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The Next Project - Roxey Planet


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I've decided that the next project after the Impetus Fowler is the Roxey Planet.  Main reason being that it should be a simpler one to get finished as it has a cast body etc.  I've started on the body already which, after a bit of fettling has gone together OK and, following Gordon A's ideas, I've also made up the sideframes for a simple chassis to take the special gearbox that High Level make for this kit.

 

Photos will be posted tomorrow!

 

This is the link to Gordon's original thread on the old site -

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=25602

Edited by 5050
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The High Level Quadriver is a good move. A lot of the footplate has to be cut away, but it's well worth it. I used Markits 12 mm wheels on mine, one side with a brass centre, therefore only one set of pick ups to fit. I also went for the 108 gearing and fitted a TCSM1 chip under the cab roof.

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Here are some shots of the progress made so far.

 

A view of most of the basic chassis kit parts and the simple 20 thou brass chassis sides.  The High Level gearbox fret and gears is on the left.  I have noticed that my brass chassis side members are different to Gordon's.  I hope it works!  I used a wheelbase of 24.5mm, the same as the recommended 'Spud'.  The driven axle will be fixed and the other will pivot centrally hence the slot.

 

post-807-0-56138500-1427452947.jpg

 

The kit chassis sides and ends soldered together.  The footplate surface has been marked for cutting.  I drilled a series of holes along the edges and cut through with a heavy scalpel, filing up the edges afterwards.

 

post-807-0-57042100-1427452981.jpg

 

Footplate now has a hole cut in it to clear the mech, same size as the inside of the bonnet.  I now realise that I will have to cut away some of the cab front inside the bonnet and also extend the footplate hole into the cab floor.

 

post-807-0-33695200-1427453022.jpg

 

Cab is now built (but roof not attached yet).  I used 5 min epoxy for this rather than solder to allow some ability to get the corners as exact as possible.  They are mitred which doesn't always work very well with white metal castings in my experience.  They never seem to be exactly right even with some 'adjustments' and the epoxy does also have a gap filling purpose.

 

post-807-0-76260600-1427453047.jpg

 

The bonnet is here shown 'dry assembled'.  Again the parts are mitred at the front and I think that some slight bodging may be required to get all the joints close.  (Please note that 'Bodgers' are actually skilled woodworkers and chairmakers so my use of the term may be a bit out of place here!)

 

post-807-0-95306700-1427453058.jpg

 

Next job is to assemble the gearbox!

 

 

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Here are some shots of the progress made so far.

 

A view of most of the basic chassis kit parts and the simple 20 thou brass chassis sides.  The High Level gearbox fret and gears is on the left.  I have noticed that my brass chassis side members are different to Gordon's.  I hope it works!  I used a wheelbase of 24.5mm, the same as the recommended 'Spud'.  The driven axle will be fixed and the other will pivot centrally hence the slot.

 

attachicon.gifChassis parts.A.jpg

 

The kit chassis sides and ends soldered together.  The footplate surface has been marked for cutting.  I drilled a series of holes along the edges and cut through with a heavy scalpel, filing up the edges afterwards.

 

attachicon.gifParts Chassis Frame and Marked Footplate.A.jpg

 

Footplate now has a hole cut in it to clear the mech, same size as the inside of the bonnet.  I now realise that I will have to cut away some of the cab front inside the bonnet and also extend the footplate hole into the cab floor.

 

attachicon.gifFootplate with Hole.A.jpg

 

Cab is now built (but roof not attached yet).  I used 5 min epoxy for this rather than solder to allow some ability to get the corners as exact as possible.  They are mitred which doesn't always work very well with white metal castings in my experience.  They never seem to be exactly right even with some 'adjustments' and the epoxy does also have a gap filling purpose.

 

attachicon.gifCab and Footplate with Hole.A.jpg

 

The bonnet is here shown 'dry assembled'.  Again the parts are mitred at the front and I think that some slight bodging may be required to get all the joints close.  (Please note that 'Bodgers' are actually skilled woodworkers and chairmakers so my use of the term may be a bit out of place here!)

 

attachicon.gifCab, Footplate, Bonnet dry run.A.jpg

 

Next job is to assemble the gearbox!

Is not the "gearbox" to give 4 wheel drive?

 

John.

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Here are some shots of the progress made so far.

 

A view of most of the basic chassis kit parts and the simple 20 thou brass chassis sides.  The High Level gearbox fret and gears is on the left.  I have noticed that my brass chassis side members are different to Gordon's.  I hope it works!  I used a wheelbase of 24.5mm, the same as the recommended 'Spud'.  The driven axle will be fixed and the other will pivot centrally hence the slot.

