFA, FGA; FGA (Outer) wagons have conventional draw-gear on one end, and a bar (semi-fixed) coupling at the other. The FFA (inner) wagons have bar-couplings at both ends, and thus couldn't be coupler to the buffer-fitted end of the FGA. The photo I've seen of the wagons on ship had all four roads loaded; presumably 4-set, 5-set, 5-set and 4-set, the outer roads being shorter.

Addenda: having looked at the video, I think you're correct about the 'conventional' containers. I suspect they might just travel as far as Dunkerque, there being transhipped on to SNCF wagons. I hadn't heard of this with containers, though I knew cattle wagons did this. It solves a little mystery for me, as I had often wondered why BR 4-ton containers had metric particulars for weight and size, long before this became the norm.

Edited by Fat Controller
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 06/04/2019 at 17:41, w124bob said:

And on a different note, anyone attempting the Fletliner brick workings? I have fond memories of it passing the bottom of my school playing fields near Hinckley on the north bound working circa '76. I'd love to replecate the train, but 15 might be a tad long, even at a shortened 10 I'd still need 30 boxes. And there lies the problem, I've no idea what the bricks were actually carried in, pretty sure the old Triang open container is not what was used.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/5080301033/in/photolist-nb7co7-UUD3q2-8JVSv8-qE95QJ-bBCSYV

More from Flickr sort of answered my own question, big flat pallets by the look of these piccies https://www.flickr.com/search/?sort=interestingness-desc&safe_search=1&text=fletliner&view_all=1

I think those are 20' open containers; don't forget that early Freightliner containers were bottom-lift, which would look like slots for a fork-lift's tines, though at rather large centres. They have got different sides, by the look of things. The photo in 'Freightliner- Life and Times' doesn't show the sides, as it's from above, but a tantalising glimpse of the end can be seen, looking like diamond-pattern mesh. This would be similar to the sides on Plasmor wagons, and on the wagons that were used to bring concrete slabs from the Mendips to Acton.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Fat Controller said:

A five-wagon set would be: FGA, FFA, FFA, FFA, FGA; FGA (Outer) wagons have conventional draw-gear on one end, and a bar (semi-fixed) coupling at the other. The FFA (inner) wagons have bar-couplings at both ends, and thus couldn't be coupler to the buffer-fitted end of the FGA. The photo I've seen of the wagons on ship had all four roads loaded; presumably 4-set, 5-set, 5-set and 4-set, the outer roads being shorter.

Addenda: having looked at the video, I think you're correct about the 'conventional' containers. I suspect they might just travel as far as Dunkerque, there being transhipped on to SNCF wagons. I hadn't heard of this with containers, though I knew cattle wagons did this. It solves a little mystery for me, as I had often wondered why BR 4-ton containers had metric particulars for weight and size, long before this became the norm.

I suppose what I'm really trying to ascertain is what the set might have looked like going from London to Dover. It sounds like it might have been two 4's and two 5's together and then just split at Dover to go on the Ferry, rather than a short working? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 29/03/2019 at 06:14, Hilux5972 said:

Would be interesting to see Tornado out with a 2nd tender. Especially when she I running at 90 regularly. 

I don't think were going to see Tornado with either a second tender or running at 90mph anytime soon.

The memories of 4464 in 2013 are probably only going to be challenged by 18.201 for a good few years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Came across this very modelable five car set , I'm pretty confident all the boxes can be done using Hornby and CRail Freightliner containers . With the Railtec "Freightliner Limited" set to reletter the two redstripe boxes. However look closely and there's a sheeted maroon load hiding behind the bush. 

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/invader1009/46229423971/in/[email protected]/

Are there open containers availible in 4mm ?

 

 

  • Like 4
  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The only open containers I know of in OO were the old Triang/Hornby ones. I have actually used a couple of these and the old Triang/Hornby Freightliner 20' container boxes to supplement the Bachmann offerings. The Triang/Hornby ones are not too bad if you 'hide' them in the middles of (i.e. between) the excellent Bachmann containers on the wagons.

Edited by SRman
  • Like 1
  • Agree 1
  • Informative/Useful 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Folks,

 

Does anyone happen to know what colour the Mk1 suburban brake coaches were painted ?

 

The reason I ask is that the only pictures I can find are black and white and I can't tell with any reliability if the coaches are unlined maroon, Rail Blue or Rail Grey. I have a Bachmann Mk1 suburban brake purchased for this very purpose, it even carries a number of one of the coaches put to that very use, although I don't know whether I should repaint it or not.

 

I have already built a Freightliner caboose and would like a coach for the variation.

 

DSCF0644.JPG.a076de5bdb091acb1356764c820883c8.JPG

 

DSCF0645.JPG.594469b94647044760c4c7284d96d90f.JPG

 

Gibbo.

  • Like 7
  • Craftsmanship/clever 11

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think they were just  normal maroon,  I've bought a Bachmann one to run with mine.

I take it the were just air piped and had portable gas heating equipment in the brake

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, russ p said:

I think they were just  normal maroon,  I've bought a Bachmann one to run with mine.

I take it the were just air piped and had portable gas heating equipment in the brake

On conversion they retained their existing livery, mostly maroon but the three southern region coaches were presumably green. Later many were repainted rail grey.

  • Informative/Useful 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, markw said:

On conversion they retained their existing livery, mostly maroon but the three southern region coaches were presumably green. Later many were repainted rail grey.

Hi Mark

 

Do you have a date for when the Freightliner brake coaches started to be painted Rail Grey, also do you have any colour photographs ?

 

Gibbo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Really, j didn't think they lasted that long 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Gibbo675 said:

Hi Mark

 

Do you have a date for when the Freightliner brake coaches started to be painted Rail Grey, also do you have any colour photographs ?

 

Gibbo.

No I don't have a date, I would guess any repainted when in freightliner use would be grey, so it would depend on when the particular coach was due a repaint.

Yes I have found a few colour photos online.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, markw said:

No I don't have a date, I would guess any repainted when in freightliner use would be grey, so it would depend on when the particular coach was due a repaint.

Yes I have found a few colour photos online.

Hi Mark,

 

Would you be willing to provide links to the photographs that you have found ?

 

Gibbo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Weren't the BSs essentially condemned vehicles just used as a short fix until an agreement was made for guards to ride in the back cab?

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, Gibbo675 said:

Hi Folks,

 

Does anyone happen to know what colour the Mk1 suburban brake coaches were painted ?

 

The reason I ask is that the only pictures I can find are black and white and I can't tell with any reliability if the coaches are unlined maroon, Rail Blue or Rail Grey. I have a Bachmann Mk1 suburban brake purchased for this very purpose, it even carries a number of one of the coaches put to that very use, although I don't know whether I should repaint it or not.

 

I have already built a Freightliner caboose and would like a coach for the variation.

 

https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/uploads/monthly_2019_08/DSCF0644.JPG.a076de5bdb091acb1356764c820883c8.JPG

 

https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/uploads/monthly_2019_08/DSCF0645.JPG.594469b94647044760c4c7284d96d90f.JPG

 

Gibbo.

The caboose looks excellent,  is it scratchbuild?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, 37114 said:

The caboose looks excellent,  is it scratchbuild?

Hi Rob,

 

The caboose is indeed a scratch build, it is detailed on page two of the link below this post. Should anyone wish I can supply the drawing I used to build it.

The modified Triang FGA / FFA wagons that it is mounted upon are on page eight.

 

Gibbo.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.