Great Central Railway news

[Dava]

There is a Friends of the GC Main Line committee meeting on 8 Dec and the issue of lineside permits will be raised then, though ultimately it is a safety issue for the GCR Plc. There are many good reasons to be a 'friend' of the premier preserved main line in addition to the photo permit.

 

It's also true that there has been a steady loss of good mainline photo locations near the line in recent years, such as the area around Woodthorpe Lane south of Loughborough where housing has taken over and the 'earth mound' which was a great vantage point has gone.

 

Dava

[Andy Louch]

Dava, thanks for info. Yes, the intensive house building to the south of Loughborough has certainly impacted on what was a 'rural' vantage point! I can see that crowd control might be needed at Kinchley Lane during galas in the future!!

Edited November 21, 2018 by Andy Louch

[Dava]

There are precisely 23 days until existing GCR lineside photopasses will cease to be valid. So if you have one, you can [safely] phot the last runs of 70013 and the Christmas-New Year's Eve trains. After that, back on the platform and the right side of the fence with everyone else. Even 'Steam Railway' says so.

[John Tomlinson]

Well when you look at this person in the photo standing on the sleeper end with his back to any on coming trains https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/lineside-photographic-permits.174196/page-2#post-3765682 and, some of the way the people who are entertaining the photographers with the trains etc are treated I am not surprised they want them gone and most likely the ORR will have seen this photo and taken a very dim view of lineside photo passes (Yes the ORR do look on all these types of forums to keep a check on what is happening). The G&W did talk about restarting them but the ORR good as said to them over our dead body. Also the GCR are so laxed over how people get their lineside photo passes with just a form you have to fill in and some paperwork you should read and a DVD you should watch and to me the DVD is very poor for the safety side against at least one railway where you are in a classroom for three hours and then a test before getting your PTS and your lineside photo pass. 

 

Sorry, who exactly are the ORR, and what is its authority?

 

As a permit holder of many years standing, I'm obviously saddened by this news. The letter sent out notifying of withdrawal was not in my view particularly illuminating, and I suspect there will be no small amount of ill-feeling. Hence it would be good to have as much gen. as possible on the why's and wherefores.

 

As noted above some railways do require a test to be passed before issue, and one of my questions would be why this has not been adopted as an option at the GC?

 

John.

[Chris116]

Sorry, who exactly are the ORR, and what is its authority?

 

Office of Road and Rail formerly Office of the Rail Regulator.

They have the power to close a Heritage line or to stop a company from running on the National Network. When they say jump you ask how far on the way down as West Coast found out a little while ago.

[John Tomlinson]

Office of Road and Rail formerly Office of the Rail Regulator.

They have the power to close a Heritage line or to stop a company from running on the National Network. When they say jump you ask how far on the way down as West Coast found out a little while ago.

 

Many thanks for your prompt response. It would be interesting to know how any conversations between the GCR and OOR have gone, and if this decision is a direct result of what in effect is an ORR instruction. If so the GCR might have been wise to actually say so.

 

One other point to make about the GCR in respect of miscreats. For a number of years now permit holders have been required to wear Hi-vis vests with individual identification in the form of a letter and three numbers. This would be easily visible to a passing driver or fireman, and certainly to a member of staff with a badly behaved individual in front of them. There's no excuse for abuse anywhere - period - but with the ID it should have been simple to revoke the holder's permit immediately. In my experience, the permit holders actually performed a useful policing function, both on each other, and more to the point on casual trespassers who are a real danger to themselves and the railway. It's difficult to see how any preserved railway of any size can be policed effectively by staff, and I wonder if BTP would actually respond if they had a call from a driver reporting trespass on a preserved line.

 

John.

Edited December 8, 2018 by John Tomlinson

[Boris]

Many thanks for your prompt response. It would be interesting to know how any conversations between the GCR and OOR have gone, and if this decision is a direct result of what in effect is an ORR instruction. If so the GCR might have been wise to actually say so.

