Bachmann to produce S Stock for London Transport Museum

[DRS Crewe On A Mission]

The LTM is a charity and thus I would hope they can capitalise on the maximum return of the S-Stock to raise funds for this truly remarkable and extensive collection of the London Underground. I find 10% very generous for a charity. 

 

Sorry I wasn't aware that the LTM was a charity. Well you learn something new every day.

 

In that case 10% off for a charity is very generous.

 

I'm still glad that I bought a four car set from the first batch for £250. As much as I love these tube sets I could not have afforded £340 without the discount from a set from batch two.

 

If you don't mind me asking can anyone sign up to the newsletter? Does this give you 10% off all or selected models? Are their specific times when the 10% discount is on? Or is it on all the time?

 

Thank you very much in advance.

[No Decorum]

Sorry I wasn't aware that the LTM was a charity. Well you learn something new every day.

 

In that case 10% off for a charity is very generous.

 

I'm still glad that I bought a four car set from the first batch for £250. As much as I love these tube sets I could not have afforded £340 without the discount from a set from batch two.

 

If you don't mind me asking can anyone sign up to the newsletter? Does this give you 10% off all or selected models? Are their specific times when the 10% discount is on? Or is it on all the time?

 

Thank you very much in advance.

Sign up and get 10% off your next order. I don’t wish to put words into your mouth but your point might be that irrespective of LT being a deserving charity, not all of us can afford the price. If that is the case, I sympathise and agree.

[hamish_barb]

What warrants the price going up by £70? As I understand, all that has changed are simply the running numbers?

[159220]

Not sure where the £70 figure comes from? Actual increase is £59.99 as previous retail was £280 back in May 2015.

 

Lets not squabble over price increases again, it has been discussed to death on many threads. The arguments have become acutely circular. 

Edited July 14, 2017 by 159220

[DRS Crewe On A Mission]

Sign up and get 10% off your next order. I don’t wish to put words into your mouth but your point might be that irrespective of LT being a deserving charity, not all of us can afford the price. If that is the case, I sympathise and agree.

 

Thank you very much for letting me know. I really appreciate it.

 

So just to clarify that you can only get the 10% off once when you sign up for the newsletter?

 

I completely agree with you. No disrespect to LTM or any other deserving charity but for me personally £340 without any discount is too much to pay. With the discount however this would make the model £306 which is more appealing but still quite a high price. The 10% off may tempt me if and when I have some more money.

 

Just out of interest does anyone know the running numbers of the two new four car sets?

 

There is only one picture on the LTM website of each set and you can't zoom in.

 

Also does anyone know what the destination boards say?

 

Thank you very much in advance.

[DRS Crewe On A Mission]

What warrants the price going up by £70? As I understand, all that has changed are simply the running numbers?

 

A couple of years ago I posted similar comments regarding price increases.

 

Whilst us as customers don't want price increases we have to accept them and be prepared to pay them if we want to see such fantastic models produced with a wealth of attention and detail. Some of the reasons for increased prices are: significant increases in production costs, increases in staff wages in China where the models are produced and increased costs in transport and shipping. Adding all of these costs together I'm not surprised that Bachmann have had to increase their prices. If not they would be producing models at a loss, which in the long term means a financially unstable and unsustainable business. This is not to mention the fall in the pound in the last year or so and another factor that should be considered is that this second batch of two four car sets have been produced two years after the first batch in 2015. In two years their are bound to be some price increases.

 

But the models that Bachmann and many other manufacturers are producing now are of a very high quality. Personally I think it's worth paying the higher prices for a better model which without a price increase wouldn't be able to be produced in the first place.  

[Southernman46]

Think I'll wait for the R stock next year ......................

[Horsetan]

A couple of years ago I posted similar comments regarding price increases.

 

Whilst us as customers don't want price increases we have to accept them and be prepared to pay them .....

 

...or perhaps hold off buying them until sale / clearance prices are announced?

[DRS Crewe On A Mission]

...or perhaps hold off buying them until sale / clearance prices are announced?

 

I'm not sure that LTM do any clearance prices as such. They do the 10% discount when you sign up to their newsletter and on certain days, weekends and bank holidays they also offer 10% off. I know this because I get the emails through. I have had a few recently but their wasn't anything that I wanted to buy.

 

I don't recall any clearance prices on the last batch of tube sets in 2015, although I could be wrong.

 

After the latest tube sets have had their 10% discount knocked off of the original price of £340 which takes the price down to £306 I would be very surprised if their was anymore discount on these models. I could be wrong but as has been mentioned above LTM are a charity and no doubt they want to sell the models for as much as what they can.

 

We will have to wait and see.

[metropolitan cammell]

The last batch were in the new year 20% off sale.

[No Decorum]

Thank you very much for letting me know. I really appreciate it.

 

So just to clarify that you can only get the 10% off once when you sign up for the newsletter?

