Bachmann's Latest Collectors Club Model

[Scottish-Exile]

5 hours ago, Andy Hayter said:

Still impossible to log on.  It seems the collectors club site has died.

 

You have to contact the club and they will re-register / set you up on their new website. I had to do this when I re-newed my membership last month. Logged in with no problems while still on the phone to them.

[Matabiau]

It seems that the whole Bachmann UK site has died, not just the collectors' club

[Paul.Uni]

What is this the latest club model(s)?

[brushman47544]

28 minutes ago, Paul.Uni said:

What is this the latest club model(s)?

J72 69023 Joem in NER green(?) with NER and BR late crests

[brushman47544]

On 04/02/2020 at 16:21, Matabiau said:

It seems that the whole Bachmann UK site has died, not just the collectors' club

It works for me now. Much improved on the temporary site, the individual product information is expanded and includes availability, although only in stock or out of stock as far as I can see no months anymore. Out of stock for everything not in stock is not very helpful because you don’t know if that means been in stock and sold out or not yet available. That distinction would be useful.

 

Collectors’ Club pages also working although there is a message saying log in is currently disabled.

Edited February 9, 2020 by brushman47544

[Matabiau]

2 hours ago, brushman47544 said:

It works for me now. Much improved on the temporary site, the individual product information is expanded and includes availability, although only in stock or out of stock as far as I can see no months anymore. Out of stock for everything not in stock is not very helpful because you don’t know if that means been in stock and sold out or not yet available. That distinction would be useful.

 

Collectors’ Club pages also working although there is a message saying log in is currently disabled.

Thanks for the information. My computer must have had a cache problem. It is now working for me too.

[Tramshed]

4 hours ago, brushman47544 said:

It works for me now. Much improved on the temporary site, the individual product information is expanded and includes availability, although only in stock or out of stock as far as I can see no months anymore. Out of stock for everything not in stock is not very helpful because you don’t know if that means been in stock and sold out or not yet available. That distinction would be useful.

 

Collectors’ Club pages also working although there is a message saying log in is currently disabled.

Surely it would not be too difficult to have three categories of stock status i.e. 'Not yet in stock', 'In stock' and 'No longer in stock'

[G-BOAF]

In the thread above, and in the J72 thread, there is Mention of J72 Joem 'as preserved' as a CC model. Has this been confirmed? I can't see it on the webiste. Can anyone provide more substantive information

 

What is the process for joining and ordering. Does one join the club then order the model. Is there a discount on RRP for club members (as per Hornby club), otherwise is one expected to pay £160 (RRP plus club membership) just for one loco?

 

Why as 'preserved' models ordinarily does as exclusive club editions, thus posing additional costs on heritage era modellers (its worse for Bachmann, with WCRC pullmans, Kolhapur in LMS livery, Black Price, Caledonian Fairburn Tanks and more all done as club only models. Hornby also did the preserved H class as a club only model)??? Its somewhat discriminating.

Joem would clearly have sold in the bucket load as a main range model of a popular locomotive.

[Steamport Southport]

Just now, G-BOAF said:

In the thread above, and in the J72 thread, there is Mention of J72 Joem 'as preserved' as a CC model. Has this been confirmed? I can't see it on the webiste. Can anyone provide more substantive information

 

What is the process for joining and ordering. Does one join the club then order the model. Is there a discount on RRP for club members (as per Hornby club), otherwise is one expected to pay £160 (RRP plus club membership) just for one loco?

 

Why as 'preserved' models ordinarily does as exclusive club editions, thus posing additional costs on heritage era modellers (its worse for Bachmann, with WCRC pullmans, Kolhapur in LMS livery, Black Price, Caledonian Fairburn Tanks and more all done as club only models. Hornby also did the preserved H class as a club only model)??? Its somewhat discriminating.

Joem would clearly have sold in the bucket load as a main range model of a popular locomotive.

 

Yes. Confirmed on the front cover of the magazine. Price £129.95.

 

You join the club and then purchase the items. There is no discount for main range models. You would only get a small percentage off the RRP and retailers give better than that anyway.

 

You also get 4 issues of the rather good magazine, a catalogue, calendar and a wagon.

 

Preserved locomotives don't sell particularly well and never have done. They are the ones that always end up in the bargain bins (apart from Flying Scotsman that is).

 

 

Jason

[John M Upton]

Anything for N gauge?  Stupid question I know....

[adb968008]

3 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Preserved locomotives don't sell particularly well and never have done.

Not the ones I seem to buy... try finding cheap versions of 34053, 34092.. 

