Which EMGS Axles?

[Quarryscapes]

I am a member of the EMGS, and am aware it's possible to swap Bachmann 00 axles for their own - but they do many and varied and don't actually say what they're for! 

 

Anyone know which I'd need for Panniers, Ivatt 2-6-0 2MT, Collett Goods and maybe the Dukedog? (I don't think the last one can be done that way though)

 

Also the Hornby 4MT 4-6-0 - anybody done that?

[philsandy]

Are you going to change the wheels also?

If so for Bachmann locos you  would need the 3mm x 22.4mm axles. (390A  R4D4) I would think Hornbys also use these.

 

I converted three Bachmanns, a 3MT & two 4MT Standard tanks by using the original Bachmann wheels.

I reduced the wheel flanges by 0.3mm to give a flange width of 0.5mm, (but check first, Bachmann flanges do vary in width) and then used EMGS shouldered axles 3mm x 2mm. (5905 R5D2)  I found this an easier way of converting, especially for locos with valve gear.

 

METHOD I USED:

 

I rolled a file around the 2mm dia. axle stubs to put a knurl on to give a tighter fit.

Reduced the wheel flanges by 0.3mm.

Used Araldite to glue the Bachmann plastic bushes in to the wheel hubs.

 

The problem then was because these bushes have a shoulder (about 0.5mm thick) and the 3mm part of the axle is 16mm long, this would give a B2B of about 17mm.

I filed them off flush with the back of the wheel hub. Then made some 2mm washers from 0.25 mm thick plastic sheet for the axle stubs . 

The wheels could then be pressed on to the axles right up to the shoulder to give the correct B2B of 16.5mm, and the plastic washers would also ensure insulation between axle and wheels.

[polybear]

Have you checked the EMGS Manual for information - there's lots regarding loco conversions in there.

HTH

Brian

[Quarryscapes]

Are you going to change the wheels also?

If so for Bachmann locos you  would need the 3mm x 22.4mm axles. (390A  R4D4) I would think Hornbys also use these.

 

I converted three Bachmanns, a 3MT & two 4MT Standard tanks by using the original Bachmann wheels.

I reduced the wheel flanges by 0.3mm to give a flange width of 0.5mm, (but check first, Bachmann flanges do vary in width) and then used EMGS shouldered axles 3mm x 2mm. (5905 R5D2)  I found this an easier way of converting, especially for locos with valve gear.

 

METHOD I USED:

 

I rolled a file around the 2mm dia. axle stubs to put a knurl on to give a tighter fit.

Reduced the wheel flanges by 0.3mm.

Used Araldite to glue the Bachmann plastic bushes in to the wheel hubs.

 

The problem then was because these bushes have a shoulder (about 0.5mm thick) and the 3mm part of the axle is 16mm long, this would give a B2B of about 17mm.

I filed them off flush with the back of the wheel hub. Then made some 2mm washers from 0.25 mm thick plastic sheet for the axle stubs . 

The wheels could then be pressed on to the axles right up to the shoulder to give the correct B2B of 16.5mm, and the plastic washers would also ensure insulation between axle and wheels.

 

Cheers for that, I intend to keep the existing wheels.I can't actually remember if I have ordered Ultrascale conversion wheels for the 2251 or not though! 

 

I could of course just make the axles on the lathe, but since products already exist it would be a shame not to use them! 

[philsandy]

Cheers for that, I intend to keep the existing wheels.I can't actually remember if I have ordered Ultrascale conversion wheels for the 2251 or not though! 

 

I could of course just make the axles on the lathe, but since products already exist it would be a shame not to use them! 

 

If you are going to use the existing wheels and you have access to a lathe I would be inclined to make the 3mm/2mm shouldered axles.

 

I am having some made at the moment similar to EMGS axles but with 2 modifications.

The 3mm diameter part being 15.5mm in length instead of 16mm. This allows you to use the Bachmann plastic wheel bushes as they are, and no plastic 2mm washers are needed. When the wheels are pressed on to the 2mm stubs right up to the shoulder you will automatically have the correct B2B of 16.5mm.

Also the 2mm dia. stubs on the EMGS tend to be a tad to under size, ideally they need to be 2.05 to 2.1 mm diameter to make the wheel a tighter fit on the axle stub. 

I have a drawing of the modified axle if you need it.

[Quarryscapes]

If you are going to use the existing wheels and you have access to a lathe I would be inclined to make the 3mm/2mm shouldered axles.

