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The London Festival of Railway Modelling 2015

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Nice layout, but why is everything so clean,even the bridge has no soot on it?.

That's because it's the GWR who probably had their "servants" washing the bridges and scrubbing the ballast :)

Funnily enough I've noticed that some secondary railways in France were still remarkably clean even when they closed. With only two or three trains a day, the weather cleaning them almost as fast as the occasional steam locos were dirtying them and a life of maybe only thirty or forty years they simply never got a chance to become mucky.

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Leicester South (GC) my favourite on the day followed closely by the layout next door which I think was called Horfield. Very good exhibition this year so big thumbs up to all concerned.

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2/ As ever Nick and several other MRC folk made numerous visits to us, to see that all was ok (railway modellers you see), but apart from the odd dash past or PA call by Sam (thank----you!) we saw or heard nowt of the Warner’s team after booking in. And as anyone in business would confirm, that’s even less of an excuse.

 

 

One difference with Ally Pally compared to Peterborough and Doncaster is that The MRC takes a much more active role both before and during the show, including looking after the layouts, demos and most society stands as well as stewarding. So whilst there were quite a few people from Warners at the show (including the MD on Saturday) they are normally doing other things, and trust us and in particular Nick to look after the layouts.

 

From an MRC perspective, I was really pleased with the show overall and on behalf of the Club thanks to everyone who exhibited and those who attended. We (and I know Warners) take note of all comments and are already thinking about ways to try to improve next years show for exhibitors and visitors alike.

 

Tom

MRC Exhibition Co-Ordinator

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Colin and I enthused so much we were allowed to handle a sample leg.

Then one chap lifted the layouts skirts and looked at its legs underneath, risky business!

 

I'd love to know if this layout has been / will be / would like to be in print?

Edited by colin penfold
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Then one chap lifted the layouts skirts and looked at its legs underneath, risky business!

 

I'd love to know if this layout has been / will be / would like to be in print?

 

Hi Colin,

 

As one of the regular operating crew, and supplier of some of the stock, for Sandford and Banwell, yours and other's comments about the layout have been great to see and have been passed onto Jeff and Pete Day the owners and builders of the layout.

 

I know that Jeff has been approached by at least one of the major magazines for an article, however it may well be that he is waiting for more detailing to be added to the layout before submitting an article.

 

The layout has steadily progressed since its debut at Uckfield in 2012 with additions prior to every show - this time it was the station masters house. However I know that there is still a lot of work to be carried out on the layout - a footbridge, platform furniture, people, point rodding and signal pulleys to name but a few - where upon it might get some more weathering. 

 

Regarding the legs - for those that don't know what is being discussed there is a picture of the legs on the Scalefour Society website - in the Scaleforum 2014 retrospective.

 

http://www.scalefour.org/scaleforum/2014/sandfordandbanwell/

 

Ally Pally was the layout's sixth appearance after Uckfield, Epsom & Ewell, Ilford & West Essex, Wigan and Scaleforum,

 

Planned future outings are: Railwells 8/9 Aug, REC Woking 12/13 Sep and East London Finescale Rainham 7/8 Nov.

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Echoing other exhibitors postings, the `Horfield` team would like to thank those people who have kindly commented here and at the venue on our efforts. We would also like to pass on our thanks to Nick Freezer and his MRC colleagues and the Warners team who made the whole event a most enjoyable weekend.

     Horfield will be in action again soon at the Wimborne Exhibition on April 18/19, Weymouth Oct 31st/Nov 1st and Warley Nov 21st/22nd.

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Regarding the legs - for those that don't know what is being discussed there is a picture of the legs on the Scalefour Society website - in the Scaleforum 2014 retrospective.

 

Adrian, thanks for posting the link. Although I didn't get to 'fondle' the legs myself (envious) I did admire them greatly from a far and on returning home from AP researched drain pipes online. Being at the point where I am building new baseboards good ideas like this are very welcome.

 

It looks to me as if the pipes are the 32mm diameter sort but it is not clear if the fixings are push fit or the solvent weld variety. I am guessing the latter.  Do you by ay chance know?

Many thanks.

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I was told they were solvent weld.

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Even if the layout doesn't appear in a magazine there would appear to be a considerable audience for an article about its legs

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Today I have been investigating drain pipes and one aspect that I discovered is that pipes advertised as say 32mm or 40mm are actually quoting the inside diameter, the outside is between 3 and 4 mm greater. (All you clever people probably knew that already - but I didn't) :-)

 

I believe that on Sandford and Banwell the pipes are push fitted into wood blocks. Common sense would suggest that the fit of the pipe in the block needs to be 'snug' else the leg will wobble. So the exact size of any pipe needs to be known before drilling the holes.

 

You need a fairly hefty bit to bore a suitable hole but this needs to be for the outer diameter. Screwfix sell an adjustable wood bit which makes holes 22-76mm in diameter. Probably has loads of other uses. No doubt other tool factors will sell similar or other suitable bits.   

 

Maybe there are other ways of achieving the same result.

