rapidotrains Posted August 7, 2014 Author Share Posted August 7, 2014 IN the 1st picture it looks like it tilts very well, On the Hornby apt-p it didn't seem to tilt very much with its cam arrangement but when watching the apt round trip to Glasgow video the tilt on the real apt-p was very noticeable, On the Hornby apt the cam is smaller at the cab end on the underside of the coach but bigger on the other bits. So my question is will the tilt be more noticeable on the apt-e model than that of the Hornby apt-p? I don't own a Hornby APT-P I'm afraid so I can't really compare. The degree of tilt depends on the sharpness of your curves. If you are running on a #2 radius (which is the absolute minimum this train can handle, in a pinch, and is only recommended in an emergency), then the tilt is pretty substantial. If you've got exhibition-layout curves you will see the tilt but it won't be an "all of the crockery is now on the floor" kind of tilt. We are going to make a CNC sample of the tilting mechanism and test it before we cut the moulds. If I feel that the tilt isn't visible enough on a wide exhibition-layout radius (such as 36") then I will increase the tilt. That means if you are running on a #2 radius the tilt will be so intense that the crockery will miss the floor entirely and fly out the opposite window onto the adjacent track. Regards from Dongguan, Jason P.S. I just finished an evening of KTV (Karaoke Television) with my chums from one of our factories. There is nothing quite like one Canadian man, six Chinese men, and one Chinese woman between the ages of 30 and 55 all singing "I Gotta Feeling" by the Black Eyed Peas at the top of our lungs...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 There is nothing quite like one Canadian man, six Chinese men, and one Chinese woman between the ages of 30 and 55 all singing "I Gotta Feeling" by the Black Eyed Peas at the top of our lungs...... Mazel tov! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dagworth Posted August 7, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 7, 2014 I don't own a Hornby APT-P I'm afraid so I can't really compare. The degree of tilt depends on the sharpness of your curves. If you are running on a #2 radius (which is the absolute minimum this train can handle, in a pinch, and is only recommended in an emergency), then the tilt is pretty substantial. If you've got exhibition-layout curves you will see the tilt but it won't be an "all of the crockery is now on the floor" kind of tilt. This is a Hornby APT-P standing on a 5'6" radius curve. You can see that even at this radius the tilt is quite pronounced. Andi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 P.S. I just finished an evening of KTV (Karaoke Television) with my chums from one of our factories. There is nothing quite like one Canadian man, six Chinese men, and one Chinese woman between the ages of 30 and 55 all singing "I Gotta Feeling" by the Black Eyed Peas at the top of our lungs...... Boy I'm glad I missed that.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 Jason's been in Canada long enough that he'll take as praise "Not bad" and as an accolade "Not bad at all". You can even say "pas mal" ("not bad") but make sure you do not say "pas terrible" (lit: "not terrible" but actually means "REALLY REALLY HORRIBLE"). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 I must have missed the link to this thread somehow, so I've just read right through it.... The visible panel line in front of the cab is where the fibreglass nose bolts on, behind that the skin is steel, or maybe aluuminium, it's not something I ever took note of. The SA bogies that we used on E-Train's first run weren't really 'modfied' into the E1Ts, some components of the SA bogies were re-used, but the outer main frames and the centre bolster was totally new. On POP-Train we ran some heavily modified SA bogies as well as the originals but the difference wasn't visible from the outside. But POP-Train also ran with E1 bogies, but with no traction supply of course, E1Ts and in later form with the BT11 and BT12 P-Train bogies. The one constant in its original open form was the centre bogie, which was always an SA, in fact the same one that now supports the south end of TC1. If anyone suceeds in modelling my hair as it was then I'll be VERY surprised, for a start it'd be difficult getting the model of me through the door...... As for blinking lights, very few of the ones on the instrumention panel did actually blink, they were usually either on and green or indicating a fault and red. A few were orange, mostly on the big 12" UV recorders down near the floor, but I know Jason is wedded to having them blinking, see the vid at the NRM and there's very few people who'll worry one way or the other. After all it'll be the very first model of any train that comes with instrumenation anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 Looking at the thumbnails again it looks SO dam real I think I should be getting my oil sampling gear out to take some samples! That's an astonsihing job Jason and Bill, well done indeed. As for the tilt angle, you're never going to please all of the people, just go with what works. And don't worry about the coffee cups falling onto the floor if it tilts too much, just go FASTER! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
