Jump to content
 

Please use M,M&M only for topics that do not fit within other forum areas. All topics posted here await admin team approval to ensure they don't belong elsewhere.

GWR trademark


Zoe

Recommended Posts

As most will know, FGW has now been renamed GWR and after looking on the government intellectual property website, it can  be seen that First Greater Western Ltd have trademarked GWR.  Does this just cover the logo or does it cover any use of the letters GWR in the context or rail transport?  If the latter is the case then could legal action be taken against a model railway or heritage railway for trademark infringement?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Details of the trademark, what it applies to and in what areas of business here:

https://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00003064468

 

Short version: it's the logo with the big W in the middle, filed in July 2014, for business including "Rail transportation services" and a number of other areas including badges, jewellery, alcoholic drinks, and "meat, fish, poultry and game" (!)

 

Extra edit, a GWR shirtbutton logo trademark is held by the Science Museum (SCMG Enterprises Limited), covering household or kitchen utensils and containers etc, and precious metals and jewellery etc.

https://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00002636701

Link to post
Share on other sites

I read once that it was the ex Great Central enginemen at Woodford Halse who christened the GWR "Gas Works Railway" and who commented upon inspecting a GWR loco "Look at that Boiler, held up at the front with a couple of broomsticks" !!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Brit15

Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Short version: it's the logo with the big W in the middle, filed in July 2014, for business including "Rail transportation services" and a number of other areas including badges, jewellery, alcoholic drinks, and "meat, fish, poultry and game" (!)

 

 

That may, on the face of it, seem mildly bizarre. But it is, of course, to ensure that they, and they alone, can use it on their catering services.

Link to post
Share on other sites

That may, on the face of it, seem mildly bizarre. But it is, of course, to ensure that they, and they alone, can use it on their catering services.

Yes, it's in one of those catch-all categories - I was cherry-picking for comedy value.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

Not being a user of the West of England mainline, I was wondering what this talk of a trademarked GWR logo referred to.  For those, like me, who had not seen this logo, it is the one with the big 'W' reproduced below.

 

We need not be shy about posting this image; trademark infringement occurs when a protected mark is used on or in connection with goods or services in a manner likely to cause confusion, deception or mistake about source of the goods/services.  Clearly, when one posts the image on a railway enthusiast's website to illustrate a new livery or otherwise comment, there is no question of infringement. However, if lots of people suddenly start trying to buy railway tickets from Andy York, I'll revise that opinion.

 

I rather like this logo.  The font is evocative of the old GWR in Grouping days, yet it is new and fresh.  

 

Now, if anyone tried to claim intellectual property and exclusivity over the original shirtbutton design, that would be annoying!

post-25673-0-17008500-1443690240.png

post-25673-0-68034000-1443690253.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Now, if anyone tried to claim intellectual property and exclusivity over the original shirtbutton design, that would be annoying!

 

As has already been pointed out in this thread, the Science Museum Group has already trademarked it for things that might loosely be described as "merchandise" - the sort of things you might buy in a museum gift shop. But that doesn't apply to its use in transport (eg, on a real railway) or in railway modelling.

Link to post
Share on other sites

For comparison, here is the exact logo registered by the Science Museum people (from the link in my earlier post):

post-6971-0-27394700-1443698169.jpg

 

Seems to me that the width of the white border between the circle and the letters is different to that posted above.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

Edwardian wrote:

 

 

We need not be shy about posting this image; trademark infringement occurs when a protected mark is used on or in connection with goods or services in a manner likely to cause confusion, deception or mistake about source of the goods/services. ​

 

Unquote

 

 

I think that may be a rather narrow view.  The Accor hotel group successfully sued a number of model makers who produced Wagon Lits (specifically CIWL) coaches and crests.  I doubt that there would be any confusion, deception or mistake about the source of the goods.  Accor nevertheless won for copywrite and or trademark infringement.   To add salt to the wound, they were using without acknowledgement pictures of models of one of the companies they sued to advertise the VSOE.

Link to post
Share on other sites

For comparison, here is the exact logo registered by the Science Museum people (from the link in my earlier post):

attachicon.gifGB50000000002636701.jpg

 

Seems to me that the width of the white border between the circle and the letters is different to that posted above.

If someone used the original GWR logo though, would the width of the border be enough for a court to rule it not to be infringing the trademark registered by the Science Mueseum?

Link to post
Share on other sites

If someone used the original GWR logo though, would the width of the border be enough for a court to rule it not to be infringing the trademark registered by the Science Mueseum?

 

No. Broadly speaking (it's a lot more complex when you get into the fine grain of the detail, but that's not really relevant here), if an image is similar enough to a registered trademark that the average person would think it's the same, then as far as the law is concerned it is the same. The actual legislation uses the term "identical or similar" with respect to determining if infringement has taken place.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The other issue to consider with the original logo is copyright.  I have heard arguments before that some logos would not have sufficient artistic creation to qualify for copyright but the London Underground logo uses two simple geometric shapes and TfL say it is subject to copyright:  https://tfl.gov.uk/info-for/suppliers-and-contractors/logo-requests

 

 


strict rules exist about how the roundel can be implemented, and copyright exists on its reproduction.

Link to post
Share on other sites

For comparison, here is the exact logo registered by the Science Museum people (from the link in my earlier post):

attachicon.gifGB50000000002636701.jpg

 

Seems to me that the width of the white border between the circle and the letters is different to that posted above.

At one time (I remember it in the '60's) the Goodmayes Wheelers Cycling Club from Essex used the same design as a club badge - but without the 'R'.  First time I saw it I was slightly confused!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...