7016 'Chester Castle' South Wales Pullman (1958)

[70021 Morning Star]

I have just acquired an Airfix/Dapol/Hornby model of a 4-6-0 Castle Class steam locomotive - the temptation at a railway model show was too great - and I am intending modifying her to depict 7016 'Chester Castle'. The project is to represent 7016 Chester Castle's history in the BR Western Region, at which time the redoubtable John Hodge tells us she was rostered on the South Wales Pullman service.

On page 59 of his book, The South Wales Main Line : Part One Cardiff, John Hodge shows a picture of 7016 Chester Castle with the following caption:

 "As the Canton express engines, the ex-works Landor 'Castles' would immediately be rostered on the top turns to Paddington. No. 7016 Chester Castle had emerged from Swindon in October 1958 from Heavy General repair, and is seen in that month with the down 8.50 a.m. Paddington to Swansea 'South Wales Pullman' as it approached Canton. The train returned at 4.35 p.m. from Swansea, but was not a commercial success; ..."

7016 Chester Castle was "built August 1948. First and August 1950 shed allocations Cardiff Canton. March 1959 shed allocation Swansea Landore. Transferred from Cardiff Canton to Cardiff East Dock shed September 1962. Last shed allocation Cardiff East Dock. Withdrawn November 1962. Scrapped at Bird's, Bridgend." -- source, www.GreatWestern.org.uk

 

Well, it's not much to go on, but I think it'll make for another interesting project.

 

Rick

 

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PICTURES

A very handsome GWR 4-6-0 7016 Chester Castle joins my other two locomotives, 2-10-0 92220 Evening Star and 4-6-2 70021 Morning Star, in the Ash Vale engine shed, awaiting her turn for a Heavy General repair.

[70021 Morning Star]

.

1950s PULLMAN COACHES

 

My first enquiry is, what would the coach formation of the down South Wales Pullman have been in October 1958 ?
 

I gather there were several designs of Pullman coaches that might have been around: 'matchboard', aluminium clad matchboard, or the more modern aluminium coaches, but probably too early for the GWR's 'super saloons'. Also suspect the 1958 formation may have been of mixed types, especially the kitchen cars?

 

It would also be nice to know the coach types make-up of the 1958 South Wales Pullman, as other posts and book/Internet research suggests there were a lot of kitchen carriages, and likely a bar, but surprisingly few dining saloons/parlours. (Why?)

 

Many thanks for any contributions,

Rick

 

DIFINITIVE ANSWER on post #29

[steve fay]

The dining car was the Dafodil car. I think the full list of coaches is on the golden age models web site.

Pullmans for the “South Wales Pullman” (plated sides) :

First Kitchen Cars :

Fingall, Iolanthe, Cynthia, Rosamund, Cecilia

Second Kitchen Cars :

Car No.169, Car No.171

Second Guard Parlour Cars :

Car No.54, Car No.55

[70021 Morning Star]

Hello Steve,
Thank you for a very detailed reply. Yes, indeed, the full list is on the Golden Age Models website is as you said, it reads as follows:

"Pullmans for the “South Wales Pullman” (plated sides*)
First Kitchen Cars: Fingall, Iolanthe, Cynthia, Rosamund, Cecilia
Second Kitchen Cars: Car No.169, Car No.171
Second Guard Parlour Cars: Car No.54, Car No.55."

Lots of nice reference pictures on this site too.
 

[ UPDATE - According to some sources, the SWP also contained the Diamond Bar "DAFFODIL". ]

 

What is an extraordinary is that they say the South Wales Pullman has 7 Kitchen cars, plus two Guard Parlour cars (apparently, with yet more kitchens) in a rake of 9 coaches! Is that correct? Am I misunderstanding what is a 'kitchen'? And, is a Guard Parlour a kind of BSK?

...back to Russell for a bit of research!
 
Interesting articles on Hornby's Pullman coaches at:
http://www.mremag.com/news/article/Hornby-k-class-pullman-cars/12153
http://www.semgonline.com/coach/coupe/index.html

 
*a matchboard sided coach that has been 'skinned over' with aluminium or steel. See pictures, below.
 
