Odd wagons of the UK

[jwealleans]

Is this the point where I mention that the LNERCA are using teak which was on the bottom of the North Sea from around 1940 until fairly recently?

[PhilJ W]

2 hours ago, jwealleans said:

Is this the point where I mention that the LNERCA are using teak which was on the bottom of the North Sea from around 1940 until fairly recently?

A few years ago some teak logs were recovered from a vessel in the Irish Sea that was torpedoed in WW1. Apparently teredo worms do not like teak.

[montyburns56]

Ex SECR "Dance Hall" brake van ZTO DS55509 Cardiff Central 1987 by Jamerail

 

 

[73c]

Anyone like to have a guess at this one. Photo taken I believe in the 70's at Peterborough.

[Compound2632]

8 minutes ago, 73c said:

Anyone like to have a guess at this one. Photo taken I believe in the 70's at Peterborough.

 

An ex-LNER 10.5 ton ballast brake of NER design (deeper end windows than the NER article) that has received a new ducket at some point - compare P. Tatlow, LNER Wagons Vol. 2, p. 167.

Edited September 4, 2021 by Compound2632

[Wickham Green too]

....... and very much like the one we saw two pages ago !

[Compound2632]

7 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

....... and very much like the one we saw two pages ago !

 

But from a different angle, which is always good.

[Darryl Tooley]

1 hour ago, Wickham Green too said:

...... and very much like the one we saw two pages ago !

Both are 20 ton ballast brakes built by BR to LNER dia 203 in 1948/9, and distinguishable from their North Eastern Railway progenitors (dia V6) by their steel underframes and duckets.

 

D

[Compound2632]

Just now, Darryl Tooley said:

Both are 20 ton ballast brakes built by BR to LNER dia 203 in 1948/9, and distinguishable from their North Eastern Railway progenitors (dia V6) by their steel underframes and duckets.

 

Ah, y'see, I've only got the volumes of Tatlow that deal with pre-grouping wagons!

[73c]

8 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

....... and very much like the one we saw two pages ago !

My apologies for that Guys. Must have missed it.

[Michael Hodgson]

On 03/09/2021 at 20:24, PhilJ W said:

Used to see a lot of cattle wagons in Romford goods yard in the late 60's early 70's. They were used for delivering empty beer barrels to the brewery (which was still rail connected). They were marked up 'Empty beer barrels only'.

The railway equivalent of "No Cash/tools left in this van overnight" !

[Compound2632]

1 hour ago, Michael Hodgson said:

The railway equivalent of "No Cash/tools left in this van overnight" !

 

Hum. "Empty beer barrels only" could be taken as an instruction. 

[Wickham Green too]

I thought that was the shipments from Scottish distilleries where the barrels seemed to lose more than the usual 'Angels' Share' in transit.

[hmrspaul]

 

19 hours ago, Darryl Tooley said:

Both are 20 ton ballast brakes built by BR to LNER dia 203 in 1948/9, and distinguishable from their North Eastern Railway progenitors (dia V6) by their steel underframes and duckets.

 

D

 

And lasted, even in original black livery, into the 80s and 90s. 

 

https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/lnerballastbrake

This includes details of the one used for the drawing in Tatlow. 

 

Paul

Edited September 5, 2021 by hmrspaul

[montyburns56]

I have vague memories of one of these being pictured in Railway Modeller in those excellent series of articles about TOPS codes in the early 80s.

 

Freightliner match wagon, RGQ B462779, in Basford Hall 1986 by Jamerail

 

 

[PhilJ W]

2 hours ago, montyburns56 said:

I have vague memories of one of these being pictured in Railway Modeller in those excellent series of articles about TOPS codes in the early 80s.

 

Freightliner match wagon, RGQ B462779, in Basford Hall 1986 by Jamerail

 

 

IIRC these wagons were built to carry palleted bricks.

[Fat Controller]

11 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

IIRC these wagons were built to carry palleted bricks.

They were built on 'Medfit' underframes, carried bricks for a while. Then some became 'Shellcase' carriers, and others Coil wagons. Finally, some were used as adaptor wagons with Freightliners, whilst others were given 16t Mineal wagon bodies

[hmrspaul]

42 minutes ago, Fat Controller said:

They were built on 'Medfit' underframes, carried bricks for a while. Then some became 'Shellcase' carriers, and others Coil wagons. Finally, some were used as adaptor wagons with Freightliners, whilst others were given 16t Mineal wagon bodies

Very few were converted from Medfits. Certainly not the ones with clasp brake which became Freightliner match. They were built new as Palbricks. https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/palbrick/e25c8bb3e

Certainly a few later became coil carriers, https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/brcoilp shell case carriers and the frames were used for mineral wagons. https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/mineralmcv10ft

 

Paul

[Wickham Green too]

24 minutes ago, hmrspaul said:

Very few were converted from Medfits. .......

Don Rowland only lists the Dia 1/020 wagons as conversions ( from Dia 1/019 ) : B461609-461616 ........ which by my maffs is only eight vehicles ..... BUT he illustrates B459553 - described as a Dia 1/019 but clearly converted to Palbrick ! ( Perhaps it was subsequently renumbered ? - though he does surmise that there might have been other ad-hoc conversions before purpose-built Palbricks appeared.)

[newbryford]

5 hours ago, montyburns56 said:

I have vague memories of one of these being pictured in Railway Modeller in those excellent series of articles about TOPS codes in the early 80s.

 

Freightliner match wagon, RGQ B462779, in Basford Hall 1986 by Jamerail

 

 

 

I snapped one in Basford Hall in 2012.

 

 

Edited September 5, 2021 by newbryford

[Michael Hodgson]

When the Palbricks were used for bricks, presumably the sides were lifted out for loading and unloading. 

Were the slots in the sides intended to be used as handles to assist in this, or did they serve some other function?

Not surprising these would have been discarded when used for other purposes such as freightliner match.

Would the screw clamps on one end would have been removed too?   It must have been important to secure the bricks within the wagon as friction would probably stop you getting the sides out even if they only slid to the side of the wagon

 

Loading pallets would have been a lot less laborious for the brickworks that stacking bricks individually as they presumably did with the old bogie bricks, but the average goods yard didn't have forklifts, so either few destinations were served or you'd still be manhandling bricks.  Where did they go - rail-served builders merchants?  A lorry straight from brickworks to building site must be a lot more efficient.

[PhilJ W]

They were probably used to transport bricks to a distribution depot. There was one such depot in Romford on the Romford to Upminster line. That depot was closed in the 70's and is now a housing estate. 

[Wickham Green too]

 

1 hour ago, Michael Hodgson said:

.... Were the slots in the sides intended to be used as handles to assist in this, or did they serve some other function? .....

With a fork truck required for the pallet, some bright spark sussed out that it could be used to lift out the side panels too - hence the appropriately spaced slots ................................. though, presumably either the payload was below the slots or only the tips of the forks could be used ( initially at least ).

[jonhall]

I seem to recall* an article in 'Transport Age' that implied they were not for any old bricks, but dedicated to refractory bricks - used in the lining of furnaces etc - it might be that the greater value and fewer destinations justified specialist wagons? (*only from memory - I'm not in the same place as my magazines for a few days, so I might be wrong).

 

Jon

[montyburns56]

I've found a picture of one actually in use, although I'm guessing that it's being used as a barrier wagon in this instance.