aptp Posted August 14, 2014 Share Posted August 14, 2014 Hi See attached still from BTF E for Experimental of them lifting the nose into place Rob www.APT-P.com Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapidotrains Posted August 14, 2014 Author Share Posted August 14, 2014 Hi See attached still from BTF E for Experimental of them lifting the nose into place Rob www.APT-P.com Hi Rob, What a coincidence! I was just watching this movie today with the engineers at the factory. And we all chuckled at this scene, especially as you can hear the guys grunting while they lift the nose. Gotta love the lab jackets! -Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Vistisen Posted August 14, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 14, 2014 I don't own a Hornby APT-P I'm afraid so I can't really compare. The degree of tilt depends on the sharpness of your curves. If you are running on a #2 radius (which is the absolute minimum this train can handle, in a pinch, and is only recommended in an emergency), then the tilt is pretty substantial. If you've got exhibition-layout curves you will see the tilt but it won't be an "all of the crockery is now on the floor" kind of tilt. We are going to make a CNC sample of the tilting mechanism and test it before we cut the moulds. If I feel that the tilt isn't visible enough on a wide exhibition-layout radius (such as 36") then I will increase the tilt. That means if you are running on a #2 radius the tilt will be so intense that the crockery will miss the floor entirely and fly out the opposite window onto the adjacent track. Regards from Dongguan, Jason P.S. I just finished an evening of KTV (Karaoke Television) with my chums from one of our factories. There is nothing quite like one Canadian man, six Chinese men, and one Chinese woman between the ages of 30 and 55 all singing "I Gotta Feeling" by the Black Eyed Peas at the top of our lungs...... Just wondering ( you're gonna hate this)!) not knowing anything about how the tilt is going to be created, could there be some form of changing the degree of tilt ( different size cams? or screw adjusting on the endpoint where they 'push against' the bogies to create a tilt?). I'm thinking that it would be nice for those who have to use 2nd radius curves to have a realistic tilt, without it being invisible for those who have a 10' radius. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 Hi Rob, What a coincidence! I was just watching this movie today with the engineers at the factory. And we all chuckled at this scene, especially as you can hear the guys grunting while they lift the nose. Gotta love the lab jackets! -Jason Lab coats, not jackets.... They were de riguer in those days, but mine never lasted longer than a couple of days as it was ALWAYS drenched in hydraulic oil in very short order. Manually lifting the nose cone was the only way the nose can can be installed or removed as it has no lifting points moulded into it, not one of the Plastics Development Unit's better ideas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapidotrains Posted August 18, 2014 Author Share Posted August 18, 2014 Greetings from the MLW factory in China, where the OO gauge APT-E is being designed. We had a sample set made by CNC to test the tilt and the close coupling system. Result: Tilt looks awesome. Close-coupling system an Epic Fail. We are now redesigning the close-coupling system so that it will actually work. Without this CNC sample, this would have been a very costly exercise after the moulds had already been cut. We should have the redesign finished in the next few days and a new CNC sample next week. We plan to start cutting the moulds at the end of this month. One of our engineers is furiously designing rivets, all XXX thousand of them. We've decided to try for a prototypical 3/8" diameter, but I suspect the mould shop will bump that up to 7/16" or 1/2". In 4mm scale, any of those will look fine, as long as we're consistent... where the real one was! There are several rivet sizes on this thing! I blame Kit. Enjoy the pictures! Regards from China, Jason（火车先生） （你可以说中文吗？ 或者你用Google？） By the way, in the second photo the train is going straight from the curve into a #4 crossover. Amazing it stayed on the rails! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
modelpara Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Looking good so far! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Tilt looks awesome. Are we allowed to know how it works yet? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf27 Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Wow! You've made more progress in 6 weeks than I made in 16 years! This is going to be the most awesomest model ever! Cheers Shane Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapidotrains Posted August 18, 2014 Author Share Posted August 18, 2014 Regards from China, Jason（火车先生） （你可以说中文吗？ 或者你用Google？） Can anyone read the Chinese characters in the above bits? It shows up fine in preview and in the quote section while writing the post but shows up as a bunch of question marks when I view it in the thread. This also happened when I tried to use the letter pi. What am I doing wrong? Thanks, Jason (Note to self: never fall into a deep sleep in the afternoon in China. It throws your entire rhythm off. Right now - past midnight - I'm less of a Ringo Starr recording the unmatched beats of "Revolution" and more of a Pete Best throwing his drums out of the window after a night of heavy drinking.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dagworth Posted August 18, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 18, 2014 Greetings from the MLW factory in China, where the OO gauge APT-E is being designed. We had a sample set made by CNC to test the tilt and the close coupling system. Result: Tilt looks awesome. Close-coupling system an Epic Fail. We are now redesigning the close-coupling system so that it will actually work. Without this CNC sample, this would have been a very costly exercise after the moulds had already been cut. We should have the redesign finished in the next few days and a new CNC sample next week. We plan to start cutting the moulds at the end of this month. One of our engineers is furiously designing rivets, all XXX thousand of them. We've decided to try for a prototypical 3/8" diameter, but I suspect the mould shop will bump that up to 7/16" or 1/2". In 4mm scale, any of those will look fine, as long as we're consistent... where the real one was! There are several rivet sizes on this thing! I blame Kit. Enjoy the pictures! Regards from China, Jason（火车先生） （你可以说中文吗？ 