35028 and 70013 must be so bad Hornby's repeated them several times.

 

69023 first time sold bucket loads..indeed Bachmann even did 68680 and 68723, so it cant have been that bad.

 

Then of course theres 70000,71000, 73050, 76079, 80002,80079, 80097,80135,80140,92203, 92220... theres definitely something likes about BR stds...

 

Then theres P’s at Bluebell, all those Terriers, 30064,30583,30585,30587,30120 (and 120)

lets not forget NRMs collection, which I think only 1000 stuck around.... Stirling single being feted as one of the best models out there.

 

Now lets not forget GWR.. 4003,7029,5080,5029,4079,4073,7802,7812,7819:7820,7822,7827,7829,4930,4953,4965

 

The LMS has seen 6201 several times, 46229 is a hard to find model, 46235 isnt easy, 46203 a few times, 48151,48773,46521,41313,41241..

i could just keep going...

 

but preserved locos dont sell, why do they make so many ?

 

oh and that Holy grail SECR 592.. one of the hardest to find and  most expensive rtr model for several years.

 

but preserved doesnt sell ?

[Butler Henderson]

592 was not expensive when it was readily available. Bachmann got the pricing on that model way wrong and IIRC admitted to making a loss on it. Many collectors club models get ebayed by purchasers -usually far too much is asked for them but eventually the market dries up and sellers suddenly find then difficult to sell. In the case of a red Ivatt 2-6-0 the seller probably quite reluctantly accepted my offer of a price equivalent to the Bachmann Club Price plus the ebay fees

Edited February 9, 2020 by Butler Henderson

[caradoc]

34 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

but preserved locos dont sell, why do they make so many ?

 

 

Perhaps because many, if not most, of those locos are equally valid for use in the pre-nationalistion or BR eras, whereas Joem only appeared in the green livery after preservation ?

 

[MRDBLUE17]

I joined the Bachmann club just for the WCRC Pullmans and 37706. Couldn’t believe it when they announced them and saw them at DEMU showcase. Dennis personally made sure that my completed form was with them Monday morning and that I was able to order as they went pretty quick. Really can’t fault that for excellent service. 
 

Mark

[adb968008]

4 hours ago, caradoc said:

 

Perhaps because many, if not most, of those locos are equally valid for use in the pre-nationalistion or BR eras, whereas Joem only appeared in the green livery after preservation ?

 

wouldnt that increase demand, not reduce it, as implied earlier ?

 

it would suit both modern and pre1968 era... so why would they be bargain binned ?

 

80135, 75069 never wore green in BR days, yet have been run twice /thrice... just as a starter.

Locos like 4771 /60800/70000/70013/71000 have been done in modern guise, with modern warning flashes etc and multiple times.

of course 60163.. two different toolings and a prototype that isnt 1960’s.

 

if I take a look online, theres plenty of little black freight locos at discount rates.. not preserved.

Edited February 9, 2020 by adb968008

[Steamport Southport]

19 hours ago, adb968008 said:

Not the ones I seem to buy... try finding cheap versions of 34053, 34092.. 

35028 and 70013 must be so bad Hornby's repeated them several times.

 

69023 first time sold bucket loads..indeed Bachmann even did 68680 and 68723, so it cant have been that bad.

 

Then of course theres 70000,71000, 73050, 76079, 80002,80079, 80097,80135,80140,92203, 92220... theres definitely something likes about BR stds...

 

Then theres P’s at Bluebell, all those Terriers, 30064,30583,30585,30587,30120 (and 120)

lets not forget NRMs collection, which I think only 1000 stuck around.... Stirling single being feted as one of the best models out there.

 

Now lets not forget GWR.. 4003,7029,5080,5029,4079,4073,7802,7812,7819:7820,7822,7827,7829,4930,4953,4965

 

The LMS has seen 6201 several times, 46229 is a hard to find model, 46235 isnt easy, 46203 a few times, 48151,48773,46521,41313,41241..

i could just keep going...

 

but preserved locos dont sell, why do they make so many ?

 

oh and that Holy grail SECR 592.. one of the hardest to find and  most expensive rtr model for several years.

 

but preserved doesnt sell ?

 

Most of them were the only liveries available at the time. If you wanted a Britannia for example it was the one in the catalogue or nothing. If you wanted a 9F it was Evening Star. Did people buy that because it was preserved or did they want a 9F?

 

How many were buying those to rename and renumber though? Back then many of us didn't bat an eyelid at painting a model. Very few collectors about and most of those were collecting the old stuff.

