londonbus Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Dear collective wisdom of the RMweb. I have searched for the answer to this and had some conflicting advice so I wanted to post in the signalling forum to see if there are other views or if I can shed some light. I might use the wrong terminology but i've been on a steep learning curve and i've reached an altitude where the air is thin and i'm a bit delirious. All and every scrap of help would be very well received. The above picture are the LNER type double lens signals at Leicester Central. The one on the right controls the southern end "Up" line. The left hand one controls the exit from bay 3. Leicester Central was dotted with various different types of signalling from semaphore to one lens, multiple aspect searchlight, "normal" 3 aspect light signals and these above with two lenses. QU: What combinations of colour aspect would these signals show? One school of thought is that they are early 4-aspect signals - the upper lamp seems to have no ability to change, therefore is just on / off (yellow?). Another school of thought suggests they mirror the semaphore signals mimicking a home and distant signal. The combinations might (or might not) be: A or B Any answers please.. just for fun. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 These are two Metropolitan Vickers GRS searchlight signals The bottom aspect can show red/yellow/green and the top only yellow. One now exists as Swithland Sidings up distant but only displays yellow/double yellow/green. The surround of the right hand signal has been trimmed back somewhat. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailWest Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 The symbol for the upper aspect represents a yellow which is NOT the 'normal' aspect (single bar), so therefore would normally be unlight. The symbol for the bottom aspect represents an aspect which could show either red, yellow or green, with red defined as the normal lit aspect (double bar). So yes, what you have IMHO is a 3-aspect R/G/Y 'searchlight' with a separate upper lamp to provide YY when necessary - your combination 'A'. Incidentally, any combination other than a single red is a 'proceed', not just the green. If it was an attempt to replicate a semaphore stop+distant (rather like the GWR system), then the 'distant' equivalent would have been at the bottom rather than the top. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
londonbus Posted August 30, 2015 Author Share Posted August 30, 2015 These are two Metropolitan Vickers GRS searchlight signals The bottom aspect can show red/yellow/green and the top only yellow. One now exists as Swithland Sidings up distant but only displays yellow/double yellow/green. The surround of the right hand signal has been trimmed back somewhat. Thanks for the quick reply and the info LNERGE, I was up for the Woodford Halse Weekend and this whole question became a bit of an obsession when I saw the searchlight at Quorn & Woodhouse. So this Leicester signal would have shown double yellow, much as a modern day four aspect signal does? In addition to red, single yellow and green? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
londonbus Posted August 30, 2015 Author Share Posted August 30, 2015 The symbol for the upper aspect represents a yellow which is NOT the 'normal' aspect (single bar), so therefore would normally be unlight. The symbol for the bottom aspect represents an aspect which could show either red, yellow or green, with red defined as the normal lit aspect (double bar). So yes, what you have IMHO is a 3-aspect R/G/Y 'searchlight' with a separate upper lamp to provide YY when necessary - your combination 'A'. Incidentally, any combination other than a single red is a 'proceed', not just the green. If it was an attempt to replicate a semaphore stop+distant (rather like the GWR system), then the 'distant' equivalent would have been at the bottom rather than the top. Great, thanks Railwest, I was replying to the previous answer as you posted, but seems like we've nailed it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Thanks for the quick reply and the info LNERGE, I was up for the Woodford Halse Weekend and this whole question became a bit of an obsession when I saw the searchlight at Quorn & Woodhouse. So this Leicester signal would have shown double yellow, much as a modern day four aspect signal does? In addition to red, single yellow and green? Yes it would have sat normally at red and was cleared to yellow by the south box. i suspect it was cleared to double yellow by the next signal ahead though i don't know if that was the outer home for Goods North or the Passenger South's starter. When the distant below this signal was cleared the searchlight would have gone to green. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 A quick search shows the signal ahead to be Passenger North's up starter No12.. http://www.s-r-s.org.uk/html/lner/E359.gif Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 And please excuse my rubbish about the disc. This plan show's it read into the up siding.. http://www.s-r-s.org.uk/html/lner/E360.gif Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
londonbus Posted August 30, 2015 Author Share Posted August 30, 2015 It all makes sense now. That ground signal is marked on the Signalling Record Society hand drawn plan (the north end), and it does of course lead into the siding. I'm building an approximation of the real thing in OO, it might be a bit of a compromise but at least the signalling will be correct! I have identified suppliers or kits (MSE, Ratio and Eckon) for all the signals, Signalist (Paul Harman) is sending over the Metro-Vic GRS (two lamp) searchlight signals and BLMA models in the US are supplying the single lamp searchlight. Case closed. Many thanks all round. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Good luck with the layout. I got a thick ear as a kid over this place. The old couple over the road worked at a bookbinders. Main Line Lament was produced in the factory where they worked. I was given it as a present in possibly 1978? Fascinated by the pictures of Leicester Central in dereliction is asked mum to get me up early to cycle to Leicester to see it. This she duly did and packed me off with a bottle of pop and sandwich at seven on a Sunday morning. I made it there around 16:00. after an all too brief look at the Great Central i realised i'd never get home in daylight. A phone call to an astonished mum and she had to go to the local station to pay my train fare home. She had to admit i did tell her where i was going but thought i'd rum out of steam long before i got there and would turn back. Can you imagine a twelve year old doing this now? Mine certainly wont. And the old couple over the road? they are still the old couple over the road. Heading into their 90's now but still going strong and still remember the book that started my interest in the GC. Edit to add.. That cycle ride was around 90 odd miles. I remember being very sore the next day (from the ear downwards). 9 miles now and i'm ready for a snooze. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
londonbus Posted August 30, 2015 Author Share Posted August 30, 2015 My 14 year old hasn't cycled 90 miles in his life. I used to live next to the line, well the trackbed very near Helmdon in the 1970/80's. I can remember walking up there between Helmdon and Culworth frequently, still in good condition at the time and once finding a spoon that had been thrown out of a window- it had GCR engraved on it. So had been there a very long time. Main Line Lament is stil the best book on the GCR i've found. The binding is particularly good. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 I used to cycle Letchworth to St Ives and back in a day when my sister lived there and think nothing of it. I can't do it now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
62613 Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 The original colour-light signals at Newcastle Central were similar to this, weren't they? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted September 6, 2015 Share Posted September 6, 2015 A quick search shows the signal ahead to be Passenger North's up starter No12.. http://www.s-r-s.org.uk/html/lner/E359.gif And please excuse my rubbish about the disc. This plan show's it read into the up siding.. http://www.s-r-s.org.uk/html/lner/E360.gif "Forbidden You do not have permission to access this document." Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted September 7, 2015 Share Posted September 7, 2015 "Forbidden You do not have permission to access this document." I'm getting that too now for some reason. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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