Thanks,
Rick
 
 
_____________
PICTURES
Hornby's Pullman Kitchen 1st carriages, with Matchboard and Plated sides, respectively.
 
(Me thinks a bit of sandpapering,  a respray, and rebadging of the Matchboard versions, currently on sale for only £25 from a well known model shop, may be in order :-)

[70021 Morning Star]

PULLMAN SECOND PARLOUR CARS No.54 & No.55

According to www.britishrailways.info, the two Guard Parlour cars No.54 & No.55 were described as follows

K = Parlour Car with kitchen
D = Non-supplement dining car in Scotland
BP = Parlour Car with luggage area including a guard’s seat

Car No.54 (K,BP) 1923-63 to LNER stock (1942-6), later SR, BR(S), WR (including RBP 1962)
Car No.55 (K,D,BP) 1923-63 to LNER stock (1942-6), later BR(S), WR (RBP in 1962)

 

Which still doesn't answer the question, are they a form of BSK ? 

We appear to have enough Kitchens to feed the world; even the Guard Parlour cars have kitchens; and not sure if we have any brakes...  

...sounds like a recipe for making a lot of omelette !  ;-)

Rick

[steve fay]

You will need some modifications to the loco,

Hand rail on the cab side,

Etched chequer plate on the inside cylinder tops,

Two extra mud hole covers on boiler in front of safety valve bonnet.

Out side steam pipes.

Mechanical Lubricator

[70021 Morning Star]

Thanks Steve,
I'll start Googling for 'mud holes' etc. :-)
 
I was thinking she needed the cab handles. Already have the brass rod for that. Hmmm, will need some handrail-attachment thingies, and a few millimetres of etched-brass chequerplate.
 
Currently awaiting delivery of a new tender shell, as Chester Castle was fitted with a straight-sided Hackworth tender, and the tender-drive's shell is a Collet type.    

Also need to add a 'real coal' load, and those steps look a bit 'iffy' too.
 
And, oh heck, those Pullmans will need close-coupling couplings (can't abide tension hook couplings), and a NEM Pocket fitted to 7016's tender.
 
Ben Brooksbank (photographer) is kindly sending me some high-resolution photographs of Chester Castle, so, together with your advice (once I've googled what it means :-) I'll have a fighting chance of getting her correct.
 
Rick
 
________
PICTURE
4-6-0 No.7016 Chester Castle, taking on water at Goring troughs. (31st May, 1951)
© Permission by Ben Brooksbank (also available on 'commons licence' from Wikipedia).

7016 Chester Castle seen taking on water at Goring troughs (see the water spume under the tender) while working the 3.55 p.m. down Paddington-Neyland; being non-stop to Newport (other than the Duke of Beaufort 'lasting covenant' requiring all trains to stop at Badminton).

[70021 Morning Star]

Hi Steve,

I now know what a 'mud hole cover', also known as a 'washout plug' (a term I had previously heard), is all about. So, it's worth throwing these unexplained terms at me, as it lets me learn something new.

 

Less sure about what you're referring to with the outside steam pipes.

 

I've found reference to 'mechanical lubricator box' on the superheated Castles. (Picture below.) Is this what you mean?

 

Cheers

Rick

[70021 Morning Star]

Some of the modification parts have now arrived. The straight-sided Hackworth tender body shell and the Chester Castle nameplates identity-change pack.

 

The body shell looks like it will fit on the tender ok, but is off a loco-drive which allowed them to model a very nice deep coal bunker with partial coal load. This will need modifying to accommodate the tender-drive engine, as well as addition of a real coal load, but currently I'm still searching for a service sheet that'll tell me how to disassemble the Airfix tender.

 

The Chester Castle nameplates, 7016 cab plates, and smoke box number are from Fox Transfers and look very nice.  

 

I'm still looking for a supplier of the GWR Copper Chimney Cap and Brass Safety-Valve 'Bonnet', but have a few leads.

 

Meanwhile, here are a few pictures of the parts I've just received.

 

Rick

 

 

__________

PICTURES

[ to follow shortly ]

 

The original Kidwelly Castle nameplates have some additional linkage detail on the offside. What precisely this represents needs investigating before fitting the new nameplates.  

 

Some nice coal bunker modelling on the new tender shell, including a partially completed fire irons tunnel (as can be seen, it just lacks a floor).

