peach james Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 So, my LRC engine has arrived here. I haven't had a chance to run it yet, but I will soon (I hope...). It looks small coupled to a train of Mk 1's, because I don't have any LRC coaches for it yet...probably one of very few North American diesels that would look small even though it is HO not OO... James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapidotrains Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 So, my LRC engine has arrived here. I haven't had a chance to run it yet, but I will soon (I hope...). It looks small coupled to a train of Mk 1's, because I don't have any LRC coaches for it yet...probably one of very few North American diesels that would look small even though it is HO not OO... James And here's the video of it running with its own coaches... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFkKsgwEHjQ -Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Wintle Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 (edited) If you add a steam generator car: it can pull the blue/yellow lightweight coaches instead. I would be the first to admit that it looks better with its own coaches, though. Adrian Edited March 27, 2015 by Adrian Wintle Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peach james Posted March 31, 2015 Author Share Posted March 31, 2015 They were the prestige when we rented a duplex right near Main Street Station. I don't remember what we traveled to Kingston on in 1981, I am assuming something conventional, I can remember some of the ride back, but none going. Anyway, they were a big part of my misspent youth in terms of what was cool & new for VIA in the early 80's, with the FP4's and similar being slagged out leftovers. (& the Turbo was just a fleeting glimpse, I know I saw it in service, but it didn't create the memory like Jason has for it). I remember the fire at Ted Reeve Arena (it was a chip truck) , and the area behind the arena being the CN car yards...it's all town houses now. When I say the house backed onto the tracks, I mean it does... https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.684705,-79.303247,3a,75y,331.22h,78.56t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1scYqtiZAjgvQbfcbSDTzAGw!2e0 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIRCLASS80 Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 LRC arrives and passes through town at speed!! https://www.flickr.com/photos/nirailfan/16993583689/ 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 Do the LRC locos tilt? I note they're the same profile as the coaches but that may just be to look good, like the BR Class 91s compared to the Mk 4 coaches. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davknigh Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 Do the LRC locos tilt? I note they're the same profile as the coaches but that may just be to look good, like the BR Class 91s compared to the Mk 4 coaches. No tilting, except maybe when running on dodgy CN track. Cheers, David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIRCLASS80 Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 The original plan for the prototype was for tilting but if I recall correctly this system was isolated early on due to problems and eventually removed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 OK thanks. So do the LRC coaches still tilt nowadays? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIRCLASS80 Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 No tilting today Mr Tilt!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dibber25 Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 (edited) Can someone find the piece of movie where the LRC nearly stands on end because a CP freight has moved beyond his authority and is fouling the main line? It's well worth a look if you haven't already seen it. (Should I edit this for exaggeration?) Edited April 18, 2015 by dibber25 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjgardiner Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 Can someone find the piece of movie where the LRC nearly stands on end because a CP freight has moved beyond his authority and is fouling the main line? It's well worth a look if you haven't already seen it. (Should I edit this for exaggeration?) I assume you mean this video where you see the crew bailing at the last second? https://youtu.be/l1q9eBaWY3k Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIRCLASS80 Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 What function number on the Rapido LRC does the engineer jump out of the cab?? On a serious note that was close. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 No tilting today Mr Tilt!! What a waste of effort on our part. Trevor Easton, who was the 'Main Man' on the LRC tilt system, worked in Tilt Development with me on the APT-E project at BR in the 70s. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dibber25 Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 (edited) I assume you mean this video where you see the crew bailing at the last second? https://youtu.be/l1q9eBaWY3k That's the one! I've seen praise for the CP crew backing up, but it was the CP train that had gone beyond its authority. I also read somewhere that the LRC suffered from ingress of snow into traction motors etc. The comment talked about dry snow that blows about. He didn't actually say 'the wrong kind of snow' and it doesn't seem to have got picked up by Canadian media in the way that our media has never forgotten that phrase used, I believe, by a Thames Trains press spokesman. CHRIS LEIGH Edited April 18, 2015 by dibber25 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peach james Posted April 28, 2015 Author Share Posted April 28, 2015 Just remember, we get a _little_ more snow than the UK does...so the "wrong kind of snow" is a far more likely thing for us rather than the UK. tilt- the LRC Masterclass goes through a lot on the development of the LRC concept and train. The coaches have tilting, but it failed more often than desireable, and I think in modes similar to APT, which resulted in cars developing a list...which would be definitely uncomfortable. (like the flood tank at work). I've seen -40 near Toronto, and those kinds of temperatures affect how the trains are operated...there is no way around it at those sorts of temperatures, the trains need to be operated different than when it is +20C. I understand most of the reason behind the demise of the LRC's is age and useage related. They lasted ~20 years, which isn't that bad for a high speed high output diesel powerplant. Especially given that MLW went broke in (1986?), and the 251F's are quite highly stressed beasts. We're replacing similar aged diesel engines (1990-1996) because of similar problems. James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 (edited) If the LRC tilt system was based on that developed for the APT-P, and I believe that was the case, they'd have needed radical changes in the hydraulic fluid type and the seals to make it work at temperatures that low. That in turn might have needed a change in the pump type as well, a whole new development programme. Tilt failure modes for the APT-P tilt system rarely resulted in a 'hard over' failure, that is where the coach is tilted right over to its limit and resting on its bump stops. The system was designed that such a failure could be recovered by just releasing the hydraulic pressure when the coach would 'pendulum' back so the floor was parallel with the track. The most common failure was for it not to tilt at all, with similar