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Peco 75 with SMP


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Good afternoon all.

Well, here I am in my attic, baseboard finished, apart from a few coach bolts to be tightened, sweating away in some 30 degrees. Should help weight loss, and I could do with losing some. Well, lots. 

Track plan at the ready, Xuron in hand, lots of Peco 75 points and SMP track all now ready to to laid.

I've seen that others have trodden this path, but notice that there's a difference in height between the two viz.  The rail height is the same, 1.91mm, so that's not a problem, but the height of the Peco track from bottom of sleeper to is about 4.5mm and of SMP about 3.55mm giving a whopping 0.95 difference. These dimensions vary with how heavy-handed I was with the vernier.

I'd thought about shimming the SMP on its approach to the Peco point (using card) but thought that this might cause an unsightly ramp at each point. An alternative would be to shim the whole lengths of SMP, but that seems a fag, a tiresome thing to have to do.

How did others who used these two tracks overcome this difference? 

Any answers to this conundrum welcome(and, yes, I have thought of building my own C & L points, but I'd like to complete the layout...)

Cliff

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Firmly glue down 1/8" cork as a trackbed. Using an electric sander, sand the cork down where the Peco points will lie until the Peco and SMP railheads are about in line. Fishplate using Peco rail joiners and glue track down with favourite glue.

Excellent advice and I wish I had thought of that last year when I actually built a part of a layout. (Careful, don't faint......)

Don't suppose there is a thinner cork to accommodate the point timbers area, to save the sanding? (I'm just a lazy so* you see).

P

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I used the same combination on an earlier layout without any adjustments and it worked fine. I used PECO rail joiners and glued the track down, on dense foam from Exactoscale, with PVA.

 

steve

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Thanks for your replies.

I wonder if the dense foam made up for the difference, Steve1? Certainly the fishplates held the rails at the same height because the rails themselves are of equal depth.

Coachmann, your idea, looks interesting if a little time consuming but I may try it, but, first, I think I'll try philsandy's idea. Thanks again,

Cliff

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I'm sure this combination has been used by many people but just wondered how the two match in appearance. Sleeper spacing probably doesn't matter as turnouts are generally closer spaced than plain track - but how about the rail and chairs, isn't SMP bullhead?

 

My experience with trying to match different rail heights with a ramp (Bachmann Snap-Fit and Micro-Engineering on slightly too thin cork) was that the longer wheel-based RTR locos uncoupled (Bachmann knuckle type).

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Would it not be easier to lay the Peco points on 2mm thick cork and the SMP track on 3mm?

Simply lay the points on the 2mm cork sheet, draw round the outline and cut out the shape with scissors.

That would be neat although I wasn't aware one could buy 2mm and 3,mm thick cork. I've only heard of 1/16" and 1/8" cork in model railway circles.

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I wonder if the dense foam made up for the difference, Steve1?

 

Not having anything to which it can be compared, I don't really know. All I do know is that I never had any problems with the combination on the layout. It was a small, intensively operated, exhibition layout, so had to stand up to being moved about, used and stored.

 

steve

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That would be neat although I wasn't aware one could buy 2mm and 3,mm thick cork. I've only heard of 1/16" and 1/8" cork in model railway circles. Yes, its a bit of an SI-free area, Coachmann, but I did notice some 2mm when I was browsing yesterday, I need to go back and look. On one site (it may have been Antics) they had 2.5mm which they equated to 3mm...

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I bought a roll from my local model shop, it was was supposed to be 3mm. but when I measured it was actually 2mm. but I can't remember the product name.

So I'm not sure wether anyone sells 2mm that actually is 2mm, surely someone must.

 

1/8" is near enough 3mm, but 1/16" is approx.only 1.5mm.

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I was browsing around B&Q on my own yesterday so I could hang around the tool section as long as I liked(!), and was looking at electric planers. The cheapest are not expensive and would probably be better than a sander for reducing the depth of cork a little between formers. Anyone any experience of these?

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Unballasted, unpainted, lat alone weathered, against a black & white background (dense rubber foam used as underlay and kitchen towels used to form what would become a ballast shoulder (if it was ever finished) and undergoing initial wiring testing.  Rail height 'matching' carried out mainly with solder and squeezing tight of rail joiners but track is still semi floating at this stage in construction.

 

post-6859-0-65966400-1407406141_thumb.jpg

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...Any answers to this conundrum welcome(and, yes, I have thought of building my own C & L points, but I'd like to complete the layout)...

Right with you there! No layout = trains cannot run, symptoms of withdrawal include terrible D.T's. (Denied Trains.)

 

I went the extra piece of card under all the SMP plain track route when trialling the Peco 75/SMP combination, but will quite definitely give thought to any 1mm difference in cork sheet thickness possibility in future. I'll put in a plug here for tidying up the timbering around the tie bar, eliminating the over centre spring contraption and cutting off the tiebar ends with the upstands too, all easy wins in the 'better appearance' stakes.

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So far I've found the following on the web: 

1. C & L: 1/16" and 3mm (I'm not making that up) 

2. Tracklay: Don't say (I've asked yet to hear back)

3. Cork24: 1.8/3/4/6/mm (all sheets)

4.Charles Cantrill: 1/16 /1/8 /3/16" (I've asked if these are equivalent to metric, yet to hear back)

5. Javis: 1/32 / 1/16/ 1/8" (I've asked if these are equivalent to metric, yet to hear back)

6. Quality Cork Supplies (ad in RM): 1/16 / 1/8 / 3/16"

7. Marcway: 1/32 / 1/16 / 1/8" for which they give metric equivalents as: 0.8/1.5/3/4.5

8. Cheltenham Model Centre: 1/32/1/16/1/8/3/16"

9. Gaugemaster: 1/16/1/8"

 By-and-large, these people quote in terms of Imperial, but I wonder if, in fact, they're made in nominal metric units. For something like this it doesn't matter until you encounter the height differences. A personal wish is that they'd drop the Imperial units.

Hattons and others also sell, the above is only representative. Cork24 is closest to 2mm. 

In the meantime I measured what I've got which, from memory, I bought at a model shop in the county. Strips are 605 x 94 x 2.35 (nominal 2.5?) and sheet 3.1 (clearly 1/8" nom) That difference is just about correct to make up the height difference.

I should've measured before I put the question to you good folk and apologise for not having done so and thank you for your help.

Cliff

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Received a reply from Tracklay, No. 2 above:

 

"the OO underlay is 1.5mm thick (1/16th of an inch).

This and more info can be found on the "What is it?" link on the horizontal menu bar"
 
The info is on their website, I missed it.
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I use Tracklay with a mixture of C&L track and Peco points on a base of C&L high density foam, and am pleased with the results.Construction  details can be seen here - http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/62/entry-10836-tracklaying-with-tracklay/ -which I have found gives a reliable trackbase that makes for good running.

 

A quick shot to show the meeting of the two products- I have fitted cosmetic chairs to the Peco points which transforms the overall appearance of them...

 

post-2642-0-51750500-1407545202_thumb.jpg

 

 

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