 

One other point to make about the GCR in respect of miscreats. For a number of years now permit holders have been required to wear Hi-vis vests with individual identification in the form of a letter and three numbers. This would be easily visible to a passing driver or fireman, and certainly to a member of staff with a badly behaved individual in front of them. There's no excuse for abuse anywhere - period - but with the ID it should have been simple to revoke the holder's permit immediately. In my experience, the permit holders actually performed a useful policing function, both on each other, and more to the point on casual trespassers who are a real danger to themselves and the railway. It's difficult to see how any preserved railway of any size can be policed effectively by staff, and I wonder if BTP would actually respond if they had a call from a driver reporting trespass on a preserved line.

 

John.

 

The BTP won't touch it, they only work with railways (read TOCs) with whom they have a service agreement, afaik the NYMR (and possibly the NNR eventually?) have one atm.  The BTP haven't yet prosecuted a trespasser on the NYMR but can do so under the NYMRs bylaws covered by the light railway order, however a number of motorists have been fined or summonsed (?) for level crossing offences.

 

For any other railway you are looking at the local force who will likely offer words of advice as trespass on private land isn't a criminal offence in the UK. although if an agent of the landowner requests you leave and you refuse then you can be removed by the police and charged with (I believe) a breach of the peach.  Good luck finding a copper to remove a trespasser these days, I only managed it once and they happened to be passing and I flagged them down to deal with a guy who was drunk and trespassing.

Edited December 8, 2018 by Boris

[John Tomlinson]

The BTP won't touch it, they only work with railways (read TOCs) with whom they have a service agreement, afaik the NYMR (and possibly the NNR eventually?) have one atm.  The BTP haven't yet prosecuted a trespasser on the NYMR but can do so under the NYMRs bylaws covered by the light railway order, however a number of motorists have been fined or summonsed (?) for level crossing offences.

 

For any other railway you are looking at the local force who will likely offer words of advice as trespass on private land isn't a criminal offence in the UK. although if an agent of the landowner requests you leave and you refuse then you can be removed by the police and charged with (I believe) a breach of the peach.  Good luck finding a copper to remove a trespasser these days, I only managed it once and they happened to be passing and I flagged them down to deal with a guy who was drunk and trespassing.

 

That's very helpful, thanks.

 

So one consequence of this action is that there won't really be any effective policing on operating days. On several occasions I have found myself, usually but not always in the company of others, having words with non-permit holding trespassers, quite often shaming them into going behind the fence, or just clearing off if they were general members of the public.

 

The worst experience I had was two or three years ago on the stretch out of Loughborough before the A6 bridge. Three young children had pushed through the fence - not  difficult - and were making their way towards the track. I shouted at them from the other side of the track to get back and thankfully they did, looking suitably chastened and they stayed out of the way until their parents pitched up some minutes later - after a train had passed. It could have been so different.

 

John.

[Zomboid]

When I had a driver experience on the GCR back in May, there were a couple of kids (teenagers I think) trespassing near Leicester North. Had to hang on the whistle when I saw them and even brake a bit... The proper driver I was with didn't seem particularly perturbed about it, so I figured that kind of thing isn't especially unusual there.

[andyram]

When I had a driver experience on the GCR back in May, there were a couple of kids (teenagers I think) trespassing near Leicester North. Had to hang on the whistle when I saw them and even brake a bit... The proper driver I was with didn't seem particularly perturbed about it, so I figured that kind of thing isn't especially unusual there.

Sadly there are some locals who still see the Leicester North section as a walking route. The single track on a former double track leaves space for what they feel to be a perfect footpath.

[Boris]

When I had a driver experience on the GCR back in May, there were a couple of kids (teenagers I think) trespassing near Leicester North. Had to hang on the whistle when I saw them and even brake a bit... The proper driver I was with didn't seem particularly perturbed about it, so I figured that kind of thing isn't especially unusual there.

It's a regular occurance on a lot of preserved railways, they're steam trains, they can't hurt you you know.  Rule 1 of Preserved Railways "The public are stupid".