 

attachicon.gifChassis parts.A.jpg

 

The kit chassis sides and ends soldered together.  The footplate surface has been marked for cutting.  I drilled a series of holes along the edges and cut through with a heavy scalpel, filing up the edges afterwards.

 

attachicon.gifParts Chassis Frame and Marked Footplate.A.jpg

 

Footplate now has a hole cut in it to clear the mech, same size as the inside of the bonnet.  I now realise that I will have to cut away some of the cab front inside the bonnet and also extend the footplate hole into the cab floor.

 

attachicon.gifFootplate with Hole.A.jpg

 

Cab is now built (but roof not attached yet).  I used 5 min epoxy for this rather than solder to allow some ability to get the corners as exact as possible.  They are mitred which doesn't always work very well with white metal castings in my experience.  They never seem to be exactly right even with some 'adjustments' and the epoxy does also have a gap filling purpose.

 

attachicon.gifCab and Footplate with Hole.A.jpg

 

The bonnet is here shown 'dry assembled'.  Again the parts are mitred at the front and I think that some slight bodging may be required to get all the joints close.  (Please note that 'Bodgers' are actually skilled woodworkers and chairmakers so my use of the term may be a bit out of place here!)

 

attachicon.gifCab, Footplate, Bonnet dry run.A.jpg

 

Next job is to assemble the gearbox!

 

The first photo shows your chassis sides. How did you cut those out? I assume the top is the cut edge of the stock used, so the bottom edge would have to be cut, and it's a very straight line and neat edge. I always have trouble getting a straight line when cutting something like this, so any tips you can offer would be appreciated.

 

Phil

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The frames are 2 pieces of 20thou brass soldered together with 2 long edges as straight together as possible and then filed in the vice.  The basic shape is marked out with a sharp pointed tool using a black permanent marker as the 'blue'.   It is then cut out with a variety of saws (junior hacksaw, razor saw etc.) to get a rough shape (to the outside of the marked line) and then carefully filed (with a selection of needle files) to achieve the final shape.  With loco frames the long top edge is the datum and all measurements should be made from this. Having a reasonable sized clamp-on bench vise helps.

 

Regarding progress on the loco, following some exasperating moments (!) over the weekend etc. I now have it running!  Photos will follow shortly.  This must be one of the quickest loco builds I've ever done!

 

And yes, it is a 4-wheel drive - and no coupling rods and wheels to quarter!!

Edited by 5050
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The frames are 2 pieces of 20thou brass soldered together with 2 long edges as straight together as possible and then filed in the vice.  The basic shape is marked out with a sharp pointed tool using a black permanent marker as the 'blue'.   It is then cut out with a variety of saws (junior hacksaw, razor saw etc.) to get a rough shape (to the outside of the marked line) and then carefully filed (with a selection of needle files) to achieve the final shape.  With loco frames the long top edge is the datum and all measurements should be made from this. Having a reasonable sized clamp-on bench vise helps.

 

Regarding progress on the loco, following some exasperating moments (!) over the weekend etc. I now have it running!  Photos will follow shortly.  This must be one of the quickest loco builds I've ever done!

 

And yes, it is a 4-wheel drive - and no coupling rods and wheels to quarter!!

 

Thanks for the tips - I've tried something like that in the past but never got them as clean and precise as yours. Me thinks I need another go!

 

Phil

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Some more photos of the stages of the build.

 

The chassis etc. in the early stages.  The High Level gearbox/inner chassis maintains the wheelbase itself so the 'outer' chassis is there 'merely' to support the body.  The final drive gears are a force fit onto a 2mm wagon wheelset axle so for trial assembly I used a 1.9mm drill as a temporary axle.  I also turned up spacers from 2.0mm internal diameter brass tubing to hold the idler gears in mesh, one of which had to be reduced slightly in diameter to clear an adjacent gear hence the shiny bit.  The red patches are nail varnish to hold the cross shafts in place. I assembled the outer chassis with EM spacers as I had plenty of these to spare.  With this chassis the final width isn't to important as spacers and bushes have to be employed to take up slack on the axles.  High Level provide a length of 2.0mm steel rod for the idler gear cross shafts.

 

post-807-0-40058200-1427968627.jpg

 

post-807-0-88804300-1427968665.jpg

 

I turned up some bushes for the outer chassis fixed end which extend outward and inward to minimise side play.  The HL bearings just fit inside and the outer extensions just clear the wheel back-to-back.  Wheels are 12mm 3-hole disc pattern and the pin-point ends have been turned off.