 

I completely agree with you. No disrespect to LTM or any other deserving charity but for me personally £340 without any discount is too much to pay. With the discount however this would make the model £306 which is more appealing but still quite a high price. The 10% off may tempt me if and when I have some more money.

 

Just out of interest does anyone know the running numbers of the two new four car sets?

 

There is only one picture on the LTM website of each set and you can't zoom in.

 

Also does anyone know what the destination boards say?

 

Thank you very much in advance.

10% off your next order, it says. Announcement tomorrow, so we may be told more then.

 

Metropolitan cammell said that there was a New Year offer of 20% off, so perhaps if you do without that case of single malt that you were going to consume, you might be in luck.

[DRS Crewe On A Mission]

The last batch were in the new year 20% off sale.

 

Thank you very much for posting this and for letting me know. I really appreciate it.

 

Maybe then, just maybe if their are still some left over after Christmas they will be reduced by 20%. That would make these latest four car sets £272. That would be much more appealing. It could be worth holding off then and seeing what happens later on in the year.

 

Once again thank you very much for posting this information. It's very good to know.

[DRS Crewe On A Mission]

10% off your next order, it says. Announcement tomorrow, so we may be told more then.

 

Metropolitan cammell said that there was a New Year offer of 20% off, so perhaps if you do without that case of single malt that you were going to consume, you might be in luck.

 

Thank you very much for letting me know. I really appreciate it.

 

I will look forward to reading the announcement tomorrow. As I am in no rush to acquire a second four car set I am definitely going to wait until later on this year/after Christmas to see if the price is reduced further than 10%. That's if their are any left. If not I am very happy with the set that I have.

[Patrick Blake]

The two new 4 Car sets consist of number 21059 - 21060 and 21105 - 21106.

The Destination boards are not different.

In summary, the Model is your same S8 like the one released in 2015. This time, no intermediate cars come included, this is due to the large number of unsold cars the LTM was left with from before.

The prices are steep, though this is in part explained in an earlier comment someone made.

However, this model was never really good value for money. What sold it was the superb accuracy and detail. Not much else.

At the time, buyers like myself believed it was worth purchasing one as it was seen as a one off limited edition model.

Now it's back, and the best the LTM they could do is increase their price and not listen to customer suggestions.

My final verdict is that people have a reason to be annoyed.

[Roy Langridge]

However, this model was never really good value for money. What sold it was the superb accuracy and detail. Not much else.

At the time, buyers like myself believed it was worth purchasing one as it was seen as a one off limited edition model.

Now it's back, and the best the LTM they could do is increase their price and not listen to customer suggestions.

My final verdict is that people have a reason to be annoyed.

What feedback was given? And why did you believe it to be a limited edition - I have never seen anything saying that.

 

Roy

Edited July 6, 2017 by Roy Langridge

[159220]

 At the time, buyers like myself believed it was worth purchasing one as it was seen as a one off limited edition model.

 

This was never stated, actually the complete opposite was stated. The LTM stated that the S-Stock was chosen as it was a new design of underground train to take over the Metropolitan, District, Circle and Hammersmith lines for the next 35 years. As such the model would find itself suitable to future livery variation. 

Edited July 14, 2017 by 159220

[Horsetan]

Thank you very much for posting this and for letting me know. I really appreciate it.

 

Maybe then, just maybe if their are still some left over after Christmas they will be reduced by 20%. That would make these latest four car sets £272. That would be much more appealing. It could be worth holding off then and seeing what happens later on in the year.

 

Once again thank you very much for posting this information. It's very good to know.

See? I told you so....

[bart2day]

What feedback was given? And why did you believe it to be a limited edition - I have never seen anything saying that.

Roy

It was stated in the August/September 2015 issue of Model Rail magazine (can't remember exactly which month), that they were a limited edition of 1000 and that they may sell out before their release on 2nd October. Obviously this was untrue.

 

Feedback was given on such issues such as the trailer car bodies being slightly higher above the chassis than the intermediate cars. I bet my bottom dollar they have done nothing to change this on the rerelease which for a £340 train is not acceptable in my opinion.

 

Other liveries are, of course another matter, but to be frank this is effectively the same train with the same livery as almost two years ago so nothing limited about it, contrary to what was initially announced by certain sources.

Edited July 7, 2017 by bart2day

[Roy Langridge]

It was stated in the August/September 2015 issue of Model Rail magazine (can't remember exactly which month), that they were a limited edition of 1000 and that they may sell out before their release on 2nd October. Obviously this was untrue.

 

Feedback was given on such issues such as the trailer car bodies being slightly higher above the chassis than the intermediate cars. I bet my bottom dollar they have done nothing to change this on the rerelease which for a £340 train is not acceptable in my opinion.

 

Other liveries are, of course another matter, but to be frank this is effectively the same train with the same livery as almost two years ago so nothing limited about it, contrary to what was initially announced by certain sources.