 

At least two of those aren't even preserved and 7827 was released in BR livery which it has never carried in preservation.

 

Worth considering you couldn't even buy Flying Scotsman in preserved condition for decades. The model was an A1. The Hornby A4 was Seagull, rather than Mallard, Mallard was only available in BR green. If you wanted a WC/BB it was Spitfire.

 

 

Did people buy 592 because they wanted a pretty livery? ISTR that the GCR lined black J11 is like hens teeth and they all ended up as razor blades.

 

 

But my main point, which people are seeming to have missed, was preserved locomotives are perfect for the Collectors Club as they are made in small batches.

 

The same as the Hornby H Class 263. Still available and is a limited edition of 1500. I thought all those collectors of preserved and pre-grouping would have snapped them up by now. Or is that market much smaller than some would have you believe?

 

 

Jason

[adb968008]

1 hour ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Most of them were the only liveries available at the time. If you wanted a Britannia for example it was the one in the catalogue or nothing. If you wanted a 9F it was Evening Star. Did people buy that because it was preserved or did they want a 9F?

 

How many were buying those to rename and renumber though? Back then many of us didn't bat an eyelid at painting a model. Very few collectors about and most of those were collecting the old stuff.

 

At least two of those aren't even preserved and 7827 was released in BR livery which it has never carried in preservation.

 

Worth considering you couldn't even buy Flying Scotsman in preserved condition for decades. The model was an A1. The Hornby A4 was Seagull, rather than Mallard, Mallard was only available in BR green. If you wanted a WC/BB it was Spitfire.

 

 

Did people buy 592 because they wanted a pretty livery? ISTR that the GCR lined black J11 is like hens teeth and they all ended up as razor blades.

 

 

But my main point, which people are seeming to have missed, was preserved locomotives are perfect for the Collectors Club as they are made in small batches.

 

The same as the Hornby H Class 263. Still available and is a limited edition of 1500. I thought all those collectors of preserved and pre-grouping would have snapped them up by now. Or is that market much smaller than some would have you believe?

 

 

Jason

Black 9f’s have been part of Hornby range since 1973 (92166), and again in 1980 (92200)... in those days entrants came and left the range as they do now. 92220 was part of the range in 1971.

Sticking with 9f’s, out of the 250 class members Hornby produced 12 numbers... including 92134,92207,92212 and 92220... thats 33% preserved.., representing just 1.5% of the class.

 

as for 263 by Hornby.. maybe 1500 is too many, afterall 318 was made before hand and most limited editions these days are 500... plus the only way to get it is a premium payment to join a club.

 

I dont think its just demand for preserved locos thats too big, but the overall hobby... I will give one example.. 42968 and 42969... both are discounted heavily, one is preserved the other isnt. Crucially for 42968 though.. its not working, which in my experience as a retailer many years ago, made a huge difference in sales... out of sight is often out of mind for modellers... when 7822 was first returned to steam I couldn't sell enough of them, same too for 42765.. cant say the same about 42789 though.. and 76079... against 76020, both 42765 and 76079 saw Bachmann do repeat runs of the same number.

... But I do believe had Bachmann done 1054 in LNWR lined black it would have been much more popular than plain black, even though the real thing is in that colour.. its not just colour but memories... 1054 at Rainhill in 1980 would mean more to many modellers than 848 in the same colour in 1897.

 

I guess we have to differ

Edited February 10, 2020 by adb968008

[G-BOAF]

I guess I don't mind preserved locos being done as limited editions, I just object to joining a club (be it Hornby or Bachmann) just for the privillage of buying one. At least with Hornby loco with club discount plus club membership approximately equalled RRP of loco.

With Bachmann it will be £130 for loco plus £30(?) for club membership....

[OOgaugeJaf]

4 hours ago, G-BOAF said:

I guess I don't mind preserved locos being done as limited editions, I just object to joining a club (be it Hornby or Bachmann) just for the privillage of buying one. At least with Hornby loco with club discount plus club membership approximately equalled RRP of loco.

With Bachmann it will be £130 for loco plus £30(?) for club membership....

I had not renewed my membership as they have not produced anything of interest to me for years then along cane the J72. I have renewed but will let it lapse until the next time. Yes it will be a premium but it will still be cheaper than fleebay in a few months time

[brushman47544]

The Club J72 at £129.95 is actually cheaper than the standard release in NER lined green. The Club wagon plus the quarterly magazine are pretty good value and you can always sell the wagon if you don’t want it. If Clubs are not your thing then fair enough but I do think you get value for money from the cost of membership.