[ozzyo]

Hi Steve,

I now know what a 'mud hole cover', also known as a 'washout plug' (a term I had previously heard), is all about. So, it's worth throwing these unexplained terms at me, as it lets me learn something new.

 

Less sure about what you're referring to with the outside steam pipes.

 

I've found reference to 'mechanical lubricator box' on the superheated Castles. (Picture below.) Is this what you mean?

 

Cheers

Rick

 

Hello Rick,

 

a wash out plug is a screw that fits in the boiler of approx. 13/4" dia. these are the round things that you see along the firebox sides (about half a dozen of them), a mud hole cover is a bit different, this is normally found on the apex of the firebox and as its name suggests is a cover oval in shape with a dome shaped top. as in this photo,

 

The Castles had two types of outside steam pipes the first ones had a straight section in them the latter ones were more curved.

I'm putting some scans of the main differences between Castles up here, these only used to show the points and are copyright.

 

HTH

 

OzzyO.

[steve fay]

Look at Penrice castle above, notice the two lumps in front of the safety valve bonnet. You'll need to add these as all the 5098 series of castles had 3 or 4 row super heaters. It's a little detail but a noticeable one.

Oh and the square patch on the boiler side close to the firebox.

Happy modelling

Steve

[steve fay]

Hi Steve,

I now know what a 'mud hole cover', also known as a 'washout plug' (a term I had previously heard), is all about. So, it's worth throwing these unexplained terms at me, as it lets me learn something new.

 

Less sure about what you're referring to with the outside steam pipes.

 

I've found reference to 'mechanical lubricator box' on the superheated Castles. (Picture below.) Is this what you mean?

 

Cheers

Rick

That's the one, you can get a casting, I used to use mainly trains but I'm not sure if they are still going. Then may be some copper fuse wire for the pipes.

[ozzyo]

Don't get Steve and myself on about Castles and the pipe work, PLEASE. 

 

Then you get this one or two, along with all the different pipe runs,

 

This loco also has the ATC pick up gear under the cab, how can I tell from this photo !!!!!

A tip is that the Castles never had the ATC pick up mounted on the rear of the front buffer plank, but did have it at the front of the loco.

 

OzzyO.

[70021 Morning Star]

Thanks Ozzyo and Steve,

I'm now really clear on what needs doing. Super.

 

Hmmm, it looks like those 1 3/4 inch washout plugs might be fabricated from pin heads. Have to check what 1 3/4" is in 1:76 scale.

 

For the rest, I'll compare with the Airfix model and photographs of 7016.

 

Nice view of the ATC and the train reporting number frame, too. Ooo, and those GWR tapered buffers.

 

Really helpful, thanks,

Rick 

[ozzyo]

Thanks Ozzyo and Steve,

I'm now really clear on what needs doing. Super.

 

Hmmm, it looks like those 1 3/4 inch washout plugs might be fabricated from pin heads. Have to check what 1 3/4" is in 1:76 scale.

 

For the rest, I'll compare with the Airfix model and photographs of 7016.

 

Nice view of the ATC and the train reporting number frame, too. Ooo, and those GWR tapered buffers.

 

Really helpful, thanks,

Rick 

 

1 3/4" in 1:76 is approx 0.025" or 0.65mm. The wash out plugs are in the side of the firebox just above the handrail not the domed shaped bits. If you look at the photo you will see that a mud-hole cover is hanging down just in front of the cab.

 

Do you know what the ATC is as it's not in that photo.

 

You can see the back of a named train headboard possibly the Cathedrals, in the last photo not in the photo below.

 

OzzyO.

