Rapido/Locomotion Models GNR Stirling Single

[James Harrison]

Yes I am imagining now how I can convert this into Emily

 

   (You really shouldn't put ketchup on lobster).....

[LNWR18901910]

That's Emily's basis, of course. I mean, I could update her model to make it more prototypical as well as super-detailed.

[LNWR18901910]

Yes I am imagining now how I can convert this into Emily

I agree! Such models like these look less baby-ish and more more sophisticated and detailed. Loco-drive is better and superior to tender-drive. It's what Hornby and Bachmann are doing right now.

[4069]

The only thing that's keeping my credit card in my wallet at the moment is the oversize handrail knobs on the boiler. They spoil the lines of the loco and look far clunkier than Hornby's equivalent.

Edited December 2, 2017 by 4069

[Colin_McLeod]

Excuses.

[Jeff Smith]

The only thing that's keeping my credit card in my wallet at the moment is the oversize handrail knobs on the boiler. They spoil the lines of the loco and look far clunkier than Hornby's equivalent.

They are probably just pressed in, you could change them. The hand rail size looks OK. There again the final production version may well be finer!

[Edwardian]

That's Emily's basis, of course. I mean, I could update her model to make it more prototypical as well as super-detailed.

 

Ah, you see, I regard myself as a North Western Region purist; if it wasn't in the original series, it's not prototypical!

 

EDIT: By which I meant the series of books; the point of the books was that they reflected the incidents and accidents of the prototype, rather than what television made it, second-rate narratives involving cute cuddly characters that just happen to take the form of railway engines. I've always wanted to model NWR 'prototypically', to reasonably finescale OO standards, having researched Awdry's history of the line.  After all, Awdry himself modelled it as a real railway.  

 

A visit from Bachmann's City of Truro might be a better option!

Edited December 3, 2017 by Edwardian

[LNWR18901910]

Ah, you see, I regard myself as a North Western Region purist; if it wasn't in the original series, it's not prototypical!

 

EDIT: By which I meant the series of books; the point of the books was that they reflected the incidents and accidents of the prototype, rather than what television made it, second-rate narratives involving cute cuddly characters that just happen to take the form of railway engines. I've always wanted to model NWR 'prototypically', to reasonably finescale OO standards, having researched Awdry's history of the line.  After all, Awdry himself modelled it as a real railway.  

 

A visit from Bachmann's City of Truro might be a better option!

True, but like most fans of Awdry's work, I am merging the TVS universe with the RWS universe.

[No Decorum]

Ah, you see, I regard myself as a North Western Region purist; if it wasn't in the original series, it's not prototypical!

 

EDIT: By which I meant the series of books; the point of the books was that they reflected the incidents and accidents of the prototype, rather than what television made it, second-rate narratives involving cute cuddly characters that just happen to take the form of railway engines. I've always wanted to model NWR 'prototypically', to reasonably finescale OO standards, having researched Awdry's history of the line.  After all, Awdry himself modelled it as a real railway.  

 

A visit from Bachmann's City of Truro might be a better option!

Before your edit, I was about to post, “The North Western Region is prototypical, is it?” Then the penny dropped and I dropped the post. I quite agree about Awdry; the television series became more and more bizarre and a lot was lost when models were changed to computer graphics. I don’t much like any of it except Series 3 and 4. The narrator of Series 1 and 2 is truly awful.

[KymN]

Ah, you see, I regard myself as a North Western Region purist; if it wasn't in the original series, it's not prototypical!

 

EDIT: By which I meant the series of books; the point of the books was that they reflected the incidents and accidents of the prototype, rather than what television made it, second-rate narratives involving cute cuddly characters that just happen to take the form of railway engines. I've always wanted to model NWR 'prototypically', to reasonably finescale OO standards, having researched Awdry's history of the line.  After all, Awdry himself modelled it as a real railway.  

 

A visit from Bachmann's City of Truro might be a better option!

 

I still have the December 1959 Railway Modeller that includes Awdry's superbly written article about his 6' by 4' model of the Ffarquhar Branch.  It was the first model railway mag I bought.  There were no Emilys then, and no faces on Thomas, Percy, Toby and Duck.  . 

[Edwardian]

True, but like most fans of Awdry's work, I am merging the TVS universe with the RWS universe.

 

Before your edit, I was about to post, “The North Western Region is prototypical, is it?” Then the penny dropped and I dropped the post. I quite agree about Awdry; the television series became more and more bizarre and a lot was lost when models were changed to computer graphics. I don’t much like any of it except Series 3 and 4. The narrator of Series 1 and 2 is truly awful.

 

I still have the December 1959 Railway Modeller that includes Awdry's superbly written article about his 6' by 4' model of the Ffarquhar Branch.  It was the first model railway mag I bought.  There were no Emilys then, and no faces on Thomas, Percy, Toby and Duck.  . 

