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Hornby Class 71


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  • RMweb Gold

Does any one known which retails have any of the Hornby (discounted) blues models available. I've tried ROS but they seen to be sold out and Hattons are asking £128. I'd waiting to see how it compared with Daves 71 and from what I read there is not much to choose between either of them so i may as well try the Hornby model.

 

thanks 

 

B

£99 from Bure Valley

 

http://www.burevalleymodels.com/p/8523/R3374---BR-Class-71-BR-Blue-71012

 

Cheers,

 

Keith

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  • 2 months later...
  • RMweb Gold

Can't see it mentioned in the thread but is it possible to control the rear marker lights independently from the front on DCC? I know theres a switch on the bottom for non DCC (and it probably works for DCC as well) but thats a bit....old fashioned.

Secondly, what are the headcode stickers actually like? Complete pain to swap once applied or not too bad?

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  • 1 month later...

.

 

A couple of new Hornby Class 71's now available, for example from Hattons ;

 

 

Hornby R3568 Class 71 E5018 in BR green

 

http://www.hattons.co.uk/250843/Hornby_R3568_Class_71_E5018_in_BR_green/StockDetail.aspx

 

 

 

Hornby R3569 Class 71 E5005 in BR blue

 

http://www.hattons.co.uk/250851/Hornby_R3569_Class_71_E5005_in_BR_blue/StockDetail.aspx

 

 

 

.

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  • 1 year later...

 Anybody had or heard of issues with the PCB on these locos? Mine has been running like a little sweetie every since i got it, but this evening going up 't bonk into the station I gave her some beans up to about 90% full power and as she accelerated suddenly all the lights went out. It seems some component has died, or maybe a track burned out. It's impossible to tell as the PCB is multi layered with micro surface mounted components (It's not DCC) I've got everything working again simply by wiring up the LEDs to the power pickup with inline resistors. Trouble is it's not really an ideal fix.

 Thanks

 Pete.

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  • 2 years later...
7 hours ago, Kim Durose said:

For anyone still wondering (sorry, late to the party!) the space inside this what should be cavernous bodyshell is none-existant. I have used a tiny LaisDDC decoder and mounted it in the recess where the booster moulding sits. I secured it with kapton tape so it sits against the motor body. There is not sufficient space between the cab interior and the chassis block to mount one vertically. Ridiculously bad planning from a design perspective. It's not really DCC ready at all, it's a token gesture.

I’ve had the same problem as I’ve just tried to fit a Dcc chip.....I’ve tried a 8 pin direct , a lens sliver,and a Dcc concept concept mini and all still don’t fit. I’ve seen a u-tube clip from Jenny Kirk which sho

 

7 hours ago, Kim Durose said:

For anyone still wondering (sorry, late to the party!) the space inside this what should be cavernous bodyshell is none-existant. I have used a tiny LaisDDC decoder and mounted it in the recess where the booster moulding sits. I secured it with kapton tape so it sits against the motor body. There is not sufficient space between the cab interior and the chassis block to mount one vertically. Ridiculously bad planning from a design perspective. It's not really DCC ready at all, it's a token gesture.

I’ve try a direct pin 8 decoder, lens silver with harness,and a Dcc concept mini and none fit properly. I’ve seen a u tube clip from Jenny Kirk showing a simple fit fit a 71.

 

I’d like some advise because like you I can’t fit a decoder in the 71 which is very annoying 

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  • RMweb Gold
59 minutes ago, cbrooks122000 said:

Having had another look the space over the motor is taken up with the cover in the body. So it looks like a 8 pin LaisDCC direct fit which is very shallow or alternatively a rewired 6 pin Zimo wired to 8 pin. That is small enough to fit on top of the circuit board and if it is rewired, the wire will not take up much room. You might get away with a Hornby one if you flatten out the wire.

 

The Lenz Silver Direct fits perfectly without any problems. If you want to fit a Zimo decoder, the MX600R fits easily so long as you remove the plastic insert that represents the generator - it's just a clip fit. Plus it may also be necessary to remove the sprung  electrical connector for the pantograph which I assume you will not be using if running on DCC. It just fits with the same screw that holds the pantograph in place. So hold the body upside down, firmly holding the pantograph in place, undo the small screw, remove the spring and put the small screw back in again. 