Edited February 12, 2020 by brushman47544

[Butler Henderson]

20 hours ago, brushman47544 said:

The Club J72 at £129.95 is actually cheaper than the standard release in NER lined green.

Good spot - you would expect a limited edition model to be dearer not £5 cheaper than an equivalent standard release, so on that basis around £150 could easily have been sought by Bachmann for it.

[Torn-on-the-platform]

On 09/02/2020 at 19:30, caradoc said:

 

Perhaps because many, if not most, of those locos are equally valid for use in the pre-nationalistion or BR eras, whereas Joem only appeared in the green livery after preservation ?

 

 

The images in my first link below are not captioned but appear to show Joem in BR service, in the BR/NER lined green livery. I have another Bachmann model in the same colour scheme, I believe it to be 68723. The real one can be seen in a photo down the page on my second link:

 

https://www.lner.info/locos/J/j72.php

https://preservedbritishsteamlocomotives.com/j72-68670-68754-69001-69028-58-59-0-6-0t-ner-br-worsdell/

 

I appreciate it was a niche livery, but still technically one worn pre-preservation.

 

Performance of my old Bachmann J72s has been terrible - both requiring new motors at some point with these subsequently failing. The second was actually bought as a donor for Joem, bought after the death of my Grandmother as my 'inheritance', so always special to me. I have always thought that the body shell was quite good for its time though. I have previously joined the collector's club in order to get hold of certain limited editions, but I don't think I will go so far this time.

 

Bachmann are usually quite good for producing preserved examples, particularly when they release a new class. Hornby have frequently omitted them over the years - Q1 (except recent limited editions), S15, K1, J15 to name a few off the top of my head. None of the terriers released so far have been close to representative of preserved condition either. I don't think the planned release of the 2MT includes a preserved example? Always baffled me - expands the market for a loco. I'm not a model railway business expert though...

[Stueyboy43]

17 minutes ago, Torn-on-the-platform said:

 

The images in my first link below are not captioned but appear to show Joem in BR service, in the BR/NER lined green livery. I have another Bachmann model in the same colour scheme, I believe it to be 68723. The real one can be seen in a photo down the page on my second link:

 

https://www.lner.info/locos/J/j72.php

https://preservedbritishsteamlocomotives.com/j72-68670-68754-69001-69028-58-59-0-6-0t-ner-br-worsdell/

 

I appreciate it was a niche livery, but still technically one worn pre-preservation.

 

Performance of my old Bachmann J72s has been terrible - both requiring new motors at some point with these subsequently failing. The second was actually bought as a donor for Joem, bought after the death of my Grandmother as my 'inheritance', so always special to me. I have always thought that the body shell was quite good for its time though. I have previously joined the collector's club in order to get hold of certain limited editions, but I don't think I will go so far this time.

 

Bachmann are usually quite good for producing preserved examples, particularly when they release a new class. Hornby have frequently omitted them over the years - Q1 (except recent limited editions), S15, K1, J15 to name a few off the top of my head. None of the terriers released so far have been close to representative of preserved condition either. I don't think the planned release of the 2MT includes a preserved example? Always baffled me - expands the market for a loco. I'm not a model railway business expert though...

 

I am planning a layout based on preservation so will always be interested in loco types if preserved examples are produced, but otherwise these classes of locos are of no importance to me. I think Hornby are missing out on sales if they ignore preserved locks!

[caradoc]

14 hours ago, Torn-on-the-platform said:

 

The images in my first link below are not captioned but appear to show Joem in BR service, in the BR/NER lined green livery. I have another Bachmann model in the same colour scheme, I believe it to be 68723. The real one can be seen in a photo down the page on my second link:

 

https://www.lner.info/locos/J/j72.php

https://preservedbritishsteamlocomotives.com/j72-68670-68754-69001-69028-58-59-0-6-0t-ner-br-worsdell/

 

I appreciate it was a niche livery, but still technically one worn pre-preservation.

 

The images in both links show 68723 in green livery in BR days, not 69023. And the text in the second link states '68723 and 68736 were latterly painted in old LNER light-green livery for station pilot work at Newcastle'. So 69023 in green livery is only valid for the preservation era. 

 

 

[Porcy Mane]

1 hour ago, caradoc said:

So 69023 in green livery is only valid for the preservation era. 

 

Correct.

So I wonder, will the collectors club "Joem" come with group standard buffers & external rear sandoxes and how long it will be until either pilots, 68723 or 68736  (also had a green SV cover) make an appearance in the standard range?  Maybe not to long as the artwork for the tampos will then be on the factory shelf.