 

[70021 Morning Star]

Comparing Ben's photograph of Chester Castle, on 31st May, 1951, with the above information and the Airfix model, it appears Chester Castle had:

• Probably, the shorter, 1936 pattern, funnel ?  ...........not certain ??  ...need GWR copper one of correct height
• BR pattern parallel barrel buffers.  ............................model correct
• Unmodified, straight, steam pipes.  ..........................model correct
• Possibly a mechanical lubricator (forward position*) needs adding to model*
• Later type, 'dished' bogie wheel clearance.  .............model correct
•                                                                                   model needs those 'pin head' things on the boiler, in front of safety valve bonnet
• Safety-valve bonnet  ................................................model needs brass one
• Box pattern inside cylinder casing.  ..........................model needs modifying to square shape
• Flat-sided Hawksworth tender ..................................replacement tender shell to modify to fit
• Unknown sandbox type ............................................model depicts correct externally accessible type
• Steve's square patch (is this left side only?) ............needs adding to model
• Firebox washout plugs & mud hole covers :.............model correct

*the picture appears to show an empty bracket, as though something has been removed. See enlarged close-up, below. [uPDATE : apparently, the brackets are for spare lamps. The mechanical lubricator is on the other side of the loco.]

 

The Airfix box says "CASTLE CLASS   BR", which could explain something. Not sure if this differs from the current Hornby.

 

Cheers,

Rick

 

________

Close up of Ben's picture of Chester Castle (on 31st May, 1951), duplicated for details verification

 

Close-up of steam pipe and what appears to be an empty lubricator bracket.

[70021 Morning Star]

Hi Ozzyo,

Are we talking about this being the 'mud hole cover' (see picture) ?

 

Also, in identifying the chimney. Do we know the scale height of the standard and short versions ?

 

Thanks,

Rick

 

____

[Silver Sidelines]

Hello Rick
 
After you have sorted the engine you will need to do something with the tender.  If it is an authentic Airfix model it will have come with a Churchward Tender.  It will need swapping for a flat sided design.  It can be done as I did for a model of Swindon:



Regards

Ray

PS I haven't made any alterations to the Aifix bodyshell other than add sprung buffers and lamp irons - and its still Tender Drive.

[steve fay]

Comparing Ben's photograph of Chester Castle, on 31st May, 1951, with the above information and the Airfix model, it appears Chester Castle had:

 

• Probably, the shorter, 1936 pattern, funnel ?  ...........not certain ??
• BR pattern parallel barrel buffers.  ............................model correct
• Unmodified, straight, steam pipes.  ..........................model correct
• Possibly a mechanical lubricator (forward position*) needs adding to model*
• Later type, 'dished' bogie wheel clearance.  .............model correct
• Box pattern inside cylinder casing.  ..........................model needs modifying to square shape
• Flat-sided Hawksworth tender ..................................replacement tender shell to modify to fit
• Unknown sandbox type ............................................model depicts correct externally accessible type
• Steve's square patch (is this left side only?) ............needs adding to model
• Firebox washout plugs & mud hole covers :.............model correct

*the picture appears to show an empty bracket, as though something has been removed. See enlarged close-up, below.

 

The Airfix box says "CASTLE CLASS   BR", which could explain something. Not sure if this differs from the current Hornby.

 

Cheers,

Rick

 

________

Close up of Ben's picture of Chester Castle (on 31st May, 1951), duplicated for details verification

 

Close-up of steam pipe and what appears to be an empty lubricator bracket.

They are extra lamp brackets

[70021 Morning Star]

Hello Ray,

That's a nice model  ...oh, it's an Airfix, just like mine !  (Will add sprung buffers if I have to buy a set for the tender.)

 

Yes, I've actually got a replacement flat-sided Hawksworth body shell in my hands right now. It needs some work to remove the lower parts of the rather nicely moulded coal-bunker, as the Airfix is a tender-drive and there's currently no room for the motor. I'll do the real coal coaling at the same time. Only problem is that it is fitted with GWR style taper buffers. So I'll need to replace with the British Railway later pattern parallel barrel buffers, as per Ozzyo's post. Also need to change both 70021 and 7016's totems to the BR lion and dartboard type (with Morning Star's offside totem bearing the rare forward facing lion).

 

I'm maintaining a 'to do' list in post #16. Feel free to suggest any additions.

 

Steve, I thought they looked like lamp brackets, but they seemed to be in the location I'd expect to see the mechanical lubricator. Any idea where the lubricator is hiding; I can't see one in Ben's 1951 photograph (although likely added by 1958) ?

 

Current big question is, how tall (in 1:76 scale) are the original and short funnels?

 

Thanks,

Rick

 

___________

Hornby's Flat-sided Hawksworth tender

[70021 Morning Star]

Identify the object competition...