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I know it's :offtopic: but I've Been following the plastic legs.

 

I'd be wary of using waste pipes for a couple of reasons. They bend and are not particularly rigid, they can in cold weather snap/shatter if dropped/struck, they are essentially just tubes for carrying waste water and have no structural integrity.

Every leg system will have its downsides but I think there are a few more with this than others.

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Are the same pipes used for the framework supporting the lighting pelmet as well? Looking at the photographs on the Scalefour site it looks as though they are the same pipes but coloured black.

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Are the same pipes used for the framework supporting the lighting pelmet as well? Looking at the photographs on the Scalefour site it looks as though they are the same pipes but coloured black.

Yes, they certainly looked the same to me at AP - although braced.

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I know it's :offtopic: but I've Been following the plastic legs.

 

I'd be wary of using waste pipes for a couple of reasons. They bend and are not particularly rigid, they can in cold weather snap/shatter if dropped/struck, they are essentially just tubes for carrying waste water and have no structural integrity.

Every leg system will have its downsides but I think there are a few more with this than others.

 

Good points Chris. I looked at the 40/43mm pipes in Wickes and at 3m long they are certainly quite 'whippy'. At shorter lengths they will be less so. Regarding cold temperatures. I doubt many layouts will be exposed to sufficient cold for this to be a problem. Most houses have these pipes outside leading to their drains, mine does, but I have never had to replace them. To be fair I haven't hit one with a hammer to see if it's brittle or not in cold weather

The worst thing seems to be discolouration due to UV light.

 

The legs on S&C appear to have been used since 2012 when the layout was first made. Whether it has been necessary to replace them since then is of course unknown.

 

It would be really interesting if adrianmc could persuade Jeff and Pete Day to document their experiences as suggested by stationcat. 

 

I think it's a method worth trialling. I shall do so and report back in due course.

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I've noticed that various people have been using plastic drainpipes and fittings for layout legs for quite a long time.

I first saw an article about it in the late 1990's or early 2000's, but I believe there have been people using, or experimenting with them way earlier than that.

 

IIRC there was even a topic about it here on RMweb, many years ago (almost certainly on the old site or one of its predecessors).

 

 

Circa 1994

 

Photo 1

 

Photo 2 Circa 2005

 

Photo 3

 

Photo 4

 

Article.

 

 

 

.

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I've noticed that various people have been using plastic drainpipes and fittings for layout legs for quite a long time.

I first saw an article about it in the late 1990's or early 2000's, but I believe there have been people using, or experimenting with them way earlier than that.

 

 

Wooden baseboard legs were outlawed on fire safety grounds by an EU directive dated 01/04/1995....

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Wooden baseboard legs were outlawed on fire safety grounds by an EU directive dated 01/04/1995....

 

Nigel Farage must be informed immediately.

Once this news gets out, his party will be riding on a wave of public outrage.

 

 

 

.

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Nigel Farage must be informed immediately.

Once this news gets out, his party will be riding on a wave of public outrage.sewage outfall.

There, I've corrected it for you.

 

Of course it was down to a shortage of plastic drainage pipes.......

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Wooden baseboard legs were outlawed on fire safety grounds by an EU directive dated 01/04/1995....

 

Well if you read the Ally Pally regulations in full, no timber or other flammable material may be used in construction of your exhibit... :nono:

 

with all that wood and polystyrene, I suspect not one single layout actually complies. :O

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A lot of venue owners have that restriction on their standard forms.  Bit like needing portable RCD etc.  Unfortunately very few exhibition/show organisers will actually pursue these stupid restrictions with the venue owners and get them updated or corrected.

Peter

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In the event of a fire (not attributable to any exhibitors, but caused for example by a venue's catering or electrical malfunction) at a venue with such restrictions, what would be the insurers' position regarding layouts or trade stands damaged by the fire? The venue insurers would presumably refuse any pay-out, but would non-compliance with the venue's  terms invalidate the organisers' insurance? Could a layout owner's own insurance decline to pay out if they regarded the liability as laying with the venue?

 

Pete

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I suspect that organisers fear pursuing venue owners too rigorously for fear that any more draconian measures which have been dreamt up since the last rules were published might be applied.

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In the event of a fire (not attributable to any exhibitors, but caused for example by a venue's catering or electrical malfunction) at a venue with such restrictions, what would be the insurers' position regarding layouts or trade stands damaged by the fire? The venue insurers would presumably refuse any pay-out, but would non-compliance with the venue's  terms invalidate the organisers' insurance? Could a layout owner's own insurance decline to pay out if they regarded the liability as laying with the venue?

 

Pete

Interesting one Pete.  The insurance company would no doubt try to get out of any liability that it why it is so important that the Show organisers do take this up with the venue and get ALL these type of points clarified. Not wait until it happens. If the insurance company refuses to pay out the layout owners could probably sue the organisers.

 

If, as Gordon H suspects that the venue owners might try to put in more draconian measures then there are many other venues that are available.  Also remember that a bit of adverse publicity can really hurt a venue!

 

Peter

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