Odd wagons of the UK

[Mol_PMB]

7 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

The first one's at the Junction, as it says ..... a good few miles from Limerick.

 

These are, of course the rebuilt cement wagons - they originally has peculiar two-part folding sides with an ingenious winding mechanism on the ends.

 

Note the 'double-deck' wagons in the background : Beet Wagons converted from Mr.Bulleid's open wagons by sticking a second body on top ( less floor ).

 

The hoppers were for ballast, dolomite or gypsum - apart from the number series I don't know what the differences were.

The beet wagons did indeed have two of Bulleid’s corrugated bodies, but not his triangulated chassis. The two bodies were mounted on the chassis of some of CIE’s early 4-wheel ISO container flats, which were vac-fitted. These fell out of use when containers became more than 8’ high, and were replaced with lower-floored variants. 

[montyburns56]

21 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

The first one's at the Junction, as it says ..... a good few miles from Limerick.

 

These are, of course the rebuilt cement wagons - they originally has peculiar two-part folding sides with an ingenious winding mechanism on the ends.

 

Note the 'double-deck' wagons in the background : Beet Wagons converted from Mr.Bulleid's open wagons by sticking a second body on top ( less floor ).

 

 

I kept seeing pictures of the beet wagons in the background of Ernie's pictures of Ireland and was wondering what they were. The funny thing is that virtually every wagon used in Ireland is odd to British eyes. Even their powder cement wagons look weird with their bulbous tanks!

[Wickham Green too]

Them's not 'bulbous tanks'  -  them's 'bubbles' !

 

.... anyway, I knew I had an original bagged cement wagon somewhere : - 

Limerick Junction ; 14/5/89

 

.... and a beet wagon, while I'm about it : - 

Limerick Junction ; 15/5/05

[montyburns56]

3 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

Them's not 'bulbous tanks'  -  them's 'bubbles' !

 

.... anyway, I knew I had an original bagged cement wagon somewhere : - 

Limerick Junction ; 14/5/89

 

 

Man, I can't understand why they would want to get rid of that simple and definitely not vulnerable to damage unloading system....

 

[montyburns56]

Even my limited knowledge suggests that this is a NER bogie wagon?

 

Woodburn 1963

 

 

[BernardTPM]

Yes. Farish made that in their N gauge range in the 1970s/'80s.

Edited August 12, 2021 by BernardTPM

[jwealleans]

NER G7 Road Van.

 

This example built by my good mate Rob Pulham from a D & S kit.

 

[montyburns56]

20 hours ago, BernardTPM said:

Yes. Farish made that in their N gauge range in the 1970s/'80s.

 

What a strange choice of prototype to model! Having said that it seems that they also made a model of a NER bogie sulphate wagon.

 

https://www.hattons.co.uk/13464/graham_farish_373_425_50_ton_bogie_sulphate_wagon_ne/stockdetail.aspx

 

[Wickham Green too]

Technically, that one's LNER.

 

Probably aiming for the American market with bogie wagons.

[BernardTPM]

1 hour ago, montyburns56 said:

What a strange choice of prototype to model! Having said that it seems that they also made a model of a NER bogie sulphate wagon.

https://www.hattons.co.uk/13464/graham_farish_373_425_50_ton_bogie_sulphate_wagon_ne/stockdetail.aspx

Yes, the bogie sulphate came first and the van followed a year or so later, using the same chassis. It might have paid them to have done a bogie bolster on that chassis; in those days being correct down to the last degree wasn't so important. I'm sure they could have found a prototype close to that length.

 

A lot of LNER designs were continuations of NER designs and NER wagons would have been repainted into LNER livery after grouping. They never bothered with the 'L' on wagons, unlike the LMS.

[Invicta]

I had a brief flirtation with N gauge in the early 80's, after my younger brother got a Farish N gauge set as a birthday present, and remember having one of the Sulphate wagons, but don't think we ever had the NER van. 

 

Certainly a quirky couple of choices by RTR standards of the time - even in the present-day world, with the trade releasing things the 80's modeller would never have dreamed of seeing in RTR,  an announcement of the NER bogie van might be seen as a bit left-field.  

 

I'm tempted to wonder if someone in the GF design team of the period was a bit of an LNER wagon enthusiast!

Edited August 13, 2021 by Invicta

[Wickham Green too]

I'm not sure how the LNER's bogie brick wagons would compare on the quirkometer  -  but both Hornby Dublo and Triang had done them many years beforehand.

[Steamport Southport]

Like most manufacturers at the time they probably had the FJ Roche book of drawings.

 

That was the reason Ratio did the one off CR 50 ton bogie wagon. The drawings were readily available.

 

 

 

Jason

[Steamport Southport]

7 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

I'm not sure how the LNER's bogie brick wagons would compare on the quirkometer  -  but both Hornby Dublo and Triang had done them many years beforehand.

 

Useful wagons though.

 

Used as a fitted head for coal trains on the ECML. In a similar way they later used the Diesel Brake Tenders.

 

 

Jason

[BernardTPM]

11 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

I'm not sure how the LNER's bogie brick wagons would compare on the quirkometer  -  but both Hornby Dublo and Triang had done them many years beforehand.

And Trix as well.