 

I am having some made at the moment similar to EMGS axles but with 2 modifications.

The 3mm diameter part being 15.5mm in length instead of 16mm. This allows you to use the Bachmann plastic wheel bushes as they are, and no plastic 2mm washers are needed. When the wheels are pressed on to the 2mm stubs right up to the shoulder you will automatically have the correct B2B of 16.5mm.

Also the 2mm dia. stubs on the EMGS tend to be a tad to under size, ideally they need to be 2.05 to 2.1 mm diameter to make the wheel a tighter fit on the axle stub. 

I have a drawing of the modified axle if you need it.

 

Wouldn't a lot of that assume that the wheels don't move on their bushes when being pulled off the axles? I experimented with some scrap pannier wheels and found I couldn't be sure whether the wheel was moving on the bush or the whole lot coming off the axle whilst being pulled

[philsandy]

Wouldn't a lot of that assume that the wheels don't move on their bushes when being pulled off the axles? I experimented with some scrap pannier wheels and found I couldn't be sure whether the wheel was moving on the bush or the whole lot coming off the axle whilst being pulled

 

When you pull the wheels off the Bachmann axles sometimes the bush stays in the wheel hub, sometimes it comes off with the axle.

You need to carefully remove it off the axle and press it back in the wheel hub.

 

If the replacement axles are 2mm + 0.05 / 0.1 diameter you will get a good tight fit when you press the wheels onto them. ie. enough so they hold their quartering, but still be able to twist them on the axle to adjust the quartering if needed.

[Quarryscapes]

Thanks for your insight, I'll see if I've got any 3mm silver steel in the stores and see what I can rustle up. How do you do your quartering out of interest?

[philsandy]

Thanks for your insight, I'll see if I've got any 3mm silver steel in the stores and see what I can rustle up. How do you do your quartering out of interest?

 

I do it by eye.

 

Method I use:

 

eg. The loco has 6 driving wheels.

I glue (Araldite) one wheel on each of the 3 axles ( ie. R.H. side.) making sure they are square on the axles.

Then glue a wheel on the L.H. side on one axle only, quartering by eye. This axle with the 2 wheels glued on will be the front axle.

The 2 remaining wheels are pressed on to each of the other 2 axles, quartering by eye.

Check that all 3 axles wheels run true.

Re assemble the loco and run to check.

If any adjustment is required to correct the quartering, you only adjust the rear and/or centre wheels on the L.H. side only. ie. you are adjusting these wheels to be the same as the front  axle, where both wheels are now fixed.

 

Something I did not realise at first, is that when quartering the wheels do not have to be exactly 90 degress, but they all must be the same, for example they could be set at 89 or 91 degrees , as long as all 3 axles wheels are set at 89 or 91 degrees. 

[mike morley]

A fellow member of the MKMRS has recently successfully converted a Standard 4MT 4-6-0 simply by easing the Bachmann wheels out on their axles and plugging the gaps at the ends of the axles with plasticene.

I, meanwhile, am close to giving up attempting an EM conversion with a Comet chassis and Markits wheels.  I haven't got quite far enough to confirm it, but I have a very strong suspicion that by the time I've moved the cylinders out far enough for the crossheads to clear the crankpins of the leading drivers the loco will be several scale feet wider than the loading gauge.

[Quarryscapes]

A fellow member of the MKMRS has recently successfully converted a Standard 4MT 4-6-0 simply by easing the Bachmann wheels out on their axles and plugging the gaps at the ends of the axles with plasticene.

I, meanwhile, am close to giving up attempting an EM conversion with a Comet chassis and Markits wheels.  I haven't got quite far enough to confirm it, but I have a very strong suspicion that by the time I've moved the cylinders out far enough for the crossheads to clear the crankpins of the leading drivers the loco will be several scale feet wider than the loading gauge.

 

Yes that was what I was going to do with the 2MT originally, but didn't fancy relying on so little axle gripping the wheel. Markits wheels are too wide for my liking, and too crude looking. they were scraping the splashers of my Dean goods! 

 

Here's my test axle:

 

 

 

Probably should have shaved the bush down flush with the flange backs, would have made it a lot easier, but never mind, plenty more bits of pannier to play with! No more steel though, I just had enough to make that one! 

 

Ordered some of the requisite EMGS axles now though, will see how they go. I did also note that the 2MT tender uses extended axles of the same proportions, so they could actually be used if their ends are trimmed down. They might be useful for the Dukedog actually, if there's enough room for the wheels between the frames