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Wagon ID help.

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Hi All,

 

I was hopping for some help identifying these wagons

 

post-23366-0-15896300-1420598957_thumb.jpg

 

Wagon closest to camera; de-bodied shock van is my best guess?

 

Second wagon; GWR origin Bolster Wagon, possibly a BR equivalent due to BR plate bogies?

 

Thanks in advance,

 

James

Edited by Down_Under

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James first wagon is a conflat

 

Jon

Judging by the locating corners, either a Conflat L, or a Conflat A that had been modifed to carry Speedfreight boxes. The other wagon looks like a Salmon on the shorter type of BR Plate bogies.

Edited by Fat Controller

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Thanks for the help everyone!

 

With hindsight, the first is obvious and I can convince myself the later is a Salmon. The noticeable thing about the later wagon to me, was a) lack of (obvious) brake gear, b) multiple strengthening sections under the body c) lack of any sides.

I confess that my knowledge is limited at the moment, so thanks once again.

 

Cheers, James

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What does the 1955 refer to? The first wagon is certainly a Speedfreight Conflat A with the type of brake rigging introduced in 1958 and the wagons didn't exist until 1959 http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/speedfreight

 

Paul

 

I think that is the date the photo was taken (Eric Tonks - Ironstone of the Midlands Part 3) at Blisworth Ironstone Quarry. Perhaps a misprint? There are pictures of the boom still there in 1966 http://thesmjr.ning.com/photo/blisworth-ironstone-shed

 

 

Thanks Paul. Your website is mighty helpful.

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I think that is the date the photo was taken (Eric Tonks - Ironstone of the Midlands Part 3) at Blisworth Ironstone Quarry. Perhaps a misprint? There are pictures of the boom still there in 1966 http://thesmjr.ning.com/photo/blisworth-ironstone-shed

 

 

Thanks Paul. Your website is mighty helpful.

Thanks for explaining the 1955. It must be a typo, possibly for 1965. The brake rigging which can be made out did not exist in 1955. I suspect that it may be 1965, these floorless Conflats may have been almost new, but the Freightliners were already cutting into the London to Manchester traffic. I don't know when Speedfreight ceased, and I do know some went north to work on bonded traffic, but it is possible this wagon was already being used as an under runner.

 

Paul

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Thanks Paul.

 

Looks like a spot of kit bashng/scratch building is in order. Regarding the brake type, presume it was a change from 4 to 8 clasp brake rigging?

 

Cheers,

 

James

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Thanks Paul.

 

Looks like a spot of kit bashng/scratch building is in order. Regarding the brake type, presume it was a change from 4 to 8 clasp brake rigging?

 

Cheers,

 

James

The Salmon is available from Cambrian:- C46

For the container flat, you'd have to cross a Parkside body with a Red Panda underframe (available from Parkside). You'd have to make your own locating pieces for the Speedfreight box.

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Thanks Paul.

 

Looks like a spot of kit bashng/scratch building is in order. Regarding the brake type, presume it was a change from 4 to 8 clasp brake rigging?

 

Cheers,

 

James

Yes but the brake rigging was a unique design, also there is no decking and there are corner fixings. Quite a significant revision of a Conflat A http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/speedfreight/e35b09958 http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/speedfreight/e32b714d0 - see the shape of the (not) V hanger.  Slaters do this brake rigging in 7mm.

 

Paul

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Are these of any use?

 

Thanks for those. They take a little bit of guesswork out of decipering photos to create the wagon framing.

 

Cheers!

 

J

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It's an interesting use of a Salmon for a traffic (non-engineers) load.   Any other examples??

 

Thanks

Bill

I have a photo of a Trestrol/Weltrol of some description being used to remove the boom of  a 5360 Shovel from a quarry c.1954/55 (Finedon on its way to Blisworth Quarry). Its not a great photo. Not sure if it was a special engineers build or a requisition from the revenue earning fleet. Its not a Salmon though....

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And another one....

 

post-23366-0-76911700-1424258106.jpg

 

Looks like a Trestrol under the boom, a couple of medium goods wagons (unsure if southern or midlands origin) and a couple of bolster wagons as runners?

 

J

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And another one....