 

I think that's the point, I am a fan of Awdry's work, not Britt Allcroft's subsequent over-exploitation of it.  Where the TV series was faithful to the stories at the beginning, it was OK, but, didn't really add anything, to my aged view, to the books, or to my cherished Johnny Morris readings on LP. Anyone else have those?

 

It is probably pompous to say so, but I grew up on those books and on my father's stack of '50s RMs.  I remember the Ffarqhar article, and one on Toby. There was quite a 'back-story' to the Railway Series, as is well-known, and Awdry modelled parts of the mainline and the narrow gauge, too. It was a freelance system, sufficiently realised to allow Awdry, and others, to produce proper working layouts.  As I am finding, a freelance system requires quite as much consideration and research as a model of the Other Railway!

 

People are nostalgic towards their childhoods - that is the mainspring of the mainstream hobby, after all - and, so, it is probably only to be expected that some people will embrace the animated TV series, and the mortuary tones of Ring Starr, as part of their childhood experience of Sodor, but the original stories made sense as a sort of child's interpretation (the engines are clearly children, as all children recognise) of a real steam-age railway, and, so, had a point and an integrity, and a connection to the prototype, wholly lacking in the screen version.

 

So, I can't be a fellow traveller of LNWR18901910 in this, and I hope he forgives me for saying so, but not for me this raiding the Boys Bumper Book of Trains for any prototype that suits my fancy and plonking it down on Sodor with no prototypical rationale.

 

Dreadfully off topic, I realise, but I think Rapido's Stirling Single is best kept as such!

[WD0-6-0]

I think this discussion could result in some very interesting threads of their own, I find the idea of modelling a prototypical Sudrian layout fascinating (I've 3d printed a new running plate to convert a Hornby A3 to the NWR No.4) but I must agree that the tv series has lost its way (in my opinion, after series 5, not Awdry stories in that one I know)

W

Drifting back towards the Topic, the Single could make an appearance in much the same way City Of Truro did, a justification for an appearance on a Sudrian layout, much as it will be for most, as a preserved locomotive.

 

If anyone starts a topic on prototypical ways to model Sodor, I have a few ideas to contribute, but not here.

[Edwardian]

I think this discussion could result in some very interesting threads of their own, I find the idea of modelling a prototypical Sudrian layout fascinating (I've 3d printed a new running plate to convert a Hornby A3 to the NWR No.4) but I must agree that the tv series has lost its way (in my opinion, after series 5, not Awdry stories in that one I know)

W

Drifting back towards the Topic, the Single could make an appearance in much the same way City Of Truro did, a justification for an appearance on a Sudrian layout, much as it will be for most, as a preserved locomotive.

 

If anyone starts a topic on prototypical ways to model Sodor, I have a few ideas to contribute, but not here.

 

I think that there are a number of Sudrian modellers here. Sadly, I am merely an aspirant one.  I am not sure where the topic might fit.  Perhaps ask Andy Y?  He might set up a Freelance or Sudrian board under, say, the Special Interests section.  It would be interesting to hear what you have to say.

 

I like your suggestion, and I see no reason why the preserved Stirling Single should not have visited Sodor in 1938 during its perambulations. Of course, that brings us back to the vexed question of the smaller tender, which is no longer being produced.

 

Given the relative popularity of the LNER in the late '30s as a subject - relative to folk modelling Locomotion at Shildon, or even the contemporary preserved scene generally, or the GN section of the ECML in the 1870s and 1880s - it surprises me that there was insufficient support for the small tender version, but there it is, one of life's minor mysteries.

Edited December 4, 2017 by Edwardian

[Guest spet0114]

 it surprises me that there was insufficient support for the small tender version, but there it is, one of life's minor mysteries.

 

It surprised me too, but there you go. I suppose that 'as it was in preservation' is never quite as appealing as 'as it was in service' or 'as it is currently in preservation', even if the former spans most of a century!

 

From the images in the early Rapido newsletters, it's clear that the Sturrock tender proceeded at least up to the CAD stage. I wonder if:

 

a) Rapido might be persuaded to release their CAD files, so a limited 3D print run could be co-ordinated or crowd-sourced.

 

b) Rapido might be persuaded to model an appropriate Sturrock goods loco. After all, the tender's already done....

 

c) The NRM might be persuaded to build an appropriate Sturrock goods loco. After all, the tender's already done....

 

One can but dream.....

 

Cheers

Adrian

 

Ps. On a more serious note, have the NRM ever made clear what their plans are for No 1's former tender?  As (IIRC) the only remaining Sturrock vehicle on wheels, it has some historical significance....