或者你用Google？） Can anyone read the Chinese characters in the above bits? It shows up fine in preview and in the quote section while writing the post but shows up as a bunch of question marks when I view it in the thread. This also happened when I tried to use the letter pi. What am I doing wrong? Thanks, Jason (Note to self: never fall into a deep sleep in the afternoon in China. It throws your entire rhythm off. Right now - past midnight - I'm less of a Ringo Starr recording the unmatched beats of "Revolution" and more of a Pete Best throwing his drums out of the window after a night of heavy drinking Hello Mr Train I only see the Chinese characters if I try to quote your post, otherwise it's question marks all the way And yes, I used google... Andi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted August 19, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 19, 2014 Greetings from the MLW factory in China, where the OO gauge APT-E is being designed. . I didn't know that Montreal Locomotive Works had outsourced to China cheers, Mick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapidotrains Posted August 19, 2014 Author Share Posted August 19, 2014 Jason, can you elaborate on the failed coupling system? What exactly failed and how? The pins holding the joint module area to the main body aren't long enough. Also the centring design is not working properly, so the cars want to go in all directions. Our chief engineer, Miles O'Brien Lee, has a solution to the centring design. He's redesigning the whole area and we should have a new CNC sample to test next week. As I will be back in Canada by then, he's going to take pictures and videos for me to view. If everything works as planned, he'll send the sample to Rapido's galactic headquarters where Dan will dissect it and tell us all the things we need to change to get it to work even better. Dan is good at doing that. Amazingly good, actually. Because the Warley deadline is fast approaching, we will start cutting the steel for the upper body shells and the windows within a couple of weeks, even if the coupling system hasn't been solved yet. -Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob F Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 I am in a quandary now. I agree the CADs look to have captured the prototype very well and for me APT-E was an iconic train of my young childhood, a glimpse of what the future would look like. Now, I am not one of the people on here who think the recent price increases across the board from most manufacturers are bearable and that we necessarily have to take everything the companies say at face value, they are after all commercial concerns. But even I thought that the price of the Rapido APT-E was very reasonable for what we are likely to get. Therefore you would think that an iconic prototype made to a high standard at a reasonable price would have me reaching for my credit card, and to be fair, that is what I thought as well. BUT, I can't seem to get over the fact that the model will look completely ridiculous going round the curves on my layout. The overhang of the nose, both in the cads and of the test sample in the photographs above just stretches credibility too far. This is nobody's fault, it is an accurate depiction of how the prototype would have looked like if it ever had to negotiate curves of that radius, which in the real world it never did. I may yet waver, but at the moment the CADs and photos have taken a lot of the gloss off this product for me, for a completely unexpected reason. I could buy one to put in a display case but I like to play with my trains. As I said, a quandary. ROB Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf27 Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 It's a valid point about the overhang, it may cause issues for those who have platforms on curves, but I guess a fair few will buy one 'because'. Unfortunately there cannot be any compromise with the model without destroying the character. Cheers Shane Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
modelpara Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 It's a valid point about the overhang, it may cause issues for those who have platforms on curves, but I guess a fair few will buy one 'because'. Unfortunately there cannot be any compromise with the model without destroying the character. Cheers Shane Its part of the reason I have designed an avoiding line through the station into my layout to allow for the substantial overhang Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
durham light infantry Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Our chief engineer, Miles O'Brien Lee -Jason It will be the EPS conduits. Its always the EPS conduits, or the Plasma relays... Mike P.S. Would 200 litres of Warp Plasma help? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf27 Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Don't forget the warp coil injectors. Cheers Shane Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
aptp Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Didn't E-Train have a plasma torch?? or am I getting mixed up with another RTC project? Rob www.APT-P.com Didn't E-Train have a plasma torch?? or am I getting mixed up with another RTC project? Rob www.APT-P.com Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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