[montyburns56]

22 hours ago, Invicta said:

Certainly a quirky couple of choices by RTR standards of the time - even in the present-day world, with the trade releasing things the 80's modeller would never have dreamed of seeing in RTR,  an announcement of the NER bogie van might be seen as a bit left-field.  

 

 

I've always been fascinated with Auchmuty branch from Markinch station and I noticed how the trains to the Tullis Russell paper mill used an odd type of hopper wagon that I'd not seen before. But when I was trying to find out info about it I was amazed that Farish actually made a model of the wagon! I think that only 8 of the real thing were ever made just to serve a single location which makes Farish's decision to model it even more bizarre.

 

 

By Michael J Collins

 

https://www.hattons.co.uk/560114/graham_farish_4512farish_po03_pga_38t_covered_hopper_tullis_russell_pre_owned_imperfect_box/stockdetail.aspx

 

[montyburns56]

Crosfields Demountable Sodium silicate tank Severn Tunnel Junction 1986 by Jamerail

 

 

[hmrspaul]

2 hours ago, montyburns56 said:

 

I've always been fascinated with Auchmuty branch from Markinch station and I noticed how the trains to the Tullis Russell paper mill used an odd type of hopper wagon that I'd not seen before. But when I was trying to find out info about it I was amazed that Farish actually made a model of the wagon! I think that only 8 of the real thing were ever made just to serve a single location which makes Farish's decision to model it even more bizarre.

 

 

By Michael J Collins

 

https://www.hattons.co.uk/560114/graham_farish_4512farish_po03_pga_38t_covered_hopper_tullis_russell_pre_owned_imperfect_box/stockdetail.aspx

 

They were interested in any 'pretty' hopper wagons that there model could approximately reproduce and they saw my photos on Fotopic. IIRC the entire set they did were from my photos - I have a couple of sets of them still boxed. 

 

Paul

https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/tullisrussellpaa

Edited August 14, 2021 by hmrspaul

[BernardTPM]

Yes, the Farish model is fairly approximate. What was unique to it was the swing-top arms on the ends. The roof was shared with a BIS Sand version IIRC. Without the roof there were various aggregate versions.

[hmrspaul]

1 hour ago, BernardTPM said:

Yes, the Farish model is fairly approximate. What was unique to it was the swing-top arms on the ends. The roof was shared with a BIS Sand version IIRC. Without the roof there were various aggregate versions.

Yes, I got a good pay day out of Chris Leigh as he published all 6 prototype photos in an early Model Rail - only thumbnail size. 

 

I meant to add that although there were few of them, they did seem to work hard. Being a unique design they were very noticeable in many train photos of the WCML, West country etc. of that era.

 

Paul

Edited August 14, 2021 by hmrspaul

[big jim]

On 12/06/2021 at 20:40, BernardTPM said:

The caption and comments pretty much point to one of the Tiger POA/PNAs built by C.C. Crump. I'd agree that the tarpauline is unusual.

mill ask my stepdad (mr crump) what the wagon was all about next time I speak to him! 

[Invicta]

On 13/08/2021 at 23:14, Steamport Southport said:

Like most manufacturers at the time they probably had the FJ Roche book of drawings.

 

That was the reason Ratio did the one off CR 50 ton bogie wagon. The drawings were readily available.

 

Jason

Given the total obscurity of the prototype, Ratio must have sold a fair few over the years, bearing in mind how long it's been in their catalogue.  I built my first one in my teens, nearly 40 years ago, and I'm sure I'm not the only modeller to end up with multiples of them- I think I've got either 6 or 8, in states ranging from 'unbuilt kit still in the box', through 'unfinished project' to 'running', including a particularly implausible 1936-style LMS bauxite-liveried version 

 

Edited August 15, 2021 by Invicta

[Steamport Southport]

14 minutes ago, Invicta said:

Given the total obscurity of the prototype, Ratio must have sold a fair few over the years, bearing in mind how long it's been in their catalogue.  I built my first one in my teens, nearly 40 years ago, and I'm sure I'm not the only modeller to end up with multiples of them- I think I've got either 6 or 8, in states ranging from 'unbuilt kit still in the box', through 'unfinished project' to 'running', including a particularly implausible 1936-style LMS bauxite-liveried version 

 

 

I think I've only ever seen one photo of it.

 

https://crassoc.org.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1043

 

I haven't got the Caledonian Wagons book so don't know whether there are any more photos. It's on the list though.

 

 

Jason

[hmrspaul]

55 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

I think I've only ever seen one photo of it.

 

https://crassoc.org.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1043

 

I haven't got the Caledonian Wagons book so don't know whether there are any more photos. It's on the list though.

 

 

Jason

As that link says, if it is a model of the wooden 50tonner then it is unique. There was another prototype and 370 of another design - as in that link as well - steel or iron wagons. 

 

Paul

[ChrisH-UK]

19 hours ago, montyburns56 said:

 

I've always been fascinated with Auchmuty branch from Markinch station and I noticed how the trains to the Tullis Russell paper mill used an odd type of hopper wagon that I'd not seen before. But when I was trying to find out info about it I was amazed that Farish actually made a model of the wagon! I think that only 8 of the real thing were ever made just to serve a single location which makes Farish's decision to model it even more bizarre.

 

It's bright blue and its route took it from Cornwall to Central Scotland on an almost daily basis, so covering three regions and being easily recognisable as it passed so many locations probably downgrades it from bizarre to unusual.