 

attachicon.gifimage.jpg

 

Looks like a Trestrol under the boom, a couple of medium goods wagons (unsure if southern or midlands origin) and a couple of bolster wagons as runners?

 

J

The wagon carrying the boom is a 'Weltrol' or 'Flatrol' of some sort (Trestrols had an angled frame in the well to carry out-of-gauge steel plate). The flat wagon immediately in front looks as though it could be a 'Long Low', basically a long-wheelbase single plank wagon, probably ex-LMS. In front of that is what looks like a normal 'Low', then two five-plank merchandise wagons, which might be from any of the Big 4, or even ex-private owner stock.

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Please some images of a 'short' plate framed bogie fitted to DB996145 seen at Toton in 2002.  Note the top half of the axlebox appears to be marked 'GWR'.  Is the axlebox the same shape as that in the picture?

 

post-2484-0-77751500-1424259476_thumb.jpg

 

post-2484-0-20647900-1424259498.jpg

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This is the other bogie on YMA DB996145, this time a different shape to the axle box.

 

post-2484-0-79778500-1424259979_thumb.jpg

 

Just to keep you on your toes.........

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Thanks for the images and the ID of the flat runner wagons. If it helps I'd the Weltrol/flatrol with the boom load is from a 5360 r&h shovel. I am led to believe is 104ft long (I think this is the boom measurement, not the dipper. I will check in a Eric Tonk book when I get home - a couple of weeks).

 

I had throught it was a Trestrol 2/682 due to the apparent angle of the well into the bogie pivot and sloped plating in this region. But I know relatively nothing!

 

Cheers,

 

James

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The wagon carrying the boom is a 'Weltrol' or 'Flatrol' of some sort (Trestrols had an angled frame in the well to carry out-of-gauge steel plate). The flat wagon immediately in front looks as though it could be a 'Long Low', basically a long-wheelbase single plank wagon, probably ex-LMS. In front of that is what looks like a normal 'Low', then two five-plank merchandise wagons, which might be from any of the Big 4, or even ex-private owner stock.

Just to clarify - the short low wagon could be a diagram 1/402 13t bolster wagon, or a lowfit? Or were you thinking some thing a little more pre-grouping?

 

Cheers, james

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Just to clarify - the short low wagon could be a diagram 1/402 13t bolster wagon, or a lowfit? Or were you thinking some thing a little more pre-grouping?

 

Cheers, james

 

Just to clarify - the short low wagon could be a diagram 1/402 13t bolster wagon, or a lowfit? Or were you thinking some thing a little more pre-grouping?

 

Cheers, james

Lowfit, or unfitted Low, but not a bolster, as far as I can make out.

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HI,

 

Is there a way to get a larger format photo?

 

That would make it easier to identify the wagons.

 

However - the Long Low appears to have trussing and I can't find a Long Low of BR or ex LMS origins that has these.

 

Trussed underframes on 2 axle wagons were more of a GWR thing - if I remember correctly?

 

Thanks

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HI,

 

Is there a way to get a larger format photo?

 

That would make it easier to identify the wagons.

 

However - the Long Low appears to have trussing and I can't find a Long Low of BR or ex LMS origins that has these.

 

Trussed underframes on 2 axle wagons were more of a GWR thing - if I remember correctly?

 

Thanks

The image came form this site (also a interesting website, if your into industrial archelogy)

 

http://www.apack1.co.uk/page4.html

 

The image is also in Eric Tonks Ironstone of the Midlands V1, page 113, which is slightly better than the image above.

 

Thanks for all he help. Trying to get a feel for the various types of wagons used for transporting unusual loads.

 

Weltrol/Flatrol; Possibly a Ex-GWR Crocodile H, a BR Weltrol MV, diagram 2/682, or Although the bed looks a little thin to be the former.

 

Long flat wagon; Ex-LMS Long Low, Conflat D, or a Ex-LNER 12t Flat ED? The trussing (brake gear?) in my eyes looks a little asymmetrical?

 

Short Flat wagon; Ex-LMS single bolster wagon.

 

Open Goods; either Ex-PO or any of the big four/BR high sided/12/13t goods wagon.

 

Nice bit of variety, only one that could not be built from a kit or kit bashed would be the single bolster. Time to get acquiring and building.

 

James

Edited by Down_Under

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