Odd wagons of the UK

[Mol_PMB]

I have a feeling that at one stage some TTA tanks were semi-permanently coupled in pairs to reduce train length for the same capacity. Just a possibility some Palbricks were converted as adaptors for these? 

[montyburns56]

Caption says that this was an experimental air brake conversion of a Vanfit

 

"12t Vanfit now in Mechanical Engineers service, as ZRB ADB778331, in Bescot Down Yard, 21st February 1986" by Jamerail

 

 

[hmrspaul]

At least 11 standard vans were converted for the early "Air brake network", the precursor of Speedlink, This is the van clearer from the other side https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/standardabvan/e13680575

 

Paul 

https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/standardabvan

[Wickham Green too]

1 hour ago, Mol_PMB said:

I have a feeling that at one stage some TTA tanks were semi-permanently coupled in pairs ....

Before the days of TTAs !  ----- 

Petroleum Tank Wagons of Britain says "... 1964-built 45-ton GLW Class A wagon. Some of these were the subject of an interesting experimental system of semi-permanent coupling designed to bring the overhead-filling hatches ... into agreement with ... installations .... closer than normal ..."

[Mark Saunders]

1 hour ago, Mol_PMB said:

I have a feeling that at one stage some TTA tanks were semi-permanently coupled in pairs to reduce train length for the same capacity. Just a possibility some Palbricks were converted as adaptors for these? 

My reading of it was an attempt to reduce the cost of moving the product but BR was persuaded to change pricing structure!

[73c]

I've had a look through from page 1 and not seen any photo's of this, so think it's safe to post these 2.

Location, Leyton Yard early 70's

Edited September 6, 2021 by 73c
Details.

[russ p]

50 minutes ago, Mark Saunders said:

My reading of it was an attempt to reduce the cost of moving the product but BR was persuaded to change pricing structure!

 

We're they bar coupled?  When was this 

[hmrspaul]

8 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

Before the days of TTAs !  ----- 

Petroleum Tank Wagons of Britain says "... 1964-built 45-ton GLW Class A wagon. Some of these were the subject of an interesting experimental system of semi-permanent coupling designed to bring the overhead-filling hatches ... into agreement with ... installations .... closer than normal ..."

 

I don't believe they remained like this for very long, but I do have a poor photo of one most unusually in Staines SR (not the WR where the oil depot was) after a derailment of an oil train underneath the road bridge at the London end of the station. https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/stainescentral/e4beb5e40  Quite possibly the first TTV I photographed. 

 

I cannot find a report of the accident on the Railways Archive

 

Paul

[hmrspaul]

39 minutes ago, 73c said:

I've had a look through from page 1 and not seen any photo's of this, so think it's safe to post these 2.

Location, Leyton Yard early 70's

Very nice.

According to the GWR Wagon bible this is the final number of diagram DD1, which were 3000 gallon water tanks. Ten built between 1896 and 1900 - so this is probably 1900. An unusual size, 20ft over headstocks on a 13ft wheelbase. They have a 1904 photo of the similar 32 which has a white tank with large black G W - and always for the Loco dept. They have a photo of 43 looking scruffier than these photos. The XP is interesting and the brake arrangement appears very unusual - it is very unusual to see what is happening with that first photo and if it had vacuum brake - presumably equipped sometime in the intervening years and now removed?

 

Paul

[Fat Controller]

There are some photos on page 49 of Tourett's book, which show some detail of the couplings. They weren't bar couplings, but two links with a space between them on one end, and a single link on the other end which sat between the two links. the two couplings were joined by large cotter pins, secured by split-pins. Apparently the wagons were semi-permanently coupled into sets of six wagons, with conventional draw-gear at the outer ends. 96 wagons, ESSO 6104-99 were built in 1964/5, eventually being retro-fitted with conventional draw-gear a decade or so later.

[Wickham Green too]

And - as intimated in Pauls photo - there were dumpy little side buffers in the conventional position : these, of course, took the buffing loads so the double link coupling arrangement allowed the necessary compression.

[Mark Saunders]

5 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

And - as intimated in Pauls photo - there were dumpy little side buffers in the conventional position : these, of course, took the buffing loads so the double link coupling arrangement allowed the necessary compression.

A similar arrangement is used on one of the French built Megafret twin sets.