results to the first failure mode, and BR's 'solution' to both those was to evacuate the failed coach and to continue at normal APT speeds. That didn't take into account exactly where the passengers would be evacuated to, specially if the train was full, and in reality they tended to slow to 'non-tilt' speeds. Edited April 28, 2015 by Mr_Tilt 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peach james Posted June 8, 2015 Author Share Posted June 8, 2015 https://flic.kr/p/uhmSdR and https://flic.kr/p/tZVd8T Don't blame Jason for my trackwork...it's just more SRVI track, that's all ! James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted June 21, 2015 Share Posted June 21, 2015 The only thing I don,t understand about this train is how did it do the return journey ? The loco does not appear to have any cab or anything to allow it to run in reverse at speed. The coaches do not appear to have a driving van or driving brake compartment. In fact the coaches some remarkably homogenous (all the same) even for just one train. On the assumption that the train cannot run in push pull configuration (unlike a class 91 with mk4s), that leaves 2 options: 1) the train follows a very large loop (Which would imply Canada has no terminal stations were the rails come to abrupt end) 2) the loco un couples, finds a turntable, turns around and switches ends (like steam days) Both don,t look really plausible but I cannot think how else they would operate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjgardiner Posted June 21, 2015 Share Posted June 21, 2015 Reversing moves with a conductor in the rear door of the last coach on the radio to the cab and turning the full train on a wye is the normal operation for VIA Rail. Canada has terminus stations, but only at the extremes, and LRC's were Toronto-Quebec City corridor only. Terminal stations at Windsor and Quebec City only (Sarnia technically speaking on operational grounds, tracks keep going into the tunnel to the U.S., but Via Trains terminate there). Stephen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium BR60103 Posted June 22, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 22, 2015 LRC consists were pretty boring uniform. The locos were designed for a short train (was it 4 cars?) and longer ones were to be topped and tailed. Until the recent fancy livery for business class, the paint schemes were uniform and the business class coaches looked pretty much like the ones for real people. I always felt that there was a tendancy to run train sets as far as possible before turning them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dibber25 Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 The only thing I don,t understand about this train is how did it do the return journey ? The loco does not appear to have any cab or anything to allow it to run in reverse at speed. The coaches do not appear to have a driving van or driving brake compartment. In fact the coaches some remarkably homogenous (all the same) even for just one train. On the assumption that the train cannot run in push pull configuration (unlike a class 91 with mk4s), that leaves 2 options: 1) the train follows a very large loop (Which would imply Canada has no terminal stations were the rails come to abrupt end) 2) the loco un couples, finds a turntable, turns around and switches ends (like steam days) Both don,t look really plausible but I cannot think how else they would operate. The turning on a triangle, I can understand. What really scares the wits out of me is the ECS movements such as the (7 miles?) reversing from the Toronto Maintenance Centre into Union station (especially when the reversing train is the 'Canadian' with 23 cars on). In general, it seems Canadian railway staff prefer the risks associated with this reversing operation to the risk of a grade crossing collision between a truck and a Driving Trailer vehicle in a push-pull formation. CHRIS LEIGH Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Wintle Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 The turning on a triangle, I can understand. What really scares the wits out of me is the ECS movements such as the (7 miles?) reversing from the Toronto Maintenance Centre into Union station (especially when the reversing train is the 'Canadian' with 23 cars on). In general, it seems Canadian railway staff prefer the risks associated with this reversing operation to the risk of a grade crossing collision between a truck and a Driving Trailer vehicle in a push-pull formation. CHRIS LEIGH Almost all GO Transit trains operate in push-pull configuration, with up to 12 coaches, and most of the lines have grade crossings. Adrian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjgardiner Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 The turning on a triangle, I can understand. What really scares the wits out of me is the ECS movements such as the (7 miles?) reversing from the Toronto Maintenance Centre into Union station (especially when the reversing train is the 'Canadian' with 23 cars on). In general, it seems Canadian railway staff prefer the risks associated with this reversing operation to the risk of a grade crossing collision between a truck and a Driving Trailer vehicle in a push-pull formation. CHRIS LEIGH Yes, but at least that long reversing move from TMC to Union is in a completely separated right of way with no level crossings or other interference. Almost all GO Transit trains operate in push-pull configuration, with up to 12 coaches, and most of the lines have grade crossings. Adrian True (in fact, i think every GO run has a level crossing somewhere on it), and the new cab cars if they ever pass muster (Oh Bombardier Thunder Bay and your quality control issues) are partly designed to further improve crew safety in the cab cars in the event of a collision at a level crossing. West Coast Express in Vancouver and AMT in Montreal also run push-pull trains, so it seems to be a split between commuter operators and the long distance operator. I suspect no small part of it is most commuter cars are configured with about 50/50 split of seat directions, where most VIA cars are about 95% seats facing one direction which means trains need turning for passenger comfort at each end of a run. Stephen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Wintle Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 True (in fact, i think every GO run has a level crossing somewhere on it), and the new cab cars if they ever pass muster (Oh Bombardier Thunder Bay and your quality control issues) are partly designed to further improve crew safety in the cab cars in the event of a collision at a level crossing. West Coast Express in Vancouver and AMT in Montreal also run push-pull trains, so it seems to be a split between commuter operators and the long distance operator. I suspect no small part of it is most commuter cars are configured with about 50/50 split of seat directions, where most VIA cars are about 95% seats facing one direction which means trains need turning for passenger comfort at each end of a run. Stephen Having never investigated it, I wasn't sure if the Lakeshore East line had grade crossings, although I assumed it did at the outer end. I know all of the others do. GO seems to have gotten away from the occasional top-and-tail operation with a pair of F59PHs that they were running on the Barrie line. I think all 7 trains on that line are push-pull sets again (although at least one is only a six-car consist). Adrian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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