Sorry, you are having a laugh aren't you? So you are saying that they can never do another run of the same livery (the most common) again with a different number? Well that approach would kill pretty much most models from all manufacturers. The only thing I saw was that there was a special certificate for the first 250 ordered.

 

As for the fault, you don't know and are guessing. So as for ignoring feedback, you actually have got no basis yet for that statement.

 

Roy

Edited July 7, 2017 by Roy Langridge

[jonhall]

It was stated in the August/September 2015 issue of Model Rail magazine (can't remember exactly which month), that they were a limited edition of 1000 and that they may sell out before their release on 2nd October. Obviously this was untrue.

 

Feedback was given on such issues such as the trailer car bodies being slightly higher above the chassis than the intermediate cars. I bet my bottom dollar they have done nothing to change this on the rerelease which for a £340 train is not acceptable in my opinion.

 

Other liveries are, of course another matter, but to be frank this is effectively the same train with the same livery as almost two years ago so nothing limited about it, contrary to what was initially announced by certain sources.

 

They is a rumor doing the rounds (and it comes from a very credible source) that this is in fact remainder of the SAME batch of trains that didn't sell, and have been off to be re-numbered by the outfit that do their bus customisation (which LTM do a lot of, because they issue a new Routemaster every year). So if you bought one of the first edition due to its limited production, they have now increased its value because there are no longer as many! The increase in cost may well just be the LTM passing on the cost of the re-finishing to the customer.

 

Jon

[DRS Crewe On A Mission]

I could be completley wrong but did the first people to pre-order or buy the first four car set released in 2015 get a Limited Edition certificate with their model? I think these were the same people that got to actually travel on one of the S Stock sets.

 

However to my knowledge it wasn't stated anywhere that the first batch in 2015 would be the first, last and one and only batch.

 

If this was the case surely it wouldn't have been financailly viable for Bachmann to produce them in the first place considering that the whole set is brand new tooling for both the driving cars and the immediate cars.

 

I personally welcome these two new sets, even though I may not buy either of them because I can't afford them. It gives others a chance if they are willing to pay the increased price to acquire a set or two. To my knowledge a couple of teething issues have been reported which have been to do with the slow power up inclines or gradients on layouts and the fact that the height of the driving cars and immediate cars is different. However, apart from these minor niggles I would say they are fantastic models, with superb new tooling and the livery and finish is excellent.

 

Despite the couple of minor niggles I would say another excellent release by Bachmann.

[DRS Crewe On A Mission]

See? I told you so....

 

I just can't help myself  

[bart2day]

Sorry, you are having a laugh aren't you? So you are saying that they can never do another run of the same livery (the most common) again with a different number? Well that approach would kill pretty much most models from all manufacturers. The only thing I saw was that there was a special certificate for the first 250 ordered.

As for the fault, you don't know and are guessing. So as for ignoring feedback, you actually have got no basis yet for that statement.

Roy

No I am not joking and you shouldn't be so patronising. I am entitled to my opinion as are you. I am saying they can do another run with the same livery if they want to, just that I disagree strongly with a £60 price increase and that a rerelease somewhat goes against the original press release made by LTM saying they were limited. I was repeatedly told by LTM staff as well as mentioned in the September issue of Model Rail that they expected to sell out before they were even shipped.

 

Yes I do know the fault as I own a set and have seen many others complaining of similar height disparities on this and other forums, one of whose stated they would return the model because of it. DRS Crewe on a mission has also just mentioned that it was reported, as well as a gradient issue.

Edited July 7, 2017 by bart2day

[big jim]

Puts me in mind of the kernow ltd ed shanks 66, that got released in the main range a few years later with a couple of extra logos on the side to make it different from the ltd ed model

[DRS Crewe On A Mission]

This is just an idea but could LTM be selling the latest two four car sets for £340 in the hope that tourists will buy them?

 

After all this would fit in with what 159220 said in the original comment regearding the release of these models on the previous page.

 

Perhaps they are priced significantly higher in the hope that tourists will buy them at whatever the cost. After all tourists that visit London have undoubtedly got money to spend and what better idea to spend it on than a collectors item/memrobellia. After all they are very nice sets and no doubt anyone that was to see them in the flesh on display at the LTM shop would agree. Also the tourists are classed as passing trade as they are visiting the capital/area. They therefore probably wouldn't know about the LTM website in which models can also be purchased through.

 

My guess is the target market for these models in the latest batch are tourists. It is July now and the start of summer time. No doubt July and August are very busy and popular months for tourists to visit the capital. It seems more than a coincidence that these have just been released and are today supposed to be announced.

 

I would think that after the summer and closer to the end of the year and maybe after Christmas their will be a significant reduction in price, if their are any of these sets left. That gives a big second opportunity to sell the models after the summer because people would most likely buy them as Christmas presents.

 

Again just my own thoughts and opinions. I could be wrong.