[eastwestdivide]

Another shot of a Palbrick conversion to freightliner match wagon, Stratford 1985, over here:

 

[russ p]

13 hours ago, hmrspaul said:

At least 11 standard vans were converted for the early "Air brake network", the precursor of Speedlink, This is the van clearer from the other side https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/standardabvan/e13680575

 

Paul 

https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/standardabvan

 

There was one of these at Peterborough until quite recently,  not sure what happened to it. Odd they didn't fit roller bearings 

[eastwestdivide]

9 minutes ago, russ p said:

 

There was one of these at Peterborough until quite recently,  not sure what happened to it. Odd they didn't fit roller bearings 

By the early 80s. a lot of those air-brake 12T van conversions were in use by the Southern Region's engineers for stores transfers etc, and some got a special livery:

 

[montyburns56]

On 29/08/2021 at 19:07, montyburns56 said:

Engineers Van Doncaster 1978 by John Law

 

 

 

I dunno if this is the same one

 

Tyne Yard 1979

 

 

[Wickham Green too]

1 hour ago, montyburns56 said:

I dunno if this is the same one ....

Unless someone's shortened the chimney and removed the vents, I'd guess that's unlikely ! 

[50A55B]

2 hours ago, montyburns56 said:

 

I dunno if this is the same one

 

Tyne Yard 1979

 

 

Nice Gulf Red duo.

Edited September 7, 2021 by 50A55B
Moving comment location.

[Fat Controller]

14 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

Unless someone's shortened the chimney and removed the vents, I'd guess that's unlikely ! 

Low Fell PW Yard used to have a few of these, along with some GWR 'Toads' used by crane crews.

[jonhall]

On 06/09/2021 at 13:05, jonhall said:

I seem to recall* an article in 'Transport Age' that implied they were not for any old bricks, but dedicated to refractory bricks - used in the lining of furnaces etc - it might be that the greater value and fewer destinations justified specialist wagons? (*only from memory - I'm not in the same place as my magazines for a few days, so I might be wrong).

 

Jon

 

Yes - transport Age No.9 covers the development of Palbricks for refractory bricks in a 5 page article.

 

The whole Transport Age series is available as a scan on CD from the Great Eastern Society - its very interesting for anyone who wants to understand the transport industry (particularly railways) in the 50's and 60's https://www.gersociety.org.uk/index.php/files-emporium-home/transport-age-and-british-transport-review-dvd

 

 

 

Jon 

Edited September 8, 2021 by jonhall

[Fat Controller]

Ordinary house-bricks were often just heaped in open wagons, careful stacking not being cost effective. Any half-bricks would be used instead of cutting bricks. Later, when road transport was used, they'd just use a tipper or drop-side. One of my 'summer jobs' used to be stacking the new bricks, so the van driver could take the requisite amount to site. I'd have been about 8 at the time....

It was preferable to cleaning second-hand bricks with a chipping hammer or chisel.

Prior to WW2, my great-uncle used to receive bricks by rail from one of the local brickworks, which was less than 10 miles away.

[montyburns56]

Not odd in themselves, but these pictures are from 1982

 

"Lion Emulsions 6611, Hereford yard, Dec 1982. These wagons had spent years acting as storage tanks in an old oil/tar suppliers yard in Hereford that still was connected to the rail system and when the yard shut they were moved into Hereford yard!"

 

 

 

 

By Jamerail

[hmrspaul]

From the one similar tank I recorded (Barry and Warrington) these 6xxx numbers were the original numbers when they were owned by SMBP. The TOPS plates reflect the Lion emulsion ownership. https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/lionemulsionstsv

 

Will have to encourage Dapol to do them when the 7mm anchor mount is produced - possibly a good one for Tower to do as they seem to like more unusual one off from Dapol. 

 

Paul 

[Mark Saunders]

On 07/09/2021 at 03:11, Mark Saunders said:

A similar arrangement is used on one of the French built Megafret twin sets.

 

[2mm Andy]

On 06/09/2021 at 20:19, hmrspaul said:

At least 11 standard vans were converted for the early "Air brake network", the precursor of Speedlink, This is the van clearer from the other side https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/standardabvan/e13680575

 

Paul 

https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/standardabvan

 

On 07/09/2021 at 09:26, russ p said:

 

There was one of these at Peterborough until quite recently,  not sure what happened to it. Odd they didn't fit roller bearings 

 

The van from Peterborough has now moved to Peak Rail (it is part of Andrew Briddon's collection);

http://www.ws.rhrp.org.uk/ws/WagonInfo.asp?Ref=16225

 

Andy