 

post-807-0-90620900-1427968593.jpg

 

Here is the basic chassis painted (roughly!) awaiting the motor.  Lining all the axles and bearings whilst pressing the axles through the final drive gears was, shall we say, interesting!  However, it all worked out in the end and the gears roll together quite sweetly.  The 8BA screw in the spacer extends through to bear on the centre of the axle below to give a basic 3-point suspension.  The flat plate in the centre is the motor support.

 

post-807-0-87478000-1427968495.jpg

 

The chassis now assembled with motor and wire pickups.  The final connection to the motor is .45mm handrail wire with some sleeving taken from fine flex.  The internal cab fittings are now attached.  The 'rear' wheels (actually the front ones!) have spacers on the outside of the frames to reduce sideplay.  There is very little clearance using P4 wheels inside the cast frames and I have had to pare quite a bit of whitemetal away to prevent short circuits with the wheels touching the body.  Wire keepers hold the axle in place to stop it falling out.

 

post-807-0-06914200-1427968556.jpg

 

post-807-0-73885800-1427968690.jpg

 

post-807-0-53475000-1427968535.jpg

 

Nearly there.  The body will be in 2 parts, cab with bonnet and footplate/frames, to ease painting.  The fixing is the main chassis securing screw at the rear of the cab into a soldered 8BA nut and 2 self-tappers at the front into the underside of the bonnet.  Cab roof is not attached to ease the fitting of glazing, the production of which is the next task.  There has been a bit of 'fettling' needed to ensure the chassis fits easily but still securely into the body.

 

post-807-0-49267100-1427968709.jpg

 

And then it will be the painting...........................

Edited by 5050
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I notice that you have provided compensation. It isn't actually necessary on a small 4w loco like this which has no coupling rods.

 

The trick is to have plenty of axle either side of the bearings, in this case using the High Level gearbox as the actual chassis would have been ideal, with just some sort of simple "platform" added at either end to allow it to be screwed into the the cast body. Spacers added to each axle outside the gearbox (where you have used the EM ones) would keep everything nicely in line.

 

What happens is that there is inevitably a little play between each bearing and the axle passing through it. With the bearings well in from the wheels this play is magnified sufficiently to enable a short wheelbase 4w loco to sit firmly on the rails, the heavy cast body helping, of course. It is effectively a form of micro-compensation of both axles and, assuming your track isn't diabolical, works perfectly - it won't allow the loco to climb over Mike Sharman's infamous matchstick though!

 

It would be particularly easy on this loco because the cast outside frames hide everything, but, if a loco has inside frames, I add them, spaced out as necessary, in dummy form using copper-covered paxolin - which then provides a very useful place to solder the pick-ups.

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I have come to the conclusion that I prefer, even for as short a wheelbase as the Planet, to have a rocking axle.

Especially as the High Level design allows for a rocking axle.

I am looking to fit Chris's quad drive to the steam and diesel Sentinels in the future. I agree they are not necessary, but they do improve the running.

 

Gordon A

Bristol

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I have come to the conclusion that I prefer, even for as short a wheelbase as the Planet, to have a rocking axle.

Especially as the High Level design allows for a rocking axle.

I am looking to fit Chris's quad drive to the steam and diesel Sentinels in the future. I agree they are not necessary, but they do improve the running.

 

Gordon A

Bristol

The wire pickups bearing on top of the wheels provide an element of springing as well to maintain wheel contact with the rails on uneven track (it's an industrial, remember!).  On a 4-wheel loco this is very important.

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  • 4 weeks later...

I have now reached the point of conclusion and here are some photos of the result.  He/She/It was brush painted with my usual 'corporate blue' industrial loco finish using old style Humbrol acrylic which I find much better than the newer stuff.  Weathering/dirtying is very thin washes of matt black and brown acrylic shades.  Now I've seen the loco magnified in photos I'm wondering if perhaps perhaps I've been a bit over enthusiastic but it's to late now! 

 

After seeing Gordon A's model at Scalefour North I've added an exhaust pipe to the bonnet top which adds a bit more character I think.  There isn't a driver with this loco despite the photo with one about to polish the buffer heads!  Once the cab roof is fitted the inside of the cab is virtually invisible.

 

Pre-glazing and exhaust pipe.

 

post-807-0-06059400-1430141750.jpg

 

After cab glazing and fitting exhaust pipe.

 

post-807-0-69931700-1430141769.jpg

 

post-807-0-64569900-1430141787.jpg

 

The running is very good with a nice steady shunting crawl readily achievable thanks to the High Level geartrain.  If you want one, you'll need to speak to Chris either at a show or e-mail/phone as the mech for this loco is an 'under-the-counter' one.  I think he has been pleasantly surprised how many he has actually sold since Gordon commissioned his!