 

The following picture is an enlargement of a portrait of 7016 Chester Castle itself. There's an object that, on first impression, looks like a bucket. But closer inspection shows the bucket handle to be a blemish (possibly a hair) on the negative. The picture then starts to mage sense. The 'bucket' is a backwards leaning plate that supports the boiler.

 

Question: what is the object in front of the thing that I first took for a bucket?

 

Cheers,

Rick

 

_______

[ozzyo]

Hello Rick,

 

the white object is a spare lamp the thing that though was a hair is its handle. The part that angles back is the rear part of the smokebox saddle.

 

The flat sided tenders come in two widths 9'0" (scale 36mm) County's only and 8'6" (scale 34mm) all other classes.

 

The Castle double chimney was approx 1'7" tall and I think the short single chimney the same (scale approx 6.3mm).

 

Looking at both photos I would say that she does not have a mech. lub. box fitted.

 

Looking at Ben's photo she has the three row superheat boiler note the small cover on the L/H side of the smokebox, so the chances are she will not have the square patch on the boiler.

 

OzzyO.

[steve fay]

The mechanical lubricator would be on the opposite side of the loco.

[70021 Morning Star]

Ozzyo and Steve,

Thanks guys.

 

Yes, somewhere to store lamps, so they can make up the various patterns of front lamps, and have a spare, makes sense.

 

I did wonder whether there was just one or, as I'd have expected, a pair of mechanical lubricators. Now I know.

 

All but one of the Pullman coaches arrived this morning. Some repainting/light-weathering and a change of couplings (to NEM Close-Couplings) to be done. Changing the matchboard sides of the two restaurant cars to represent the plated type won't require sanding off the ridges, but applying fine filler between them; so only involves the bottom panels, which is much simpler.

 

Converting the loco-drive tender to fit onto a tender-drive tender is an interesting challenge. I'll submit a separate post, when I've reworked the plastic shell, added the real coal, and cut and redistributed that huge body weight to fit the available space, on Friday.

 

I'm off to give a painting course at one of the London hospitals tomorrow, so no further work on any of my projects until Friday.

 

 

Rick  

[70021 Morning Star]

.

PULLMAN COACH COLOURS

 

From reading around the subject on the Internet, it appears that the appropriate colour for a Pullman carriage roof depends upon its construction. Aluminium covered rooves were silver. Wood and canvas* rooves were painted in white lead paint**. So, silver or white.

 

*I'm assuming that when matchboard coaches had their sides smooth panelled, which was done for cosmetic reasons, the (out of sight) rooves would retain their white lead painted canvas. 

 

**May have been painted black during WWII, and remained such into BR days. ...still looking.

 

This being the case, unless anyone advises to the contrary, my Pullman coaches will have a mix of silver and white rooves, but all will be greyed-down by a suitable application of soot weathering. This 'greying' should unify the formation into a fairly uniform sooty-grey, while allowing some of the silver or white to show through (but not be too eye-catching) thereby adding detailing interest to the modelling of the formation, in revealing something of the underlying construction characteristics of these two types of roof construction.

 

As for the colour of the side panels. Umber brown is correct for the lower portions, doors, etc. while the window panels are described as white or cream. In fact, the cream came from the varnishing of the white panels, turning them a varnish yellow (a.k.a. 'cream'), as well as accumulated soot and dirt. But, as the Pullman company (and Western Region) had a reputation for keeping its crack passenger trains clean, I think we can discount any major discolouration of these off-white panels due to significant accumulations grime. This leaves us with the tinting of the varnish, where many batches were said to be fairly dark to begin with, combined with varnish's propensity to rapid yellowing with age and exposure to sunlight, plus a degree of accumulation of soot and grime picked up along the return journey, to and from cleaning in the coach shed, suggests a relatively dark cream. As such, I'm thinking that the later Hornby/Bachmann (and many of the coaches we see in preservation) are depicted in too light a shade of cream. While the older Hornby Pullman coaches are probably too dark, even for varnish that's darkened over several years of service. Therefore, I'm proposing to repaint my South Wales Pullman carriages a dark varnish-brown, closer to the older Hornby Pullmans, but not quite that dark.   

 

Anyone, any thoughts to the contrary?

 

Thanks,

Rick