[PenrithBeacon]

It's a regular occurance on a lot of preserved railways, they're steam trains, they can't hurt you you know. Rule 1 of Preserved Railways "The public are stupid".

Which attitude is one of the reasons I very seldom visit preserved lines nowadays.

 

In the days when I did I used to have a few trackside permits but I quickly gave them up because most lines have a perfectly adequate number of photospots from which good results can be obtained. One advantage of the GCR giving up its scheme is that there will be no excuse anymore for people to wear those awful orange jackets!

[Boris]

Which attitude is one of the reasons I very seldom visit preserved lines nowadays.

 

In the days when I did I used to have a few trackside permits but I quickly gave them up because most lines have a perfectly adequate number of photospots from which good results can be obtained. One advantage of the GCR giving up its scheme is that there will be no excuse anymore for people to wear those awful orange jackets!

Mate, if you saw the things that I see on a daily basis you'd understand why you have to have eyes in the back of your head!  Every time you think you have seen it all someone else resets the whole scale again, few examples from the past season:

 

1 - Person caught attempting to take a selfie by opening the door on a moving train (25 mph) and "pretending" to fall out

2 - Person fails to understand that they cannot both photograph a train departing from a platform and be on said train at the same time

3 - Person climbs through signal box window because the door says private

4 - Passenger dives in front of moving train, trips and only avoids traumatic leg amputation because the tender guard irons pushed his foot out the way and then attempts to board moving train

5 - Passenger holding child upside down by legs fully out of the window of a moving train

 

This is just what I have recorded since March for gods sake, the great british public in 2018 has no sense of danger and anyone who is safety minded is a jobsworth and a killjoy - right up until the point it all ends in tears then they are the scapegoat.  I'm afraid its a reflection of the society we have in the country at the moment.

 

I do agree with you over the orange vest club, there's far too many people wearing one because its a status symbol ("look at me, I work here") rather than actually needing one.  This year I have seen folks wearing hi-vis to run sales stands, sell fudge and in one case sell guide books on a train.

Edited December 11, 2018 by Boris

[Steamport Southport]

 

3 - Person climbs through signal box window because the door says private

 

 

 

 

I know it's not meant to be funny, but I genuinely laughed when I saw that.

 

 

 

 

Jason

Edited December 11, 2018 by Steamport Southport

[Boris]

 

 

 

I know it's not meant to be funny, but I genuinely laughed when I saw that.

 

 

 

 

Jason

I can't find the photo of the TRB entry for that incident at the moment but it went something along the lines of "Person noted climbing through window at 11:13, said person educated on the correct use of the door and placed on the outermost side of it at 11:15".  It is now referred to as the Spiderman incident as it is about 15 feet straight up from the bottom landing with no hand/footholds to speak of, we still can't work out how the daft sod managed it!

Edited December 12, 2018 by Boris

[Dava]

"The final roster for the GCR Christmas Holiday Trains will be confirmed just prior to the event, but 70013 "Oliver Cromwell" (appearing courtesy of the National Railway Museum) is expected to feature alongside a second locomotive in an all-steam service. Please check this page for the latest news & timetables:"

 

http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/special-events/christmas-holiday-trains-from-26th-december/

 

So, your very last chance to see, ride behind, breakfast with & photograph 70013 in traffic for a few years, at normal prices.

 

The Canal Bridge rebuild is now under way with the lattice sides removed. Fundraising is over £300,000 raised in a year - please keep it coming:

 

http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/unify/

[Neal Ball]

Can’t believe it’s already more than a year since the bridge went over the main line!

[James Harrison]

£300,000 in a year is a really stunning achievement, especially considering how the project really hasn't been publicised to any great degree (compare/ contrast with say the GWSR's Broadway extension and the publicising of that).  Great news that work has started on rejuvenating the bridge; out of interest, how far toward completing the bridge does the £300,000 raised go?  I know the appeal is for a little under £500,000 and that covers both the bridge and the necessary paperwork for the rest of the project; what's the approximate split between the bridge and the paperwork?