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I only recently bought a blue TOPS Hornby 71 (my other existing pair are DJM in green variations), and I too went through a few iterations before settling on a suitable decoder. First tried a direct plug in DCC Concepts decoder, which worked nicely but would not allow the body to clip back on, so next was a TCS DP2X-UK; that one was not great on running qualities and caused a few little oddities in the behaviour. That could have been ironed out with a little CV tweaking, but it only had two functions available, where the Hornby model ideally needs six. ... the body did clip back on though! :D

Next was a Zimo MX600, which behaved beautifully, but even after milling away part of the interior 'engine room' moulding, I still could not quite get the decoder end of the body to clip back in. Finally, I remembered I had a couple of ESU LokPilot 5 micro decoders set aside for other projects. One of those went in nicely, and the wiring harness was long enough to allow the decoder to sit comfortably at the non-socket end of the PCB. The body clipped back on nicely. There was a little bit of an issue with surging at very low speeds, which was not fixed using the ESU auto-tune function a few times, so it was onto the programming track and Decoder Pro to tweak a couple of the parameters for low speed running and feedback. Having done that, it now runs perfectly at all speeds, and hauls a decent load too.

 

 

IMG20210118135810.jpg

Edited by SRman
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  • 1 month later...
  • RMweb Gold
17 minutes ago, Kim Durose said:

Thankfully the diesel / electric bogie arrangements seem to be better, albeit with zero thought as to where the tiniest of DCC decoders will be positioned. The 71 is a great model to look at but is horrible in this respect. A simple task like fitting the smallest of decoders in a "DCC Ready" model should be well within the capability of any modeller. It's almost as if Hornby forgot its DCC customer base right from the design stage.

 

It's really down to Hornby's dogged insistence on using 8-pin decoders for every model. If this were a Bachmann model, there'd be a 21-pin socket and DCC fitting would be a doddle as 21-pin decoders are more or less the same size as the blanking plug. And the socket might even be in the underframe so you could install a decoder without having to take the body off.

 

Try fitting an 8-pin decoder into a Hornby M7 or H tank loco. Bachmann's E4 had a 6-pin socket - again DCC fitting was dead simple. 

Edited by RFS
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I’ve managed to get a lens sliver direct to fitted which allowed the body to seat properly but unfortunately the lights don’t work now.....

 

I have to agree with those who have said Hornby didn’t plan the DDC decoder well as many of the chips just won’t allow the body to seat, with or without a harness. It’s seems only direct fitted chips which have the 8 pin  orientated towards the cab as opposed to the body sides that fit easily. There should have been provision made for seating any decoder without fouling the body.

 

Does anybody have an idea as to why the lights aren’t working? I have not recheck on dc yet but they did work before fitting the chips. 
 

thanks

 

B

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  • RMweb Gold
7 minutes ago, brenn said:

I’ve managed to get a Lenz sliver direct fitted which allowed the body to seat properly but unfortunately the lights don’t work now.....

 

Does anybody have an idea as to why the lights aren’t working? I have not recheck on dc yet but they did work before fitting the chips. 
 

thanks

 

B

 

Most likely because the decoder is the wrong way round. I have a Lenz Silver Direct in mine and the lights are OK. 

Edited by RFS
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2 hours ago, Kim Durose said:

I guess what I'm trying to say is that for £100 - £180 a pop for a loco, I don't expect this level of faff or amateurism :).

This is the point exactly!

 

I have just embarked on chipping my collection and have come across problems with many of my locos, partly because they have been in storage, but mainly with lights not working from the fit of the lights lugs once the body is seated. Dapol 29 seems to me the best example of a manufactured model taking in to account ease of ddc decoder fitting. The body simple to remove/replace and the lights are wired in to the main board with connecting plugs that can be disconnected if needed. Simple and effective, but I guess cost more to manufacture...... At £150 a pop now for a standard diesel I don’t think a better solution to lights rather than copper contact strips is to much to ask.

 

B

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  • RMweb Gold
33 minutes ago, Kim Durose said:

Try removing the body from a Bachmann EMU to install a decoder. Took longer to get the body off and repair the damage to the underframe detail than it did for the decoder to arrive by post and fit it....... oh, and the cuts to my thumbs I wont even mention. Oh, I just did.

 

Take a couple of old credit/store cards and cut them in half. Then it's fairly easy to insert one piece in between body and frame at the centre of the coach, and then slide to each corner to get the body off.  Same technique with the class 71, 73, Heljan 33s etc. 

 

Hornby 2-BIL/2-HAL require a different technique as there's a lug in the centre. Again it's slide the credit card piece there to separate the body from the frame lug, whilst using a screwdriver to move the lugs at each corner. 

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5 hours ago, Kim Durose said:

Try removing the body from a Bachmann EMU to install a decoder. Took longer to get the body off and repair the damage to the underframe detail than it did for the decoder to arrive by post and fit it....... oh, and the cuts to my thumbs I wont even mention. Oh, I just did.