 

EDIT - just noticed I still need to fit coupling links!

Edited by 5050
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  • 1 year later...
  • RMweb Gold

Paul - I am belatedly now building my Roxey 'Planet' diesel as well, although I have decided to build this one in OO.

 

I also have the High Level 'under the counter' gearbox/drivestretcher kit, and your photos are very useful in determining where to place the gears etc.

 

May I also assume, please, that you soldered the 'gearbox' section to the two 'drive stretcher' sections to create one, solid unit, with (presumably) a soldered joint as marked by the blue arrow below?

 

post-57-0-28817800-1490888127.jpg

 

I cannot imagine that this could be anything but soldered up, but it would be good to have this confirmed.

 

Many thanks.

 

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Erm, I can't remember!  It was 2 years ago - and I've slept since then!  I'll dig it out and see if I can tell without to much disturbance.

 

Thanks for all the 'Likes'!

 

Mojo slowly returning??

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To Captain Kernow, Post 15.

 

Do Not solder the drive stretchers to the main gearbox.

 

​If you do you will have a rigid chassis.

The fact the stretchers are not soldered to the main gearbox gives the second axle a chance to rock.

 

Gordon A

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Erm, I can't remember!  It was 2 years ago - and I've slept since then!  I'll dig it out and see if I can tell without to much disturbance.

 

Thanks for all the 'Likes'!

 

Mojo slowly returning??

Mojo pretty much back and in working order now, thanks.

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To Captain Kernow, Post 15.

 

Do Not solder the drive stretchers to the main gearbox.

 

​If you do you will have a rigid chassis.

The fact the stretchers are not soldered to the main gearbox gives the second axle a chance to rock.

 

Gordon A

Thanks Gordon, point noted.

 

Mine is going to be in OO, however, and provided the scratchbuilt chassis sits 'four square' on my sheet of glass, I'm tempted to build it completely rigid. None of my other 2 axle industrials with rigid chassis have problems with picking up current etc., so it is a bit of a temptation, although the method of providing that bit of compensation does seem straightforward enough.

 

I do need to make the decision on that pretty soon, though.

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The Planet castings look nicely detailed and sharp. I had considered buying one a while back but was put off by photos I found on the web. I suspect they may have been smothered in thick paint. I will now be buying one!

 

Thanks for your detailed build postings. They are very inspiring.

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The Planet castings look nicely detailed and sharp. I had considered buying one a while back but was put off by photos I found on the web. I suspect they may have been smothered in thick paint. I will now be buying one!

 

Thanks for your detailed build postings. They are very inspiring.

Yes, the one on the Roxey site looks like it's been painted with gloss emulsion. The castings look much better. 

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  • 1 month later...
  • RMweb Gold

Thanks to everyone who has provided advice and support, especially 5050 and Gordon A, I've got to the point where the gearbox is mostly assembled, and one of the drive gears is in place on its axle. Progress was suspended for a few weeks because of a fractured finger, but restarted over the weekend.

 

Although I don't have to if absolutely necessary, I'd quite like to partially dismantle the gearbox to make some adjustments to the way it fits inside the chassis frames, but I'm not sure how many times one can remove and re-fit the High Level plastic 'final drive' gear on its 2mm axle, before it (possibly) becomes too loose.

 

It's only been on the axle the once so far, any thoughts as to whether I can get away with removing and re-fitting it once (or twice) more, please?

 

Thanks.

 

 

 

Edit - just to say that I have also e-mailed Chris Gibbon for an opinion.

Edited by Captain Kernow
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CK, have you a layout to run the Planet on?  I hear that Devonport Dockyard had a fleet of them from the mid 1950s onwards, maybe that's an idea.  There's a book about the system written by a chap with a foreign sounding name who seemed to know what he was talking about, that might help. :wink_mini:

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CK, have you a layout to run the Planet on?  I hear that Devonport Dockyard had a fleet of them from the mid 1950s onwards, maybe that's an idea.  There's a book about the system written by a chap with a foreign sounding name who seemed to know what he was talking about, that might help. :wink_mini:

Thanks Paul, trouble is, it appears to be out of print at the moment!

 

On the matter of the gear wheel, I had a reply back from Chris Gibbon, and he didn't think it would be a problem, and so it hasn't, as I've now made the adjustment that I needed to make, and replaced the gear on the wheel. But Chris did, most kindly, offer to replace the gear wheel, if there had been a problem, which is typical of the usual excellent service that you get from High Level.

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  • 3 weeks later...

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