Peter Kazmierczak Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 Just been doing a little delving into loco allocations. Why do some sheds only have one of a certain class allocated? Take the ex-GW Manors as an example. On 1st July 1957 the 30 locos were nominally allocated as follows: Carmarthen = 5 Chester (GW) = 5 Laira = 3 Machynlleth = 3 Gloucester = 2 Newton Abbot = 2 Shrewsbury = 2 Tyseley = 2 Croes Newydd = 1 Hereford = 1 Oswestry = 1 St Blazey = 1 Truro = 1 Worcester = 1 Why only one example at some sheds? If they're needed for a particular duty, what happens when they're away being repaired? (Edited as I can't count.....) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
br2975 Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 Perhaps, and this is pure conjecture, they sometimes worked a shared diagram e.g. The Croes Newydd loco worked a daily freight to Oswestry, but it was too long a working for an out and back working; so the balancing working in the diagram e.g. Oswestry - Croes Newydd was worked by the Oswestry loco, then both worked home on the following day's working. . Just a thought on my part, as with the Manors you have reasonably close sheds, such as Hereford & Worcester, Croes Newydd & Oswestry and St.Blazey and Truro; but probably total b*ll*cks on my part !!!. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianusa Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 Just been doing a little delving into loco allocations. Why do some sheds only have one of a certain class allocated? Take the ex-GW Manors as an example. On 1st July 1957 the 30 locos were nominally allocated as follows: Carmarthen = 5 Chester (GW) = 5 Laira = 3 Machynlleth = 3 Gloucester = 2 Newton Abbot = 2 Shrewsbury = 2 Tyseley = 2 Croes Newydd = 1 Hereford = 1 Oswestry = 1 St Blazey = 1 Truro = 1 Worcester = 1 Why only one example at some sheds? If they're needed for a particular duty, what happens when they're away being repaired? (Edited as I can't count.....) A similar response like the above; there are five Manors allocated West of Exeter which was probably more than enough for trains up from Cornwall, etc. They were popular pilot engines on the Devon banks and Newton was about the limit for a PZ working. Up on one trip , down on t'other and vice versa.. Brian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted October 31, 2015 Author Share Posted October 31, 2015 Or were locos allocated more on a district basis? Thus with the Manors we get: 81 = nil 82 = nil 83 = 7 84 = 10 85 = 4 86 = nil 87 = 5 88 = nil 89 = 4 Was the district more important than any particular shed? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Clive Mortimore Posted October 31, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 31, 2015 Hi Peter What are the allocations at the same time of similar powered locos, for example, Granges, 43xx/73xx, and BR class 4 4-6-0s. Would these have shared diagrams? On the LMR the duty would call for a 8P passenger loco, it could be a Duchess or a Princess or be unlucky and have the Duke of Gloucester. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bike2steam Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 All under the weird, and wonderful workings of area operations departments, similar to post #4 Peter. Where's Mike('stationmaster') when yer want him ?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
br2975 Posted October 31, 2015 Share Posted October 31, 2015 What are the allocations at the same time of similar powered locos, for example, Granges, 43xx/73xx, and BR class 4 4-6-0s. Would these have shared diagrams? On the LMR the duty would call for a 8P passenger loco, it could be a Duchess or a Princess or be unlucky and have the Duke of Gloucester. Or could the minimal allocations be down to 'route availability' instead of 'power class' ? . "Lord Sugar's search for an answer continues" . Brian R Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted October 31, 2015 Author Share Posted October 31, 2015 I had thought about the Standard Cl.4 4-6-0s. WR examples on the same date (1/7/57) were: Oswestry = 6 Canton = 5 Swindon = 4 Oxford = 3 Gloucester = 1 Swansea Victoria = 1 Some overlap at Oswestry and Gloucester, but not elsewhere. Perhaps I need to look at the whole allocation of WR 4-6-0s? Is this sort of thing of interest to anyone? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted October 31, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 31, 2015 All under the weird, and wonderful workings of area operations departments, similar to post #4 Peter. Where's Mike('stationmaster') when yer want him ?? You called. I think Brian is already getting to part of the answer. In some cases there might well have been balanced lodging turns where two depots shared the work and worked the opposite depot's job on the second day although that would not account for very many and is really a 'might have been'. In other cases I reckon they were there because they were there - there was a turn for which they were suitable but it was not far off suitable for other types so coverage wasn't difficult. The third answer - seemingly more common than might be thought - was a matter of 'paper allocations' on a particular date. This worked two ways - in some an engine available/spare on a District/Motive Power Division (the terms are date related in the steam era but mean the same) could be allocated and sent to a shed to fill a gap or help cover seasonal traffic simply because it happened to be available and was vaguely suitable and could manage the work needing to be covered (don't forget the date Peter gave is Summer timetable period). And in other instances the allocation was literally only on paper and the engine never went anywhere near the shed it was allocated to but that shed still had the correct number of engines allocated. To get at a fuller picture the real answer lies in the engine diagrams but even checking allocations over succeeding 4 week periods would probably show up 'book allocations' which never took effect. And also bear in mind the practical effects - the loading difference between a 'Grange' and a 'Hall' was usually nothing, the difference between them and a 'Manor' on the heavier graded routes was roughly equivalent to 1 or 2 coaches while the difference between a 'Manor' and 43XX mogul was, again, nothing. Thus there were overlaps in terms of train loading which gave a bit more flexibility when engines were in short supply and equally if a bigger engine wasn't available it would either be accepted that train would lose time running with a smaller one or the load would be reduced. And if an engine was stopped for a washout or other minor attention providing a temporary substitute from another class wasn't impossible. Which of course begs the question about why have a number of different types of similar power? The answer to that lies in the history books but is relatively simple (and probably mainly down to Charles Collett and the running department). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Pannier Tank Posted October 31, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 31, 2015 On the LMR the duty would call for a 8P passenger loco, it could be a Duchess or a Princess or be unlucky and have the Duke of Gloucester. Shouldn't the unlucky choice have been an EE Type 4 ! ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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