Edited December 4, 2017 by spet0114

[No Decorum]

I am sure I’m not typical but I went for the large tender because I wanted to get back as close to the original appearance as possible.

 

As to converting to Emily, I have a sound version on order and it would have to be re-blown. I’d much, much, rather not. (Did I really order something as expensive as that?)

 

I seem to recall that this class also appeared in the original illustrations of The Wind in the Willows or Toad of Toad Hall. Chosen, no doubt, because at the time it was the epitome of speed.

 

To drift in another direction, not only do we need appropriate coaches but it would be very pleasant to have a small boilered Atlantic to bridge the gap between this and the large boilered Atlantic.

[No Decorum]

It surprised me too, but there you go. I suppose that 'as it was in preservation' is never quite as appealing as 'as it was in service' or 'as it is currently in preservation', even if the former spans most of a century!

 

From the images in the early Rapido newsletters, it's clear that the Sturrock tender proceeded at least up to the CAD stage. I wonder if:

 

a) Rapido might be persuaded to release their CAD files, so a limited 3D print run could be co-ordinated or crowd-sourced.

 

b) Rapido might be persuaded to model an appropriate Sturrock goods loco. After all, the tender's already done....

 

c) The NRM might be persuaded to build an appropriate Sturrock goods loco. After all, the tender's already done....

 

One can but dream.....

 

Cheers

Adrian

 

Ps. On a more serious note, have the NRM ever made clear what their plans are for No 1's former tender?  As (IIRC) the only remaining Sturrock vehicle on wheels, it has some historical significance....

A Sturrock goods would be nice to have but it wouldn’t fit into the “National Collection in Miniature” idea. Perhaps the NRM might consider a new and useful angle – models of locomotives which haven’t survived.

 

As for the tender, I would favour starting again and producing a steam tender. There’s an oddball!

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

I am sure I’m not typical but I went for the large tender ....

 You very definitely are typical among those who put in an order for this most desireable item, they had so few opting for the Sturrock tender that it wasn't viable (as I read it in the communique at the time).

 

Why the later tender? It's a hell of a lot better looking with the large tender behind it, which reveals it as a 'big engine' before the term entered general currency. All the photos I have seen of these locos at full chat, reveal why they needed a tender of this capacity: see that volcanic exhaust, every bit as copious as that from the later atlantics and pacifics. The power production wasn't efficiently obtained by later standards, lots of coal and water required.

 

Among many afficianados of Doncaster's doings it has long been regretted that the Sturrock tender was used when the loco was refurbished for operation. (It was the loco that was preserved: Stirling tender, schmender, they were everywhere on the GNR at the time and if it still had useful life it probably went off - suitably reconditioned - for continuing service behind an 0-6-0, or for collecting tank sludge or some other purpose.) All that said, the Sturrock tender doesn't look a million miles different from the tenders these locos originally had,

 

Don't think I will be posing the Kitmaster model tender behind my Single though, definitely lacking beside the eclat of the Rapido production. Although if Hornby have ever offered a GNR liveried pacific tender, now that would look nifty.

[southern42]

I ordered the small tender for a specific purpose - it did The Railway Children perfomances and thus was delivered by road to Southall and hauled by rail to London Victoria (oops!!!!) Waterloo.  This makes the small tender the correct tender for the job whatever it's popularity or appearance.  if I remember rightly, it did get about a third of the orders. Could we raise sufficient demand for it to be produced, I wonder? Would we be willing to pay more for it?  Of course, we could always have a go and make our own.....er...hum... and yes, I queried the possibility of its production at the Shildon (Locomotion) stand at Warley.  It raised the matter (with a like minded soul manning the stand - that's two of us!), if nothing else!  The sample model of the Stirling Single looked gorgeous, by the way.

 

Photo with Sturrock tender here - scroll down the page to GNR No. 1 (4 February): https://www.facebook.com/pages/Southall-Loco-Shed/276623432350302

 

Edit - a senior moment!

Edited December 4, 2017 by southern42

[Edwardian]

I ordered the small tender for a specific purpose - it did The Railway Children perfomances and thus was delivered by road to Southall and hauled by rail to London Victoria.  This makes the small tender the correct tender for the job whatever it's popularity or appearance.  if I remember rightly, it did get about a third of the orders. Could we raise sufficient demand for it to be produced, I wonder? Would we be willing to pay more for it?  Of course, we could always have a go and make our own.....er...hum... and yes, I queried the possibility of its production at the Shildon stand at Warley.  It raised the matter (with a like minded soul manning the stand - that's two of us!), if nothing else!  The sample model of the Stirling Single looked gorgeous, by the way.

 

Photo with Sturrock tender here - scroll down the page to GNR No. 1 (4 February): https://www.facebook.com/pages/Southall-Loco-Shed/276623432350302

 

That is the most original reason yet, and I like it.