[Dava]

There were GCR Bridge appeal leaflets in all the main railway nostalgia/preservation magazines over the summer, as well as regular updates on the GCR website and Railmail which anyone can sign up for. Then the GCR Friends stand and volunteers are out at abut 12 events each year. We're very pleased with progress of the Canal Bridge appeal and well up for raising the rest.

 

We'll be at the GCR Winter Gala on 25-27 January and the Staffordshire model rail ex 2-3 Feb 2019. So quite a lot of marketing effort goes on!

 

How much will the Canal Bridge cost? Contractors' quotes are being obtained but within the budgeted amount is all we can say at present. The planning application will be in X10k and the bridge x100k.

[Neal Ball]

It’s interesting to see how this develops, having stood on the canal bridge in the past.

 

What plans are there for relocating the engine shed? At one time I seem to remember it was going over to a plot of land the railway already owned, using recovered items from a dismantled shed. Whitehaven I think?

 

I would have thought that building needs to start soon on a new running shed / workshop etc. This must present a great opportunity to give the railway a first rate workshop etc.

 

As ever it will be interesting to see how the link develops.

 

Regards, Neal.

[andyram]

It’s interesting to see how this develops, having stood on the canal bridge in the past.

 

What plans are there for relocating the engine shed? At one time I seem to remember it was going over to a plot of land the railway already owned, using recovered items from a dismantled shed. Whitehaven I think?

 

I would have thought that building needs to start soon on a new running shed / workshop etc. This must present a great opportunity to give the railway a first rate workshop etc.

 

As ever it will be interesting to see how the link develops.

 

Regards, Neal.

 

It was Workington shed and the land is not suitable for it from what I understand. The current plan is to keep the shed in its current location and take the track around the side of it before rejoining the original formation.

[Johann Marsbar]

It was Workington shed and the land is not suitable for it from what I understand. The current plan is to keep the shed in its current location and take the track around the side of it before rejoining the original formation.

Latest information given out in the FoGCML newsletter is that the shed is going to be replaced by a building of modern construction, situated to the west of the existing one - ie the other side of the trackbed. The lines to "the north" would then run to the east of the new shed, right through the site where the current building is.

This is said to be the next phase of the reunification work once the canal bridge is finished.

[andyram]

Latest information given out in the FoGCML newsletter is that the shed is going to be replaced by a building of modern construction, situated to the west of the existing one - ie the other side of the trackbed. The lines to "the north" would then run to the east of the new shed, right through the site where the current building is.

This is said to be the next phase of the reunification work once the canal bridge is finished.

 

 

I have not received this newsletter, did not realise things have changed.

[PenrithBeacon]

It was Workington shed and the land is not suitable for it from what I understand. The current plan is to keep the shed in its current location and take the track around the side of it before rejoining the original formation.

IIRC the land was an infill site and hadn't settled enough for building work to start.

[Dava]

Today Mrs Dava & I celebrated an anniversary on the GCR Christmas Jubilee Dining Train. My only suggestion is can they please turn the steam heating on to warm the train before departure as I don't feel you should have to keep your coat on! Otherwise most enjoyable. The catering staff work really hard to make everything a success.

 

Here's Mrs Dava smiling even before her Rothley Steamer Gin Cocktail arrived....

 

 

Back at Loughborough, RBR1962 was gleaming in the winter sun, freshly outshopped from Rothley works in crimson & cream [formerly in the WR liveried set]. This admirable vehicle can rustle up & serve an all-day breakfast in record time so will be welcome back very soon.

 

 

70013 and 45305 were busy on the Santa Specials. They are the rostered locos for the Christmas Holiday Trains from 26 Dec, including the Night Riders on 31 Dec when you can enjoy a pie & chips supper for £5 right up to midnight! So lots of opportunity to ride behind 70013 before its withdrawal from service.

http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/special-events/christmas-holiday-trains-from-26th-december/

 

Dava