UP SD40-2B

[jjb1970]

Excuse my ignorance if this is asking an obvious question, but what does the "B" signify on the SD40-2B? Is there any significant difference, is it some sort of refurb/rebuild, is it just a minor thing of no real consequence?

[tamperman36]

Is a B unit a cabless power unit ?

Edited May 29, 2016 by tamperman36

[jjb1970]

Is a B unit a cabless power unit ?

No, they have (had?) cabs and to me look just like any other SD40-2. However is it possible that they were in effect B units with the cabs not used for driving (except maybe depot/yard movements)? I really don't know.

[russ p]

It's a cabless B unit.

As a secondary question is there many B units still in service and what was the last new model by any manufacturer that offered a B unit in the range?

[jjb1970]

I think the last B units were the SF GP60Bs (at the same time I believe GE told SF they wouldn't build a Dash8-40B B unit as it wasn't worth the effort). However the UP SD40-2B's did have cabs, so they were not what I'd expect to be the B unit version.

[russ p]

If it has a cab but the road has designated it as a B the cab is not equipped for road or as we would call it mainline use. A similar situation exists on the underground where intermediate cabs are not equipped with all the systems of end cabs so as a consequence can only be used on a depot

[jjb1970]

That does seem the most logical explanation, thanks.

[Zomboid]

An image search for SD40-2B shows up what looks like quite a lot of BN (and BNSF) cabless units. And SD45-2B gives a load of ATSF (blue) cabless units. I don't know the details, but they're definitely 6 axle B units.

Of course, what UP have is a different thing, didn't get anything yellow without a cab from either.

Edited May 29, 2016 by Zomboid

[russ p]

UP had the most stunning of all B units the DD35 which was originally intended as being a cabless model only,ie two GP35s on one frame but flanked by a pair of GP35s.

GM very soon after followed it up with the DD35A which led to the legendary DD40x

Edited May 29, 2016 by russ p

[johnb]

There were a couple of SD40-2B units on BN, they were originally standard SD40-2s but were damaged in accidents and were rebuilt as cabless units. One was #7600 (I think) I did build a model of it, it must be buried somewhere safe in my storage boxes. If I can find it I'll post a phot.

 

John

Edited May 29, 2016 by johnb

[Glorious NSE]

I think this is an example I shot back in 2000:

I believe they had controls removed, so they were "B units" operationally, despite having a cab - and when you roster over 1100 SD40-2 I guess having less than 10% restricted like that isn't any big deal...

Looks like they rostered quite a few back in the late 90s though: http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/locolist.aspx?id=UP&mid=194

[pH]

CP modified some regular SD40-2s as ''B" units. One of them is the second unit in the consist in this picture:

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/41022-occasional-canadian-photos-mostly-from-vancouver-area/?p=1816159

 

I believe some were 'un-modified' back to regular units, but I wouldn't swear to that.

[russ p]

B units other than Fs were quite rare in Canada.

DRS had plans in the late 90s for a 20B shame it never happened

[buritonhampshire]

If it has a cab but the road has designated it as a B the cab is not equipped for road or as we would call it mainline use. A similar situation exists on the underground where intermediate cabs are not equipped with all the systems of end cabs so as a consequence can only be used on a depot

 

Just to clarify the situation a little. The SD40-2 'B' units were relegated to trailing unit only status - this involved the removal of cab signals, refrigerators, toilets and cab seats. (I assume that this would have allowed the units to be driven in yards but think it highly unlikely that any engineer would do it willingly; even dead stock movements are usually undertaken by coupling together.) The first units treated seemed to be in 1992 and B-units became quite common out on the road as part of a lash-up - but not leading.

 

Canadian Pacific got some second-hand units (from NS was it?) that they converted in a similar fashion but they experienced problems with staff trying to couple them in the lead or try to ride in them. They solved the problem by painting over the windows and sealing up the cabs!

 

I seem to remember that the UP treatment was because of a shortage of the necessary equipment for the cabs and was meant to be a short-term solution. Of course, this was around the time of the take-over of SP and the semi-melt down of their services in places so, as there were a lot of spare SD40 units from the C&NW and MP takeovers, not to mention lots of tunnel motors it was seen as a way of keeping 'power' on the track but meant that trailing only status was mandatory.

 

 

Roger

[russ p]

If you are making up a set of loco's it is handy if they can be moved on their own. FxB units had hostler controls so that the could be moved independently but I'm not sure about GPs and SDs apparently the DD35s didn't have them.

Interestingly the APT-P power cars had a similar system where they could move independently

[pH]

B units other than Fs were quite rare in Canada.

 

 According to this article, CP had 69 "B" units at one point - http://www.okthepk.ca/dataCprSiding/cprNews/cpNews70/92120100.htm . All but 3 had cabs and, by that time, only 2 of those were Fs. After my previous post at 15:32, I did a bit more checking and, yes, some of the SD40-2s that were converted to "B" status were later converted back to regular units.

 

Canadian Pacific got some second-hand units (from NS was it?) that they converted in a similar fashion but they experienced problems with staff trying to couple them in the lead or try to ride in them. They solved the problem by painting over the windows and sealing up the cabs! 

I think it was standard to plate up the cabs on all the CP units converted to "B" status, not just the ex-NS ones. For example - http://www.mountainrailway.com/Roster%20Archive/CP%205700/CP%205759.htm

[w124bob]

Don't forget the small fleet of MLW M420B units that BCOL ran.

[stock_2007]

So would the Geep's  CSX turned into slug-units be classed as B units as most if not all still had their cabs?

[russ p]

No, slugs don't have engines. They get power for their traction motors from the mother unit

[brian daniels]

I have seen a couple of B units over the years.

[brian daniels]

Found another one showing a CP blanked cab window job.

[Talltim]

Do like those GE B30-7ABs, not come across them before.

[pH]

Found another one showing a CP blanked cab window job.

 

That's one of the high-hood ex-NS ones (#5482). And it looks like a HLCX leaser behind it.

 

Brian, can I ask when and where that picture was taken? I saw at least one high-hood here near Vancouver and in times of CP power shortage, we used to get lots of leasers too.

[Glorious NSE]

So would the Geep's  CSX turned into slug-units be classed as B units as most if not all still had their cabs?

No, a "B Unit" is a working unit without a (working) cab.

 

A slug is a unit with working traction motors but no engine (prime mover) in it, some have a cab, some don't, depending on use. 

 

So a slug and a B unit are two different things - neither is a loco capable of working on it's own* but for two entirely different reasons.

 

Do like those GE B30-7ABs, not come across them before.

They were staple power on BN from the mid 80s to the early years of BNSF. Any mix you like of one of them with LMX Dash 8s or one of their gazillion or so SD40-2 would be a very common BN front line power lashup for the era. They had a 120 of them, which I suspect made BN by far the biggest user of "factory" B units in the 2nd Gen era.

 

It's nice to see that some have found a useful second life with regionals. 

 

Heyday pics: 

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1290367

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3327785

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1459401

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2232995

 

 

(*Every good rule needs an exception: http://www.railpictures.net/photo/452557/ )

Edited May 31, 2016 by Glorious NSE
Forgot to add Haysi F7B link...

[russ p]

There were also those C&NW Crandall cabs that were E8Bs and E9Bs rebuilt with very home made looking cabs