 

If the small tender option were revived in the future, I would be interested.  I have some late '30s LNER stuff, most of it suitable for ECML, and the inclusion of the Stirling Single on its 1938 tour might well revive my interest in this stock (and cause me to invest in a certain Rapido coach!).

 

My first preference, however, is always going to be for an "in service" over an "as preserved" condition, even if the "as preserved" condition is 1930s in this case.

 

But, for the future, if Locomotion/Rapido wanted to re-visit the small tender option and canvas support, you could count me in.

[Methuselah]

     Thanks for posting those lovely images. Very glad I ordered this, it looks really super - and no - I don't begrudge a penny as long as it runs as well as it looks. Hard to easily fault - bearing in mind they still have some tweaks to do. A pet hate of mine is painted 'brass' safety-bonnets, they never look right. At least one can dull-down a plated one.

 

     A couple of queries for the experts here;-

 

     - Is the wobbliness of the tender coal-rails deliberate/prototypical...?

     - Are the two tenders shown simply to illustrate a removable coal-load...?

     - Does anyone know from where they are taking the sounds for the Soundfile...?

     - Any updates on expected delivery dates...?

 

     This looks every inch worth the wait anyway....!

Really impressed with the standard of finish and decoration. The images cannot convey the solidity felt whilst handling the model and I do like the loco to tender electrical connections.

 

Locomotion_Stirling_Single_1.jpg

 

Locomotion_Stirling_Single_2.jpg

 

Locomotion_Stirling_Single_3.jpg

 

Locomotion_Stirling_Single_4.jpg

 

Locomotion_Stirling_Single_5.jpg

 

Locomotion_Stirling_Single_6.jpg

 

Locomotion_Stirling_Single_7.jpg

 

Locomotion_Stirling_Single_8.jpg

 

Locomotion_Stirling_Single_9.jpg

[rapidobill]

     Thanks for posting those lovely images. Very glad I ordered this, it looks really super - and no - I don't begrudge a penny as long as it runs as well as it looks. Hard to easily fault - bearing in mind they still have some tweaks to do. A pet hate of mine is painted 'brass' safety-bonnets, they never look right. At least one can dull-down a plated one.

 

     A couple of queries for the experts here;-

 

     - Is the wobbliness of the tender coal-rails deliberate/prototypical...?

     - Are the two tenders shown simply to illustrate a removable coal-load...?

     - Does anyone know from where they are taking the sounds for the Soundfile...?

     - Any updates on expected delivery dates...?

 

     This looks every inch worth the wait anyway....!

 

Guess I should take this one... ;>)

 

- The coal rails were knocked loose through a combination of rough handling at the show and insufficient glue from the factory. It's on our list of things to fix for production.

 

- Yes, the model will come with two coal loads so we were trying to illustrate both.

 

- The Single ran in the 1980s and there are several videos of it doing so. While the sound on the videos is not high enough quality to use on its own, it did give us a place to start. With the help of Matt from ESU America we pieced together a sound file from various other recordings that closely matched what we were hearing on the videos. The NRM staff were sent a copy of the file and were quite happy with it based on their recollections.

 

- We're just starting the production process now, so we're still a few months away from delivery. We will send updates as things move along.

Bill

[No Decorum]

Many thanks, Bill.

 

Have you any comment on post #830 about the handrail knobs? 

[Markeg]

The latest Locomotion post arrived yesterday.  Due March.

 

 

Mark

 

We are sorry to inform you that we will not see delivery of the Single before Christmas, however, as you can see from the pictures of the latest EP sample, the model looks magnificent and we are now really looking forward to the delivery of this model in March. If you have one or two on order, we will be in touch with a confirmed delivery timeline and asking you to pay the balance unless you have already paid up in full.

Edited December 7, 2017 by Markeg

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

...The Single ran in the 1980s and there are several videos of it doing so. While the sound on the videos is not high enough quality to use on its own, it did give us a place to start. With the help of Matt from ESU America we pieced together a sound file from various other recordings that closely matched what we were hearing on the videos. The NRM staff were sent a copy of the file and were quite happy with it based on their recollections...

 That'll be the best that can be done. No way of hearing what it was like opened out to full chat when in regular service. These were the fastest machines on earth on entering service, and one commentator's observation that I recall, wrote of it as a 'veritable thunderbolt, such as he had never heard before'.

[Edwardian]

They are probably just pressed in, you could change them. The hand rail size looks OK. There again the final production version may well be finer!

 

And at least they're radially mounted to the boiler!  An increasing rarity in modern RTR!

 

It wouldn't discourage a purchase from me, and I'll take my on view on whether replacements are called for when I see the production version.  To be fair, it wasn't a point I noticed.