Funny you say that the Bachmann 416 took me weeks to do as the back lugs just wouldn’t lift...... I didn’t want to force it so left it and eventually got it off and could see exactly where the lugs were....luckily I had the replacement bodies Bachmann had sent out due due to the numbers issue but still the instructions didn’t help with the issue at all

 

B

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Going back a little, and drifting just a little off-topic, I think it is high time Hornby dropped the 8-pin socket altogether ... and don't get me started on that ridiculous 4-pin version they came out with.

Bachmann got smart a long time ago, using the same PCBs for their models regardless of whether or not they had sound fitted. Most of the diesels and electrics got 21-pin interfaces, and if one wanted to change to sound, all one had to do was fit the sound decoder and solder the speaker(s) to the marked solder pads on the PCB. For smaller locos, they have moved from 6-pin to NEXT18. They now are moving to PLuX22 for newer models.
 

Hornby have now switched small locos (0-6-0ST Pecketts, Ruston diesels, and Stephenson's Rocket to name a few) to 6-pin, but their compulsion to keep the 8-pin for larger locos is puzzling. They did use 21-pin for the earlier sound locos with ESU decoders, but even those were not standard as the LED wiring was different to the standard non-sound models.

To get up to date and even ahead of the market, they really need to move to PLuX22 for larger locos, and NEXT18 for smaller locos, standardise PCBs with provision for sound (pads for speakers to be easily added - surely there would be economies of scale in using only one PCBdesign for any given model), and, of course, leave room for the decoders and speakers to be fitted. Come on Hornby, how about it? The class 71 shows a lack of forward thinking, but we do know you can do it if you try.

Edited by SRman
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12 hours ago, SRman said:

Going back a little, and drifting just a little off-topic, I think it is high time Hornby dropped the 8-pin socket altogether ... and don't get me started on that ridiculous 4-pin version they came out with.

Bachmann got smart a long time ago, using the same PCBs for their models regardless of whether or not they had sound fitted. Most of the diesels and electrics got 21-pin interfaces, and if one wanted to change to sound, all one had to do was fit the sound decoder and solder the speaker(s) to the marked solder pads on the PCB. For smaller locos, they have moved from 6-pin to NEXT18. They now are moving to PLuX22 for newer models.
 

Hornby have now switched small locos (0-6-0ST Pecketts, Ruston diesels, and Stephenson's Rocket to name a few) to 6-pin, but their compulsion to keep the 8-pin for larger locos is puzzling. They did use 21-pin for the earlier sound locos with ESU decoders, but even those were not standard as the LED wiring was different to the standard non-sound models.

To get up to date and even ahead of the market, they really need to move to PLuX22 for larger locos, and NEXT18 for smaller locos, standardise PCBs with provision for sound (pads for speakers to be easily added - surely there would be economies of scale in using only one PCBdesign for any given model), and, of course, leave room for the decoders and speakers to be fitted. Come on Hornby, how about it? The class 71 shows a lack of forward thinking, but we do know you can do it if you try.

Yes. However, Hornby doesn’t try. When an engineering sample arrives, someone should try to fit a decoder and a speaker to see if it’s possible. Someone should also try to fit the extra bits to make sure that they do fit and should check that flanged trailing wheels can be fitted to Pacifics. I have some Hornby Pacifics where that could be done, then what does Hornby do? There’s a solid chunk of chassis preventing the fitting of flanged trailing wheels to the Merchant Navies and the A2/2s. That sort of cock up is worthy of Bulleid and Thompson themselves.

Edited by No Decorum
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  • 8 months later...
  • RMweb Gold
34 minutes ago, kintbury jon said:

Afternoon all.

 

I can't seem to locate a download sheet for the Hornby 71.  Is there one that shows spare parts? 

 

Seems odd as I can find them for pretty much every other loco.

 

I'm essentially after a new pantograph, buffer and cab rail.  

 

I would suggest contacting Hornby about the spare parts in the first instance to see if they are available. I don't think there's a separate service sheet for the 71 - I've not been able to find one for mine. 

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  • RMweb Gold

Sounds daft I know, but if it creeps above £20 it might be worth binning it on ebay and buying another (or buying one for bits), but these come up on ebay in the £70 range frequently.. the chassis of a 71 is good for a few quid as a start for a Silverfox class 74.

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Just to follow up on this. Hornby got back to me (quickly) to say that they do not have any spares for bodies of any of their locos.  

 

I have got a Heljan buffer that fits nicely and will look to make some sort of dummy pantograph.  I will never have it in the raised position so no need for anything that functions.

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